110 rear brakes on a D1

[fishEH]

So I feel like I heard about this here but I couldn't find anything in a quick search.

Last night I helped a buddy do a rear axle brake overhaul. SS Flex Lines, rotors, pads, bearings, and calipers.
His calipers were toast so I had him order up some 110 calipers and pads from the UK.
The biggest difference between the 110 calipers and stock D1 calipers is the pad mounting. On the D1 you have these cheesy spring clips held in place by cotter pins. The issue is the calipers get worn and the pads get all cattywampus. Even "new" remanned calipers can have this problem.
The 110 rear calipers utilize stout pins(like the D1 front) that runs through the caliper AND the pads. This keeps the pads located much more securely.

I only found one issue. Using stock D1 calipers the mud shield bracket mounts between the caliper and bolt head. Using the 110 calipers the mud shield mounts between the caliper and axle bracket. This provides the correct spacing to center the caliper/pads on the rotor.

Parts used:
STC1269 Caliper Drivers Side
STC1268 Caliper Passenger Side
STC1601 Pads
STC8576 Hardware kit
LR018026 D110 rear rotors should be used. We used stock D1 rear rotors wit h the mud shield bracket as a spacer between the caliper and axle bracket. Live and learn.

 

[Tugela]

Slick. I take it there is a performance advantage to D110 rear calipers (as there is with the front)? From where did you order the parts and how much did they cost? Cheapfuck minds want to know. I have a spare set of slotted/drilled rear rotors that I'll install when my current set wears out (probably in 2 years given how much I drive). While I'm at it I'd be tempted to upgrade the calipers. I already have D110 front calipers (that I think I bought from you), so rounding out the set would be a good plan.

 

[CORover]

So this is a direct bolt on swap? The fluid line mounts without any changes? Is there a performance improvement?

And just to make this a complete post, what's the best option for the front brakes? I have read D90 and D110 options that include hard line changes, using rear sets on the front etc. Brake booster issues, proportioning valve questions and low improvement gains.

Where did you source the parts? And what brand, I see at least 5 different suppliers of that part.

 

[p m]

Brett, any changes in the brake pedal feel?

 

[fishEH]

Parts can be sourced from your favorite supplier. The most affordable options are going to be from the UK though, Paddock, Craddock, and LRDirect. LRDirect has 6 options for calipers ranging from $31 to $241USD. https://www.lrdirect.com/STC1269-Calmper-Rear-110-Lh/?keep_https=yes Choose whatever level you're comfortable with.

Direct bolt in swap. We had the hardlines completely disconnected for the flex line replacements. So when we bolted everything back up the hardlines took a little "massaging". Nothing extreme just some tweaking by hand. Also, my buddy had previously replaced both the rear hardlines with ones he bent himself so the alignment could have been slightly off due to that. All in all the stock lines should line up A-OK.

Pad sizes looked similar and unfortunately I didn't get a chance to compare caliper piston size. I wouldn't call this a performance upgrade, just one that improves normal operation.

Pedal feel. There was definitely a change in pedal feel. Of course his old calipers each had one piston totally seized and a pad worn down to the backing plate while the other looked untouched. We also replaced the flex lines with SS ones and bled about 16 ounces of fluid through each caliper. So while there was an improvement in pedal feel I don't think its much over what a brand new D1 would have felt like.

Front brakes. D90 vs D110 fronts has been discussed quite a bit.
D90 and 110 both utilized larger pads and 46mm pistons vs the 41mm pistons found on stock D1 calipers.
The difference comes down to if you want vented rotors or not. D90 uses vented rotors, D110 uses your stock D1 rotors. My vanes on my D90 rotors got packed full mud. Others have not had this experience. Both provide performance upgrade in braking without needing a new MC, proportioning valve, booster, etc. The hardlines will need adjustment. Some have succeeded in rebending their stock lines. I find it easier to spend $12 for two straight lengths of 3/16 bubble flare with fittings already on and bend new ones.

 

[robertf]

You can't compare d90 and d110 brakes without specifying a year. For arguments sake, you want 1998 d110 brakes. The fronts are identical to the d90 brakes everyone bolts on to the disco, and the rear is the parts used in this thread

The pistons are bigger on the 110 rear calipers. Pretty sure I've got pics in the thread I did a while back

 

[p m]

You can't compare d90 and d110 brakes without specifying a year. For arguments sake, you want 1998 d110 brakes. The fronts are identical to the d90 brakes everyone bolts on to the disco, and the rear is the parts used in this thread

My main gripe with D1 rear calipers is the pad retention (or lack of). Even in this respect the calipers Brett used and provided part numbers for will be superior to D1 calipers.
But if they do provide more clamping force, it's a great bonus point. I noticed that with 110 calipers in front and stock D1 calipers in the rear the brake action is definitely biased towards the front... which is not a good thing for hillclimbs with TT front and rear.

 

[DiscoPhoto]

Why'd you use the D1 rotors?

 

[fishEH]

You can't compare d90 and d110 brakes without specifying a year. For arguments sake, you want 1998 d110 brakes. The fronts are identical to the d90 brakes everyone bolts on to the disco, and the rear is the parts used in this thread

The pistons are bigger on the 110 rear calipers. Pretty sure I've got pics in the thread I did a while back

I thought it was the 1993 NAS D110 front calipers we wanted?

Why'd you use the D1 rotors?

As opposed to?

 

[robertf]

I thought it was the 1993 NAS D110 front calipers we wanted?

Didn't 93 have drum rear brakes? So it's probably a goofy master cylinder and prop valve

A 98 uses a same bore master cylinder as the disco and I think the same proportion valve. So you at least end up with factory matched components. And the front rotors are cheap since it's the same as NAS d90 and late RRc. I think 93 uses some oddball front rotors

 

[fishEH]

Didn't 93 have drum rear brakes? So it's probably a goofy master cylinder and prop valve

A 98 uses a same bore master cylinder as the disco and I think the same proportion valve. So you at least end up with factory matched components. And the front rotors are cheap since it's the same as NAS d90 and late RRc. I think 93 uses some oddball front rotors

93 110 shows the same front rotors ar D1 according to AB.
http://www.roverparts.com/nxt/?page=1&keywords=Rotors&Dropdowndescription=Discovery+I

I'm wondering if the rear 110 rotors are different than the D1 rear rotors and the difference is the backspacing which is why we had to use the mud shield brackets as spacers??

 

[DiscoPhoto]

Photos comparing D110 and D1 rear rotors, as per your needy facebook message request

Black is D110

 

[fishEH]

Thought you didn't have any on hand?
Well that's that I guess. Use LR018026 rotors.
I'll update the original post.

Photos comparing D110 and D1 rear rotors, as per your needy facebook message request

Black is D110

 

[p m]

Brett - from the measurements, it looks like D1 rotors could be used/retained, but the caliper needs to be shimmed about 2mm inboard. What you did with the dust shield is to push it inboard by about a millimeter - it should work fine, but the user needs to remember that the brake pads should be replaced earlier than usual.

 

[CORover]

From FishEH: Thought you didn't have any on hand?
Is that on hand as in for sale? Or just laying around the garage?

 

[fishEH]

Brett - from the measurements, it looks like D1 rotors could be used/retained, but the caliper needs to be shimmed about 2mm inboard. What you did with the dust shield is to push it inboard by about a millimeter - it should work fine, but the user needs to remember that the brake pads should be replaced earlier than usual.

I just measured a shield bracket in my garage and its about 3mm, maybe slightly under with all the crust scraped off. Not really any better or worse, but wanted to be accurate. Honestly any difference in pad spacing on the rotor was indiscernable. Still best to get the D110 rotors mentioned above and not have to mess with it.

 

[p m]

I just measured a shield bracket in my garage and its about 3mm, maybe slightly under with all the crust scraped off. Not really any better or worse, but wanted to be accurate. Honestly any difference in pad spacing on the rotor was indiscernable. Still best to get the D110 rotors mentioned above and not have to mess with it.

Right.
My reasoning for using D1 rotors with 110 calipers is strictly availability. A D1's rotors can now be found at nearlt any parts store, a 110's - good luck.

 

[DiscoPhoto]

From FishEH: Thought you didn't have any on hand?
Is that on hand as in for sale? Or just laying around the garage?

I had genuine ones, not aftermarkets on hand when I first looked.

 

[fishEH]

Right.
My reasoning for using D1 rotors with 110 calipers is strictly availability. A D1's rotors can now be found at nearlt any parts store, a 110's - good luck.

That's a good point. I suppose when I do this on my truck I'll buy the 110 rear rotors and keep the shield bracket mounted between the caliper and bolt head. Then if I were ever in a pinch I could toss on D1 rotors and just switch the position of the shield bracket and be good to go.

 

[AfiRover]

Fish
I got rid of the little shield POS when I reworked the ninjas d1
I did make my own mounting bracket and weld it to the axle because buying one was a supper pain in the assssss from red winch
ran SS lines done.