GM 8.2 I Believe, and How Would You Finish Cleaning It?

[kennith]

Maybe more interest in the marque.

Never the less the work you’re doing looks really nice.

I think it's just a matter of people not writing stuff down and half-assing, followed by a generation of "common knowledge" that's not all that accurate.

Regardless, I'll have to contact Right Stuff about those brake lines. They may be for a 10 bolt, but the car was available with a 12 bolt in both 1966 (when this axle was made) and 1967 (when this car was made). The quality is high, but they're too long, though the bends appear to be in roughly the right place. They also may not clear the mounts and hit the retention tabs at the same time even if I cut them; but I'd rather not have to flare and bend stainless tube. I don't have the tools for that anyway, and the shit from Autozone and places of that nature don't work too well.

Hopefully they'll tell me a different part number is meant to be used, and these are for the 10 bolt. The seem much closer when held up to the axle on the car, which didn't even come with the car. They (and everyone else) just lists them by year and model. That's not good enough when multiple axles were offered, and what's the point of pre-bent tube if I've still got to bend and flare it?

Eh. I'll figure it out on Tuesday, I suppose, but I was hoping to already have them installed.

It'll be most efficient to remove the pinion nut with an impact gun, so I'll have to borrow an electric unit on Tuesday from the guy next door. Hopefully marking is enough to get it back on there right, because I don't have the stuff to do any better.

If I detect that it needs internal work after that point, it's not a big deal. There's a guy in town with all the bending stuff if those lines need adjustment, and he also has what's required to sort the internal stuff if it needs work. I won't know until I fill it and really get it up and spinning. I'll probably end up doing it anyway, just for good measure.

Hell, it may be possible to get a caliper on that crush sleeve and match it with one of the shim-equipped replacements. Either way I can't get to all those bearings easily with what I have on hand. I'll try to get a current shot of it with a wheel on so progress can be seen, but today I'll see if I have all the stuff to put the brakes together on one side. I already have the wheel cylinder installed.

Not keen on how it fits in there, but that's all that's available. Nearby tabs (may be present to prevent pistons from coming out) are pressing into the boots, but apparently that's fine. It seems stupid to me, though.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Well, here she is after the first coat of what was supposed to be matte black. I'm finally satisfied that it cured enough to take the wheels back off.

I'll have to find something else for the follow up coats, because if that's matte black I'm the queen of England.

I'm working on finding the last few parts for the brakes now, and I'll spray it again a few days before installation, but it looks like it'll be a couple of weeks before I have everything I need and get it installed on the axle housing. I really would like to slap those drums together, but I need to get some of the pins that go over the pistons in the wheel cylinders.

EDIT: I found the old pins behind the building, cleaned them, treated for rust, buffed them up and blued the things. It was too much hassle to get replacements. That finish will hold a bit of grease no matter what happens, so they'll be just as good as plated in that environment.

Still not convinced the wheel cylinder (one showed up seized) is fitting right, but that's what's specified. Specified for what? Who knows. It's on there anyway. If I find out something else is available, I'll remove and replace it. I did hit it with caliper paint to prevent corrosion. You can see that one peeking out of the right side backing plate.



The final shots will be better and bigger. All these have been for the axle's "build log", which will be typed up as a PDF and small enough to print or view on any screen without taking up a bunch of drive space, and efficient enough to send via e-mail.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Well, I was right again. The Chevrolet industry and a good portion of the community are full of morons.

They've all been consistently wrong. There were many issues along the way with the vehicle, but the brakes have been an annoyance.

As soon as I run the calculations for hydraulic ratios and locate an appropriate part, I'll likely be the only person that knows the answer.

...and you know what? I'll take it to my grave. I've no respect for that community, at this point. None at all.

Incidentally, scratch Raybestos off your list as a part supplier. They were the most ignorant, most lazy, and most impolite of everyone I contacted. They don't know their ass from a hole in the ground. Fucking lazy idiots.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Done. I've got my wheel cylinders, and I'll never tell another soul which part number they are, because it'll just start more arguments with those morons.

They can keep installing the wrong parts, writing about the wrong parts in books, looking up the wrong parts in catalogs, making videos and instructional diagrams using the wrong parts, and placing their brake balance at risk as a result. Won't keep me up at night. Bunch of ungrateful bastards; the lot of them.

That's my math. If they want to know what's what, they'll have to brush up on basic hydraulics; you know, like a human would.

Never trust anyone in relation to Chevrolet parts; not even me. Do your own work, instead, and pretend you're sorting through batches of universal stuff. You'll have a better result all around, that way, I assure you.

Looks like I've got to wait a bit to put the stuff together, as I'm still measuring springs and links just to be sure, and the kits didn't come with them all. Moreover, I think I want to put the parking brake stuff in beforehand. Those are a pain in the ass, and I don't want to have to take the brakes apart if I can't get it in there on the car.

So, it looks like I'll just be staring at it until Monday, with various parts kits laying around as I pull the appropriate bits from each one to put together something that works properly. I've still got more hunting ahead.

I found it annoying that Inline Tube was equally as ignorant as everyone else, because they offer stainless parking brake lines. They are supposed to have them for both the '66 and '67; though they're probably wrong, anyway. Of course, they say they have them in the catalog, but they don't; and they have no idea how to find them.

Still have to get back on the horn with Right Stuff about their own stupidity. The best thing I got out of them was bragging about how their stuff was so great. That kind of reminds me of my recent conversations with Rover V8 builders. If you're doing something and you don't know why, you shouldn't be doing it.

It's a hard line designed to fit an axle that was made in the millions, with fixed points of attachment. There's no excuse.

They don't actually know the parts they're dealing with. They don't know the variants, and can't understand why that's a problem. Your catalog is about as valuable as used toilet paper. It's your understanding that matters.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[SGaynor]

 

[kennith]

That's pretty much how I was feeling about it yesterday. I may or may not have been a touch frustrated...

Normally I wouldn't care, but I've not been in too great a condition myself, and I just lost my patience with them temporarily.

Honestly, though, I've never had this much trouble with parts in my life; anywhere.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[SGaynor]

That's pretty much how I was feeling about it yesterday. I may or may not have been a touch frustrated...

Normally I wouldn't care, but I've not been in too great a condition myself, and I just lost my patience with them temporarily.

Honestly, though, I've never had this much trouble with parts in my life; anywhere.

Cheers,

Kennith

I remember having a Chevy pickup 20 years ago where I had to specify a composite rotor (two types of metal, not just one solid steel) because of some option that was put on the truck. Only a small percentage had it, so every time I needed rotors, it was a hassle to find them.

I think that was a consequence of GM being so big - way too many options, variants, parts cross used on different vehicles (but with slight cost saving changes over the course of a model).

Growing up a friend of my dad's restored Corvettes. I remember running into him at a parts store because the grease fitting he got from them was the wrong COLOR - only blue ones were used from '67-'70, not the green one he got - that was for '71-'74 (or whatever color/year it was). I thought the guy was insane.

 

[kennith]

I remember having a Chevy pickup 20 years ago where I had to specify a composite rotor (two types of metal, not just one solid steel) because of some option that was put on the truck. Only a small percentage had it, so every time I needed rotors, it was a hassle to find them.

I think that was a consequence of GM being so big - way too many options, variants, parts cross used on different vehicles (but with slight cost saving changes over the course of a model).

Growing up a friend of my dad's restored Corvettes. I remember running into him at a parts store because the grease fitting he got from them was the wrong COLOR - only blue ones were used from '67-'70, not the green one he got - that was for '71-'74 (or whatever color/year it was). I thought the guy was insane.

I'm over here trying to figure out who the heck would have wanted 11" drums on the rear of a car.

I think it must have been a towing package, but I'm planning on fitting a removable receiver mount between the frame rails, anyway. A little time on the brake and drill press next door, and I can say it'll tow a camper. Otherwise, I'd have probably gone a touch smaller to better balance things.

Right now I'm trying to decide if I want to go down 1/16" in bore on the rear wheel cylinders. There are benefits and drawbacks.

You're right about the issue, and it was a massive problem that eventually lead to GM's demise. It just baffles me that the information hasn't been put back together in all this time. It's not as if people haven't had a chance, and it's not as if they haven't claimed to have done so.

What blows my mind is that I just now remembered that Rolls Royce used this axle, and probably these very brakes. I'll bet it could have been handled in one order without a hitch from a Rolls parts distributor. That one's on me. I should have thought about it more.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Oh, now this is really, really pissing me off. All I want is a fucking set of parking brake levers, now.

Can I have the dimensions on the site because everyone but me is wrong? Nope. Can I call and explain it to someone that can understand language? Nope. Can I call NAPA and expect to have them find the damned things? Nope. Only half of them knew what a parking brake lever was, and none of them knew what a strut bar was.

I'll have to ransack the storage rooms again, and they weren't too happy the last time I demanded it.

Fuck Chevrolet, the Chevrolet community, all the hicks that think they know anything about them; fuck the engine builders (engine builders in general, actually), the brake and axle specialists, the restoration shops, the entire after-market... Fuck Classic Industries, Impala Bob's, Summit Racing... Fuck everyone.

None of them know what they're talking about.

It'll cost me at least fifty bucks to clean up the levers and strut bars I've got, and take days or I'll have to pay more for blasting, and I won't have the small hardware required to install them. I'll have to order individual washers and shit online again, and that's a headache in itself. What am I supposed to do with this shit? It's going to take six fucking months to get what I need; something that should be on every part store shelf in the nation.

Oh, I'm sorry, it's not their inbred uncle's Camaro, so why would the parts be available? "It's the same as the..." No it's not, ass-hats. You're all running the wrong shit.

Converting to discs now may force removal of the backing plates, which required a fair bit of cash and effort to look like that, and would waste all the money I spent on the other stuff. I'm not going to be able to return it all individually because the interchange numbers line up, and it was a bunch of small purchases to get it all.

The damned car will seize up by the time I get these brakes sorted, but if I drop discs on the rear, it's mandatory front fitment, and that's a whole different can of worms, because everything this side of the BAER SS4+ kit sucks. It's all crap.

I may well have to spend near $2,000 on brake upgrades and lose the backing plate aesthetic entirely just to have any new brakes at all.

Of course, Right Stuff doesn't have any idea what's going on with those rear lines, either. Maybe they'll get back to me eventually, maybe not. You can throw a part number at me all you want, but when you're wrong, you're wrong. That explains why I see so many poorly bent hard lines on these axles. Nobody is fitting the... Right Stuff...

I'm tired of people in general, at this point. Everyone's lazy, and that includes all the dolts that like to complain about younger generations. Hell, they're actually worse. Your job is to pick up the phone and know what your talking about, or at the very least be patient enough to learn. That's it. If you can't do that, at this point, take a long walk off a short pier. You have no value to society at all. If it was legal, I'd run you over with a car and smile about it all night while picking your teeth out of the radiator.

...and no. I'm not taking this one back as a little bit of a frustrated rant. I mean every word I'm typing, and I'm in a perfectly calm mood.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Just spoke with Summit again, who's representative this time insisted that plating is the exact same thickness as paint, and the same hardness...

The next human that tells me in person that I don't know what this axle came out of is getting knocked the fuck out right then and there. I think I might have run myself out of time to finish the car dealing with this crap. I'll have to check the schedule to see whether or not it's even possible to finish it up by the time I need it done.

Looks like the rusty shit may be going back in there. The only other option I can think of is ceramic powder. Paint isn't going to cut it.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Eh, I got lucky.

I went down to the powder shop to pick up a Rover V8 intake manifold (funny thread coming) and they just happened to be about to shoot something that would work. So, I just dropped off all the brake parts I can't buy, and was able to get it done for free, considering I'd just had an intake manifold coated simply to see how I liked the color. They should be ready tomorrow, I think.

That's a problem solved, but damn. This Chevy industry is ass-backwards, and the part sellers don't know what they're talking about.

While I was down there, I watched them dip a motorcycle... wind cowl thing or whatever in plaid. I was just about to make a few jokes about the customer's decision, and then I realized what color I had the intake manifold coated... I didn't have much room to make fun of the guy.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Well, I should have time to try and make this stuff work over the next couple of days. Hopefully tonight I can get the different wheel cylinders on and then start putting the brakes back together. I should have almost everything I need now.

Looks like I'll have to modify those hard lines or just make some, but whatever. I'll figure something out. Hopefully it'll look nice, as I'm not particularly good at bending metal tube.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[Blueboy]

and then I realized what color I had the intake manifold coated.

And what color is it??

Of course pics!!

 

[kennith]

And what color is it??

Of course pics!!

It's in the tech section with it's own thread. The first post has a picture. You'll need to just go look to get the full effect.

Haven't had a chance to get to the brakes on this axle yet, but I expect I'll have one done this week unless I run into another issue.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Back on it.

I'll have some shots of the new brake lines on the 12 bolt soon, as well as a before and after once I give it a less glossy top coat. The drums are assembled, now, which was a nightmare as nobody knows what parts go in them. I had to look all over the place to get it right, but this particular 12 bolt is set up like GM set it up in 1966. Had to modify some old stuff, find new stuff suggested for other cars entirely...

I'd wager it is the ONLY rebuilt 12 bolt that's set up right, using the right parts. Period. That entire community is wrong about... Well, nearly everything.

The stainless lines could not be made to fit, and Inline Tube has no idea what they're talking about, so I had to bend my own; which isn't exactly my best skill, but the result is decent, I think.

After this, I'll never ask another classic American car enthusiast another question for the duration of my days. All you get is a long trip down the wrong road.

If you fuck with cars like that and have an issue, use your brain instead of your mouth. Nobody can answer your question, and they'll all either pretend they know and give you the wrong information, or just parrot what their daddy said like it's actually worth something. Then it's the "I've had good luck with this part..." nonsense.

Well, of course you have. You did it once in your life, and that was three weeks ago. Ass-hats.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Well, here she blows; one side, anyway. I decided to adjust the other. The housing is being prepped left to right for the final coat, so it looks a bit odd.

I think the bends turned out pretty good, as I'm not overly confident in my tube bending skills. I kind of suck at it. It does wrap around the tube where it's supposed to on the left, but for some reason that doesn't really show up.




It's fitting fine. It doesn't move and won't contact the axle, but I'll still be adding some protective sleeves just in case someone bends it; to prevent abrasion down the line. I hope this thing lasts another fifty years without issue. That's really the goal.

I'm slowly prepping the tube from left to right for the final coat. There are other finishes present, such as the backing plates, but that tube is better protected than GM could have dreamed, at this point. It got the works.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Both sides at once:



I think it follows the contours well enough for what I expected.

Some protective sleeves (air tube) are covering it up in a few small areas. Thought I'd insulate it just in case, and where the axle clips grab it.

The top isn't as far up as it looks in the picture. That's there so the differential can be maintained without fucking with the brakes.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kennith]

Next up, it's time to pull the differential completely to:

1: Make sure it's spotless in there one more time.

2: Ensure that those gears are in good condition for the long haul.

3: Adjust as required for as good a mesh as I can get.

4: I was saving those last bearings for when it wouldn't be a mess. They're safe to use, but it's not hard to swap them out.

I could rebuild a Posi and drop it in there, but there are a couple of problems with that:

1: The axle becomes even more valuable just by itself. Installing it on the car doesn't max the value of the assembly. It's already worth a fair bit and an easy sale.

2: That leaves the buyer with nothing to do on the axle minus a disc conversion. While moving to a Posi won't cost me much at all, cutting out things that can be customized to the buyer's taste on a "project vehicle" is not a good idea sometimes.

It won't be sold with real door panels, as an example. I'm just going to make some hardboard panels and install them. Might upholster them in black vinyl, but that's as far as I'll go. They need to be able to buy the interior components themselves. The seats are that way, as well. It might be sold as a column shift with buckets if I can't find a better seat. I'm not about to restore what's in it.

Same thing goes for bodywork. Most of it is fine, but it's got dings and so on here and there, and some easy rust areas that I won't fix beyond basic bodywork I can do myself without breaking a proper sweat.

If I give them nothing to do, it won't be fun. Much as I hate it, I'll spray the dash tan as people want. That requires too much disassembly for the average person, and I'm already halfway there. Popping the windshield to take pictures of the frame (it's solid), anyway. That makes it an easy paint job in that spot, where it would normally be incredibly difficult.

If I can find time with the welder/weldor/whatever, we'll do the A/C conversion. The firewall section and vents are all that's holding me back, there; because I can't weld for shit. I can handle the rest over a couple of weeks. That's the biggest value-add you can do on one of these. Just having the parts and the panels is a bonus, but if I can actually get it converted to factory air...

Yeah, that makes a huge fucking difference.

Cheers,

Kennith