| Author |
Message |
    
Chip Salisbury (Disconites)
| | Posted on Monday, January 06, 2003 - 09:14 pm: | 
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Being tired of being outdone by J@#p friends with lockers, I have decided to lock the rear dif. I am going to be going with the Detroit, but am having troubles finding one for a D1. Can anyone help by pointing me in the right direction for purchasing one? Price is important as well as service. Also, any feedback from folks that have installed one themselves would be helpful as well.
Thanks |
Phillip Perkinson (R0ver4x4)
| | Posted on Monday, January 06, 2003 - 09:21 pm: |
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www.expeditionexchange.com |
Clif Ashley (Cta586)
| | Posted on Monday, January 06, 2003 - 10:08 pm: |
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Ill second that. |
Eric N (Grnrvr)
| | Posted on Monday, January 06, 2003 - 11:00 pm: |
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I would call Rovertym |
chrisvonc
| | Posted on Monday, January 06, 2003 - 11:04 pm: |
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Great Basin Rovers too. |
Carter Simcoe (Carter)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 10:06 am: |
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Don't forget stronger axles, the GBR ones look nice. |
Brian Friend (Brianfriend)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 10:08 am: |
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Go with great basin. He can set you up with axles and locker in one shot. |
perroneford
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 10:09 am: |
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Chip,
I bought mine from Great Basin for a few reasons, but since I didn't want to set it up myself, this is how I did it.
I removed the front and rear open diffs. I put the front open diff in the back, and put the rear one in a 5 gallon plastic pail (with cushioning material) and shipped it to Great Basin. Bill, stripped it, rebuilt it completely, added the locker, and shipped it back to me. I bolted it in the rear, and swapped the front one back to where it belonged.
The entire process was smooth, and trouble-free. The increase in traction is about double, and the handling manners are delightful. I don't even notice it's back there. I had been thinking of going with a specialized locker for the front, but I think I am just going to do a trutrac in the summer. More than enough traction for my needs.
-P |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 12:22 pm: |
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this is my favorite locker |
Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 01:27 pm: |
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Perrone - how was the driving on just the rear? How many miles did you put on like that? Any precautions?
Dean |
i wish i was perrone
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 01:32 pm: |
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delightful |
perroneford
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 02:38 pm: |
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Dean,
I drove about 2 months of daily driving on just the rears. I'd guess about 2500 miles. It was just fine. At one point I've driven on just the rear for about 6 months.
-P |
Chip Salisbury (Disconites)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 08:13 pm: |
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I appreciate all the info on where to go for the locker, I'll give them a shout. Has anyone installed a locker themselves? I am one of those people that just NEED to do the work themselves, not so much from a labor cost standpoint, but I want to know everything I can about this truck inside and out. Is it a huge PITA?
Chip |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 07, 2003 - 09:09 pm: |
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Not really. The hardest part is to set the backlash right. If you screw that up, your gears will wear prematurely. Other than that, it's basically just a matter of pulling the old carrier out and replacing it with the the locker, seal everything up and fill it with oil.
Kyle installed both my lockers, a rear Detroit a couple of years ago, and a front Truetrack last fall. I was assisting (read watching nervously and handing him tools) on both installs. Both have performed perfectly since they were put in, with no gear whine or pulling to either side. |
perroneford
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 07:49 am: |
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Chip,
I didn't install my own because I didn't want to risk blowing up a $500 locker. If I was playing with $75 used open diffs, I'd probably have tried it. If you've got the dough to make a mistake, have at it.
-P |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 08:19 am: |
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I don't see how you could possibly blow up the locker, it just drops in as a replacement for the carrier. The ring and pinion gears is a different story though. You can wear them out pretty fast if you get the backlash wrong. That applies to dropping in that $75 used open carrier too. You would still have to set your backlash. |
Chip Salisbury (Disconites)
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 08:25 am: |
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Axel (or Kyle),
Setting the backlash consists of what exactly?
Chip |
perroneford
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 10:12 am: |
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I guess that's true, but with my luck...
-P |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 12:18 pm: |
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chip the rule of thumb goes like this...
instaling a locker isn't hard to do, you just need to see it done first.
then when you are ready to try your first one... don't do your own car. just in case.
i paid a local dude $125 out the door to install mine. then i watched kyle put one in.. i still don't feel ready to do one on my own. i'd like to have a video tape to follow along with... that would be the cats ass.
rd |
Steve (Scrover)
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 12:49 pm: |
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Dang Rob, now you want a video of a cat's ass, you really are a sick man  |
muskyman
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 01:52 pm: |
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some are easy some are a bitch
if you bring me a working assembled Dana axel I can change the gears in under an hour because the pinion depth is not an issue you simply read the depth etched on the pinion read whats etched on the new one and do the math.
I once had a empty Dana housing take me about 8 hours in and out over and over and that was using a real Dana pinion deapth gauge.
I still after doing dozens send people away to my friend that sets gears for a living just because its really a PITA if you dont have the time and the patience at that moment and short cuts or close enough just costs money.
there is one nice thing about rover axles...removable third member...bench work is always easier then laying on a concrete floor wrestling with a case spreader |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 11:02 pm: |
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Chip:
Setting the backlash (in laymans terms) basically means that you adjust the tighness between the ring and pinion gears after you have dropped in the locker. It needs to have just the right amount of play, if you get it too tight or too loose your gears won't last long. We are talking very fine tolerances here, so you need to use a special gauge to measure the play. This is the most critical part of the install. Even though I have seen Kyle do it several times, I am not ready to attempt that delicate operation myself yet.
Axel |
muskyman
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 08, 2003 - 11:13 pm: |
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well backlash is only correct when the contact patern that the gears produce is the correct shape at the correct backlash.
the backlash can be perfect and the patern suck because the pinion depth is incorrect.
like I said above there are no short cuts
if this dosent make sence...better not try to do your own gears |
Chris von Czoernig (Chrisvonc)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 09, 2003 - 06:35 am: |
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To get an idea of what you are looking at for installing a locker, there is a full ARB install write up with pictures under the Tech section on D-90.com. Regardless if you are doing ARB or not, it will give you an idea of what is involved.
After watching Kyle do 3 locker installs for me, and if the setting of the backlash was not such a critical issue, I would say go for it. But without the dial gauge and knowing what you are doing to set the backlash, I would not try it.
Chris von C |
Chris von Czoernig (Chrisvonc)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 09, 2003 - 06:40 am: |
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Sorry forgot to add that there is a write up in the Tech section here on Discoweb on an ARB install as well which bring up another option that you might want to buy a fully assembled 3rd member with the locker already set up in it from Great Basin Rovers. Then the rest of the install you could do.
Chris von C. |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 09, 2003 - 12:35 pm: |
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Thom is of course correct. My explanation is the abbreviated "Backlash for Dummies" writeup.....  |
Peter Matusov (Pmatusov)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 09, 2003 - 12:56 pm: |
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Thom,
if the pinion hasn't been touched, and you only replace the carrier, i don't think you can fuck up the contact pattern badly by just making the backlash correct.
BTW, the rover's backlash feels like tiny slop when you turn the ring gear back and forth a bit. I thought i could do it without the gauge.
Also, I didn't know the pinion depth is stamped somewhere for the Dana axles. I'd have the gears swapped already... Pinion depth is something i never dealt with.
peter |
thom mathie (Muskyman)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 09, 2003 - 01:23 pm: |
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you are correct
if it is just a carrier change and not a gear change then pinion depth is not a factor but the true centerline on a pinion needs to be at the true centerline of the ring to put the eyebrow shaped patern in the right place on the ring. this is controlled by pinion depth.
here is a dana pinion,if you look closely you can just see where the depth is is etched in as a plus(+) or minus(-) then a number. so if the new set is +4 and the old one +2 it gives you a starting baseline of a 2 thousanths shim. using oem dana gears this normally gets you where you need to be. when the old gears are out you need a pinion depth gauge to measure the depth to baseline you. |
Peter Matusov (Pmatusov)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 09, 2003 - 02:36 pm: |
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somebody chewed that pinion badly...
thanks for the explanation
peter |
adtoolco
| | Posted on Saturday, January 11, 2003 - 12:01 pm: |
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Great post guys. 4:10's and lockers here I come!!!
-Chris |
adtoolco
| | Posted on Saturday, January 11, 2003 - 12:01 pm: |
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I might as well do the shafts while I'm there.
-Chris |
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