Apparently, Buying a Car is Difficult...

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
I walked in to a Honda dealer in jeans and a tee shirt to buy an Accord for my wife, cash money. They told me they couldn't honor the USAA deal that's guaranteed on their website (they have a special agreement for a no hassle price) and said it would be $1,700 more. I put my checkbook back in the pocket and walked out. Should have seen the look on their faces.

It's one thing seeing it on the website, but something that really bugs me is when a discount is listed nowhere, and they just offer it out of the blue in the beginning of the conversation with no prompt whatsoever.

That's not a good sales tactic; it's a rookie move.

Sure, I'd like to pay less money, but if I've got a check for $45,000 written in my head already, what was the point of immediately offering me the product for $38,000? Of course I'll take the deal, but I would have taken the other deal, and you didn't hang in long enough to see if that was the case. It only takes a few sentences to determine whether it's a solid choice of action.

It shows me there's not enough supervision, and that management is ineffective. The sales team just doesn't care about the dealership, in that case; and that says a lot about the rest of the dealership, as well. The dealer I'm speaking with now offered me the price they had on their website; which is perfectly fine, and there are a few more incentives. That's different.

I'm talking about when a five to ten grand discount is the opening salvo. How long has that thing been on the lot?

If these buggers were actually good salesmen, I'd say the industry wasn't tired; but it's so rare to find someone that tries... Something's got to change.

I think Elon is right about how cars need to be sold, at this point.

Cheers,

Kennith
 

pinkytoe69

Well-known member
Jan 14, 2012
1,689
181
minnesota
I've got a check for $45,000 written in my head already, what was the point of immediately offering me the product for $38,000?

Trust and repeat business?

You get the warm fuzzy feeling that this guy will throw you a bone and not fuck you over if you are in the market again.
 

Blueboy

Well-known member
Apr 20, 2004
3,205
459
Back in the USA; Rockwood, PA
What you are experiencing is what Carvana and the like are basing their business model on. Have not tried it as yet however if it works seems like it would be an alternative avenue.
 

brian4d

Well-known member
Dec 3, 2007
6,499
67
High Point, NC
What you are experiencing is what Carvana and the like are basing their business model on. Have not tried it as yet however if it works seems like it would be an alternative avenue.

You beat me to it, I was going to mention Carvana to Kennith. People don't want to sit in a dealership from 9am until 3pm. People got shit to do.
 
  • Like
Reactions: kennith and Blueboy

brian4d

Well-known member
Dec 3, 2007
6,499
67
High Point, NC
It's one thing seeing it on the website, but something that really bugs me is when a discount is listed nowhere, and they just offer it out of the blue in the beginning of the conversation with no prompt whatsoever.

That's not a good sales tactic; it's a rookie move.

Sure, I'd like to pay less money, but if I've got a check for $45,000 written in my head already, what was the point of immediately offering me the product for $38,000? Of course I'll take the deal, but I would have taken the other deal, and you didn't hang in long enough to see if that was the case. It only takes a few sentences to determine whether it's a solid choice of action.

It shows me there's not enough supervision, and that management is ineffective. The sales team just doesn't care about the dealership, in that case; and that says a lot about the rest of the dealership, as well. The dealer I'm speaking with now offered me the price they had on their website; which is perfectly fine, and there are a few more incentives. That's different.

I'm talking about when a five to ten grand discount is the opening salvo. How long has that thing been on the lot?

If these buggers were actually good salesmen, I'd say the industry wasn't tired; but it's so rare to find someone that tries... Something's got to change.

I think Elon is right about how cars need to be sold, at this point.

Cheers,

Kennith

It's the same thing Hobby Lobby, Kohl's, Target and Bed Bath and Beyond do. If you mark up the price 25% as it hits the shelf you instantly have wiggle room. Management doesn't give a shit because that's not the number that's worked into their bottom line price, the lower value is what they go on. They get that it's just gravy. It creates a chaotic sales atmosphere in many areas of business.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Howski

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
Trust and repeat business?

You get the warm fuzzy feeling that this guy will throw you a bone and not fuck you over if you are in the market again.

Yeah, but you can do even better if you manage your time well. This is an "artificial" way to do it.

The correct way is to wait until the time is right. I'll run down some of what has impressed me about the DC salesman in a while. He's nailed everything.

Doesn't matter what happens, at this point. He's getting my highest form of review; and that's not easy to earn, because it's pretty involved, actually.

The dude's an exceptional salesman who could function at any point in human history. He deserves the effort, on my part.

Cheers,

Kennith
 

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
Apparently, this is the car in question:

VW1.JPG

It doesn't come in any color I really get a kick out of, so I figure it's best looking at the one that will age it the least over time. If I can't stand it, that's an easy excuse for a wrap. Matte would work wonders on any metallic white. As a result, if I end up with this vehicle, I will certainly do my best to absolutely despise that color. :ROFLMAO:

I suppose I'll make the final decision on Monday, at this point; though I did put down a small deposit so their time isn't wasted if I go another way.

Cheers,

Kennith
 
Last edited:

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
So, why the gripe about ordering at all? A few may be wondering.

When you order a car like this, you can have generally whatever you like. You can get the Autobahn navigation package without the leather and without push-button start, you can have the cool looking LED headlights without driver assistance, and so on. Ordering is the only way to get just the options you want, with none of the stuff you don't.

Not every manufacturer does that; certainly not in this price range, but VW will let you spec out a GTI almost however you like.

For most people, it would look like a waste of money to pay for leather and not get it; but that's looking at it backwards for some buyers. VW wisely lets buyers choose to opt out of the black leather in favor of plaid, or install higher line features on lower line cars.

No dealer with any sense orders a car like that, so once orders are done with... You're out of luck.

Not everything is easy to swap in. Navigation might not actually be too hard on one of these, though. I did see a company selling the units for retrofit. Ain't cheap, but it would make the TV in the dash do something useful.

Cheers,

Kennith
 

jymmiejamz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2004
6,008
361
35
Los Angeles, Ca
It's one thing seeing it on the website, but something that really bugs me is when a discount is listed nowhere, and they just offer it out of the blue in the beginning of the conversation with no prompt whatsoever.

I never understand why places do that. When I bought my wife's Rolex I emailed the place and told them which one I wanted. The guy immediately mailed me back saying he could do it $600 cheaper. I don't read into it much and appreciate the discount, but I didn't even consider that a discount was even on the table.
 
  • Like
Reactions: kennith

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
You beat me to it, I was going to mention Carvana to Kennith. People don't want to sit in a dealership from 9am until 3pm. People got shit to do.

I'm in the camp that just wants a menu and a pickup date.

I do like showrooms, but I think it's time we admitted that the highest and best use of labor in a showroom would be concierges trained in each vehicle and the available options. Stop making them sell cars, and instead extend your brand and marketing directly into the purchase experience.

Right now, there is little difference between dealerships so far as the buying experience itself is concerned. They're leaving a lot of branding on the table.

Companies like Land Rover have tried to step well beyond that, and occasionally hit the nail right on the head; but you can still smell the nonsensical industry holding them back. The car dealership business model is threadbare in the light of modern technology and expectations.

Cheers,

Kennith
 

Maximumwarp

Well-known member
Mar 22, 2015
836
26
Fairburn GA
The thing that always irritates me is when I know more about the product than the person selling it. Yes, it’s the 21st century and it’s easier than ever to be an informed consumer. But like. You need to know your product inside and out. Be able to speak intelligently about it. Maybe give a shit, even. That turns me off as a buyer because it makes me feel like the presence of the sales person is completely unnecessary. In the case of buying a car, just go away and let me talk directly to the mysterious employee in finance that they go run to every time you have a question anyways.
 
  • Like
Reactions: stu454

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
The thing that always irritates me is when I know more about the product than the person selling it. Yes, it’s the 21st century and it’s easier than ever to be an informed consumer. But like. You need to know your product inside and out. Be able to speak intelligently about it. Maybe give a shit, even. That turns me off as a buyer because it makes me feel like the presence of the sales person is completely unnecessary.

If I don't know something when I walk in, I ain't gonna know it when I walk out no matter how many questions I ask. It's a waste of time to expect them to have anything beyond cursory knowledge of the vehicles they sell. It's easy to forget that they have no relationship with the vehicle manufacturer or overarching brand; quite a bit less than a burger-flipper has with McDonalds corporate, anyway.

They're hired guns for a guy who buys in bulk and slaps his badge on the deck lid.

In the case of buying a car, just go away and let me talk directly to the mysterious employee in finance that they go run to every time you have a question anyways.

Here's the best part:

They're not doing shit back there beyond killing time while you wait a bit. That is no manner of speculation, mind you. It's in industry training manuals. What people suspect is going on in car dealerships isn't half as bad as reality. The lies and manipulation aren't illusions; they're accepted and demanded practice.

When someone's actually good at it, though, it's impressive. If they take that dull, rusty sword and manage to put a sharp edge on it, things get a lot more interesting. You're not going to meet too many of them, because they end up quitting. It takes an honest man to actually master those techniques, and such a man refuses to be bound by their requirements.

Cheers,

Kennith
 
Last edited:

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
While I prefer this vehicle to the replacement coming soon, the 8th generation Golf R will probably be one nasty beast. I think a traditional GTI should be more like this; more simple, but the R is a different story. That should indeed have fancy tech and basically be a point and shoot, rocket-powered micro machine.

It's just not the same sort of vehicle.

That's why I'll forgive that AMG wagon for the complication. Something like that is supposed to be the height of technology.

Cheers,

Kennith
 

Blueboy

Well-known member
Apr 20, 2004
3,205
459
Back in the USA; Rockwood, PA
but VW will let you spec out a GTI almosthowever you like

Yes; and that has been their sales philosophy on their vehicles over the years. Porsche does the same - base car that you can option out the way you want. Of course there are + / - to this concept.
 

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
Looks like I'm getting a Golf GTI. They said the paperwork should show up tomorrow.

So, here's how it went:

1: Forgot.

2: Outback

3: Ridgeline

3.1: Restore DII.

4: AEV Prospector

5: AMG Wagon

6: Fuck it. I need something now and can't make up my mind. Golf GTI. :ROFLMAO:

I still get to restore the DII, and I haven't put myself out of anything else.

Cheers,

Kennith
 
  • Like
Reactions: SGaynor

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
Well, now's the time. I'm about to write the check and mail it off... I've never driven this generation of Golf, and I've never seen the color in person. I've certainly not seen this specific car in person.

I guess I'll have it sometime next week. We'll see if I like the thing. I've backed myself so far into a corner that it really doesn't matter, at this point. :)

This will take a lot of pressure off me finishing other things up. I've only got so much energy to go around right now, and I can't keep up with everything I have to do. So, now I'll be able to spare some to actually maintain and improve things again without giving up training time.

Cheers,

Kennith
 

jymmiejamz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2004
6,008
361
35
Los Angeles, Ca
I do like showrooms, but I think it's time we admitted that the highest and best use of labor in a showroom would be concierges trained in each vehicle and the available options.

Salesmen are horrible at understanding the feature of cars in my experience. Now we have encore specialists that come to your house a week or two after you bought the car to help show you how everything works and answer any questions you have about the vehicle.
 
  • Like
Reactions: p m

p m

Administrator
Staff member
Apr 19, 2004
15,617
837
58
La Jolla, CA
www.3rj.org
Salesmen are horrible at understanding the feature of cars in my experience. Now we have encore specialists that come to your house a week or two after you bought the car to help show you how everything works and answer any questions you have about the vehicle.
Imagine buying a new Defender ...
"Sir... I am not sure you really appreciate this side-window-mounted shitbox."
 

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
Salesmen are horrible at understanding the feature of cars in my experience. Now we have encore specialists that come to your house a week or two after you bought the car to help show you how everything works and answer any questions you have about the vehicle.

This industry is toxic, and must be reorganized. I really hope Tesla punches a hole in all of it, and I hope others follow suit. It wasn't too long ago that dealerships somewhere in Texas flipped out when Tesla tried to open a showroom using their more modern business model.

That was bullshit. Why should anyone have to bow to the pressure of useless people? They're gutter trash, in my opinion; and that runs all the way up the chain of command. They're just a bunch of dirtbags hiring other dirtbags to lie and cheat. The same goes for the real estate industry.

Nearly any other business would be forced into closure and ripped to shreds via lawsuits for that behavior, and I hope I live to see the day they're all on the side of the road begging for pennies to feed their children. The world sucks because people puss out and tolerate bullshit.

Cheers,

Kennith