But why?
Roy McAvoy to David Simms: "You ever shoot par with a 7 iron?"
David Simms: "Hell Roy, it never occurred to me to try."
Maglite is the Worst Flashlight on the Market
- Thread starter kennith
- Start date
But why?
Roy McAvoy to David Simms: "You ever shoot par with a 7 iron?"
David Simms: "Hell Roy, it never occurred to me to try."
Newsflash: A flashlight is a tool. A truck is a tool.
You're proposing that as long as something accomplishes the bare minimum, it's good enough, which is bullshit unless your standards are so low as for that to be acceptable. Cheapfucks.
You're proposing that as long as something accomplishes the bare minimum, it's good enough, which is bullshit unless your standards are so low as for that to be acceptable. Cheapfucks.
I've never been accused of being a cheapskate, and I'll happily buy quality products.
What I won't do, however, is support this snake oil obsession with building flashlights like Legos and convincing people there's some secret industry that makes the good stuff. Nearly all of it is coming from the same place.
My "Camel Inflators" are better than ARB pumps. They're better than Viair pumps, as well; and I was selling them for $100 and making fifty bucks off each unit. I never even branded the things. It was primarily a mix and match job, but I did aid them in a new crank design. That said, even without that crank, it would have been the same parts in a different configuration and would only have slightly missed the specs I wanted.
It would have been plenty good for a shelf, and with branding, would have sold for $250 or more.
They're doing the same thing with flashlights. Pick out your parts from trade shows and catalogs, and screw them all together. Bin your LEDs if you want, but that doesn't change where it's coming from. Cree makes more dog shit than they do caviar, and even their good stuff ends up in budget lights.
I'm not paying $100 for a light made with the same Asian crap as a $30 light; that won't even last as long as a $2 Eveready, and I'm not paying $250 for what should be a $50 light, either. I wouldn't buy my own damned compressor for the price I was charging.
There's nothing wrong with a Jeep, either. It's a cheaper way to enjoy just as much of the nation. Perhaps not the world, but most people stick to trails and "overlanding" in their back yards.
Tools? Snap On can kiss my ass with most of their stuff. I have that fancy digital torque wrench, but even that is sold under different labels. S-K, Gearwrench, and most tools from Taiwan are just as good if not better at times.
Buy good stuff that lasts, but don't think you have to pay a fortune for everything. You don't, and quite often you can find US made stuff that's reasonably priced, such as Span-Set tie-down products.
Let's see... I just got back from dicking around trying to figure out how to burn a giant, spread out pile of wood. When I walked in, I was wearing about $1,500 without the bling. With it... Well, that necklace is worth a fortune, but it doesn't entirely count. Gold value and labor came to about $1,000, so that's $2,500 I was wearing in a bush-hogged field sweating my ass off.
Trust me. When something's worth buying, I'll pay for it. When it's pointless, I won't.
Spend all you want on a light. I've got old software framed in my home office that I paid way too much for. Don't think for a second, however, that you're necessarily supporting the sort of businesses you think you're supporting, or that such a light is required.
You're stepping out of objectivity and into subjectivity. That's fine, so long as you realize it, and so long as you don't direct others down that path as if it's an established and required thoroughfare.
I maintain that the Nebo Slyde King is the best utility flashlight on the market today; at any price.
Cheers,
Kennith
What I won't do, however, is support this snake oil obsession with building flashlights like Legos and convincing people there's some secret industry that makes the good stuff. Nearly all of it is coming from the same place.
My "Camel Inflators" are better than ARB pumps. They're better than Viair pumps, as well; and I was selling them for $100 and making fifty bucks off each unit. I never even branded the things. It was primarily a mix and match job, but I did aid them in a new crank design. That said, even without that crank, it would have been the same parts in a different configuration and would only have slightly missed the specs I wanted.
It would have been plenty good for a shelf, and with branding, would have sold for $250 or more.
They're doing the same thing with flashlights. Pick out your parts from trade shows and catalogs, and screw them all together. Bin your LEDs if you want, but that doesn't change where it's coming from. Cree makes more dog shit than they do caviar, and even their good stuff ends up in budget lights.
I'm not paying $100 for a light made with the same Asian crap as a $30 light; that won't even last as long as a $2 Eveready, and I'm not paying $250 for what should be a $50 light, either. I wouldn't buy my own damned compressor for the price I was charging.
There's nothing wrong with a Jeep, either. It's a cheaper way to enjoy just as much of the nation. Perhaps not the world, but most people stick to trails and "overlanding" in their back yards.
Tools? Snap On can kiss my ass with most of their stuff. I have that fancy digital torque wrench, but even that is sold under different labels. S-K, Gearwrench, and most tools from Taiwan are just as good if not better at times.
Buy good stuff that lasts, but don't think you have to pay a fortune for everything. You don't, and quite often you can find US made stuff that's reasonably priced, such as Span-Set tie-down products.
Let's see... I just got back from dicking around trying to figure out how to burn a giant, spread out pile of wood. When I walked in, I was wearing about $1,500 without the bling. With it... Well, that necklace is worth a fortune, but it doesn't entirely count. Gold value and labor came to about $1,000, so that's $2,500 I was wearing in a bush-hogged field sweating my ass off.
Trust me. When something's worth buying, I'll pay for it. When it's pointless, I won't.
Spend all you want on a light. I've got old software framed in my home office that I paid way too much for. Don't think for a second, however, that you're necessarily supporting the sort of businesses you think you're supporting, or that such a light is required.
You're stepping out of objectivity and into subjectivity. That's fine, so long as you realize it, and so long as you don't direct others down that path as if it's an established and required thoroughfare.
I maintain that the Nebo Slyde King is the best utility flashlight on the market today; at any price.
Cheers,
Kennith
I've looked at these Nebo's online. They get a lot of shitty reviews - the most common being something along the lines of "stops charging after X weeks."
You should still try one if you're in the market for a utility light.
I know plenty of people that have them, and that hasn't been an issue. Most bought them after using mine.
Mine stays in cars, I leave it outside in the rain on occasion, it's been dropped... Lots of stuff. I have more than the Slyde King, and they've all been fine.
Not only does it still charge, it holds a charge like you wouldn't believe. Most of it's charging has been hooking it up to a computer every now and again. It's like my HP Elite X3 phone. That thing holds a charge so long you forget to charge it. :rofl:
Now, everyone makes a few duds. Those are the complaints, as negativity spreads faster than positivity. I'm sure Nebo has a few more than Surefire, but I've had to return more Surefire lights than cheap lights. Nobody I know has had to return a Nebo.
They'd have been better off with a different branding strategy, but whatever. "Nebo" doesn't seem to be getting in the way. I just think something a little more interesting and impactful would accelerate their growth as a brand.
Mind you, they're private labeling Chinese stuff, as well; but they do design a fair bit of it from as scratch as reasonable, which is more than I can say for manufacturers charging three times as much.
Cheers,
Kennith
You shouldn't, but thankfully some do verify that durability, among other things, match product claims.
No, because I'm rarely working on something with a hammer that is SO important, I must do it under those circumstances.
And I don't fumble around looking for anything when the power goes out, since (some of) the lights still work without grid power. Same as the refrigerators and the garage door opener.
Since I didn't spend way too much money on a flashlight, I had money available to spend on power backup so the food in 2 refrigerators and a freezer doesn't spoil.
I suppose it's simply a matter of prioritizing where I allocate my finite resources.
It's simple. I've had many of both. The cheapfuck ones always break first and never work as well for a given task. The name brands break too, but less often, and replacement parts are sent no question.
Claiming all Chinese lights are made from the same shit Chinese parts makes the massively stupid assumption that all Chinese parts are of equal shit quality. In reality, the quality of Chinese goods varies tremendously as do price points. To claim otherwise doesn't reflect the reality of manufacturing in any country. In addition, some lights are assembled with a mix of China, Japan, and USA made components.
Different uses need different lights. Cheapfuck lights are useless trying to match specs to a given use as the specs are bullshit. 4000 lumens from a $20 light, really? Maybe I only need 100 lumens for a task, but how do I know that's even accurate when the common practice discerning cheapfuck lights is to take claimed lumen output and divide by 10? The well-founded doubt applies for all other specs you'd want to know about a light too. Map reading, hiking, EDC, working under a truck, running, diving, spotting, etc. are matched to lights with varying features and specs. Kennith claims name brand light specs are bullshit too, but misses the obvious plethora of reviews tearing down, measuring, and verifying claims. Some of those claims are in fact found to be bullshit, but more often than cheapfuck lights, they're found to be accurate.
Sure, if you're just searching for the TV remote, buy anything, but don't expect it to last or get support when it doesn't.
Claiming all Chinese lights are made from the same shit Chinese parts makes the massively stupid assumption that all Chinese parts are of equal shit quality. In reality, the quality of Chinese goods varies tremendously as do price points. To claim otherwise doesn't reflect the reality of manufacturing in any country. In addition, some lights are assembled with a mix of China, Japan, and USA made components.
Different uses need different lights. Cheapfuck lights are useless trying to match specs to a given use as the specs are bullshit. 4000 lumens from a $20 light, really? Maybe I only need 100 lumens for a task, but how do I know that's even accurate when the common practice discerning cheapfuck lights is to take claimed lumen output and divide by 10? The well-founded doubt applies for all other specs you'd want to know about a light too. Map reading, hiking, EDC, working under a truck, running, diving, spotting, etc. are matched to lights with varying features and specs. Kennith claims name brand light specs are bullshit too, but misses the obvious plethora of reviews tearing down, measuring, and verifying claims. Some of those claims are in fact found to be bullshit, but more often than cheapfuck lights, they're found to be accurate.
Sure, if you're just searching for the TV remote, buy anything, but don't expect it to last or get support when it doesn't.
Last edited:
What I'm claiming is that the same bullshit that applies to "Carbine Enthusiasts" applies to "Flashlight Enthusiasts".
I'm correct.
As soon as people start talking about EDC, it's time to tune them out. It's noise on top of irrelevance.
I've been into LEDs for a long time. I literally own the first retail sold LED flashlight. When I heard it was showing up, I was standing outside the debut vendor; money in hand. I've had Philips HUE products since well before you even knew Phillips was in the LED game, and well before they even had a HUE brand.
How have you used flashlights? Here's how I have:
1: General utility use.
2: REAL "overlanding".
3: Military and private sector tasks... Constantly.
4: Thrown as distractions.
5: Strapped to the side of a bow during Elephant raids.
6: Blinding people and beating the fuck out of them.
7: High as a kite, drunk, beating down washes to escape flash flooding... Out the window as the only headlight left.
8: Signaling.
9: Rescues.
10: Film work...
11: Crawling through mine shafts in the middle of nowhere to root out bandits.
Visible, IR, colored filters... It doesn't stop there.
It goes on, and on, and on. I've used more flashlights under adverse conditions than most "Flashlight Enthusiasts" have ever touched. I've even used my share of diesel lanterns, as mentioned earlier. Hell, that shit is how I got so fucked up over time, and why I've spent so much time being repaired over the past few years.
So, if you want to tell me that the cheaper lights are unsuitable for harsh or mission-critical use, you're just going to have to find another hobby. That is simply not true. You have been misinformed.
I mean, if you want to go camping, more power to you. Buy a $300 flashlight.
If you want to break yourself against the worst the world has to offer... Well... You'll be fine with the cheaper stuff. :rofl:
Cheers,
Kennith
I'm correct.
As soon as people start talking about EDC, it's time to tune them out. It's noise on top of irrelevance.
I've been into LEDs for a long time. I literally own the first retail sold LED flashlight. When I heard it was showing up, I was standing outside the debut vendor; money in hand. I've had Philips HUE products since well before you even knew Phillips was in the LED game, and well before they even had a HUE brand.
How have you used flashlights? Here's how I have:
1: General utility use.
2: REAL "overlanding".
3: Military and private sector tasks... Constantly.
4: Thrown as distractions.
5: Strapped to the side of a bow during Elephant raids.
6: Blinding people and beating the fuck out of them.
7: High as a kite, drunk, beating down washes to escape flash flooding... Out the window as the only headlight left.
8: Signaling.
9: Rescues.
10: Film work...
11: Crawling through mine shafts in the middle of nowhere to root out bandits.
Visible, IR, colored filters... It doesn't stop there.
It goes on, and on, and on. I've used more flashlights under adverse conditions than most "Flashlight Enthusiasts" have ever touched. I've even used my share of diesel lanterns, as mentioned earlier. Hell, that shit is how I got so fucked up over time, and why I've spent so much time being repaired over the past few years.
So, if you want to tell me that the cheaper lights are unsuitable for harsh or mission-critical use, you're just going to have to find another hobby. That is simply not true. You have been misinformed.
I mean, if you want to go camping, more power to you. Buy a $300 flashlight.
If you want to break yourself against the worst the world has to offer... Well... You'll be fine with the cheaper stuff. :rofl:
Cheers,
Kennith
Indiana Jones and I have obviously had different experiences with cheap lights. For me they're performed like a cheap torque wrench, terrible. YMMV.
Who would you rather listen to? "Indiana Jones", or some guy in a flashlight nerd club? :rofl:
Cheers,
Kennith
My "fumble for a hammer in the dark" comment was a sarcastic response to ERover's post with the guy using his flashlight as a hammer, then ERover's newsflash that a flashlight is a tool. My point was that there is a right tool and a wrong tool....hammering with a flashlight is moronic, just as fumbling for a hammer when the power goes out would be moronic since most hammers don't illuminate.
This thread makes me think of Brad Pitt and his flashlight fun looking for John Doe...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWJrqtxvRLQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWJrqtxvRLQ
Yes, Blue, I gathered that.
I had no idea flashlights were tools.
And I never thought to use one as a hammer, who knew?
I'm certain Mr. ERover only uses a DSLR to take photographs, and never uses his telephone, as that would be improper use of an item.
And the fact that he may or may not own a Land Rover, and disparages Jeeps is more than laughable.
Reliability and most appropriate "tool" for the job?
Tigger, please.
But I suppose the MOST important aspect is being able to announce that he HAS a Land Rover, and a $300 flashlight, ensuring that all listeners are aware of his superiority in all regards.
Well, as a probable Kermit Chair owner, one cannot expect him to caress his posterior in such luxury and calm if he turns on a cheap flashlight and sees a Jeep. That would fuck up his chi, man.
I mean, I personally carry a conventional folding lawn chair... Maybe that's why I don't rely on a Supernova X3R 4.0 Multi-Mode Environmental Illuminator and Terrorist Stick/Hammer Combination Hand Torch...
Cheers,
Kennith
You're confused. We're talking 10-$80 lights, not Maxabeams or Polarions. Same price range many other common tools fall into, and the same issues of quality vs price apply. Milwaukee > Makita > Dewalt > Ryobi > Hyper Tough. There's nothing new here, except the dumb notion that flashlights aren't like every other tool.
Holy shit! He has a YouTube Channel:
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ODld_KWEKUo" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Cheers,
Kennith
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ODld_KWEKUo" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Cheers,
Kennith