| Author |
Message |
    
John Kruger (Johnnyk)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 22, 2002 - 10:13 am: | 
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nm |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 22, 2002 - 10:14 am: |
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Rover.
-L |
Germán R. Grüner (Germán)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 22, 2002 - 02:16 pm: |
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See http://www.maxion-motores.com.br/ |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 22, 2002 - 04:08 pm: |
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That's misleading.... International now makes engines to go in Defenders in certain markets, such as Brazil, but it's the Rover design that they are copying... elsewhere, Rover-built engines are used.
-L |
Germán R. Grüner (Germán)
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2002 - 11:03 am: |
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Leslie, you are right, brand new diesel Land Rovers from UK are not more TDI. There are TD5.
Rover engines are Rover-built, but most parts, cilinder head, timing caps and exhaust for instance, are the same that uses Maxion and are produced in Argentina, Brazil and Mexico since a lot of years. See too http://www.ronicevi.com/
I read in the german forum, that TDI was developed in Austria starting from the 2,5 petrol version from old Landies. Who knows! |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2002 - 11:37 am: |
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Yep, the 300Tdi was an "improved" 200Tdi, switching from a gear-setup to a timing belt instead. Both are 2.5 L engines, which were derived from the 2.5 L engine as you said, which, in turn was derived from the 2.25 L engine, introduced circa 1961 with the Series IIa, which used the same block for both petrol and diesel. And the 2.25 took design cues from its predecessor to some extent....
I don't know about the Td5, but, if it was designed as an evolution of the 300Tdi, then it's got a pretty long Rover pedigree.... 
FWIW...
-L |
jens stoermer
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2002 - 12:12 pm: |
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Not exactly, Leslie. The 200TDI has also a timing belt, causing trouble :-(
I would have to sort it out, but I believe the 200TDI was completely new developed and shares only the blocks outer dimensions and mounting points with the 2,5 L Diesel.
As far as I know, the engine was developed by austrian company AVL (avl.com), but this is not official. |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2002 - 12:42 pm: |
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Hmmm.... really? I was told that the 300Tdi had the belt, which needs the "fix" to keep it from eating itself on the insde of the cover, but that the 200Tdi didn't have that problem because it didn't use a belt, but instead used... hmm, maybe it was a chain that it used instead of a gear set, but it wasn't a belt, I thought.
At some point I had read that the 200Tdi was a revamped 2.5L diesel, but what I read could be wrong or not have told the whole story.... I'll have to dig and see if I can find that again....
-L |
Jens Stoemer
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2002 - 05:10 pm: |
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It's definitely a belt. I have a 200TDI and change that part every 80.000 kms. No problems so far, but other owners have suffered engine damages from a broken belt, even though this is not as common as with the 300 TDI unit but rather like on every other engine with this setup. There are Zeus Timing Gear Conversion Kits available for 200 and 300 TDI, but I'm not very confident with them. After all, if e.g. the oil support fails (originally, there is no oil in this area of the engine) these gears also can break.
The 200 TDI has also some tendency to blow the headgasket with high mileage. This is not very funny, because it then begins to suck oil right into the cylinder, where it then gets happily burned. This means your engine is running on its own oil until there is no oil left, revving higher and higher. I experienced this two years ago. Luckily I knew this fact, so I managed to stall the engine with the brake.
Could someone put this picture in here (I'm too dumb for this)
http://www.extrem-motorsport.de/rover/bilder/kopfdichtung.jpg
Otherwise, I like the 200TDI very much, because it is a quite simple design without any electronics. The TD5 engine is not the best choice for trips to remote areas, because of it's electronics and fiddly plastic parts, a fuel system that relies on a filter build into the tank etc.
Your info about the revamped 2.5L Diesel could be right, as far as the block, crankshaft etc. goes. I dont know the pre TDI engines. The head is made from alloy and is completely diffrent. It's interesting that it is nearly impossible to get a 200 TDI engine for reasonable money. Many Series owners would die to get there hands on one, because it is much easier to convert from 2.5L Diesel to 200TDI than to a 300TDI because of the outer dimensions (same enginemounts with 200TDI).
Anyway, the german office of AVL is located in the building where I work, I probably will walk over tomorrow and ask them if they have something to do with rover engines. |
John Kruger (Johnnyk)
| | Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2002 - 09:42 am: |
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Good info, Thanks
John
www.teampb.com |
Ron
| | Posted on Monday, October 28, 2002 - 01:23 am: |
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2.0 litre diesel introduced in 1957
2.25 in 62ish
2.25 5 bearing in 82ish
2.5 in 84ish with belt
200TDi 2.5 with direct injection head
300TDi improved 200TDi block similar but not the same
TD5 offshoot of rover diesel redesign with projected 4,5,6 cylinder engines, only TD5 produced, shares little to nothing with predecessors.
All ROVER designed and built. TD4 and TD6 are beamer motors.
Ron |
Jens Stoermer
| | Posted on Saturday, November 02, 2002 - 04:48 pm: |
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Still didn't talk to AVL, but I found my book "Discovery, the Enthusiast's Companion" by James Taylor. Page 34:
"...around 1983, they started work on a new 4cylinder Diesel to replace the old 2.25 litre ohv engine....codenamed Gemini (later the 200TDI)...cylinder block was based on the older engine...2.5 litre was a stopgap in the mid eighties...bore and stroke are identical to 200TDI
...
Cylinder Head design was going to be vital, and for this the LR Engineers sought advice from AVL, an Austrian company which specializes in direct-injection technology...special new pistons developed in conjunction with Kolben Schmidt. Bosch two spring injectors were used for the first time by any motor manufacturer..." |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Saturday, November 02, 2002 - 10:44 pm: |
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Jens,
Thanks for the extra info..... I'll have to remember that....
-L |
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