SUV's support terror?

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Author Message   michael burt (Mikeyb) Posted on Monday, January 13, 2003 - 05:12 pm:    with all the hype about SUV's and terror, why don't we be proactive? how about it discoweb.org? mike   Bill M. (Circekat) Posted on Monday, January 13, 2003 - 05:29 pm:    I like it! It is less aggressive than some of the ideas that I had after seeing how I was suporting terrorism. Bill M.   Brian (Rover_Wannabe) Posted on Monday, January 13, 2003 - 07:15 pm:    I would buy that sticker if it were made! (I have the dents to prove it)   Erik G. Burrows (Erik) Posted on Monday, January 13, 2003 - 07:28 pm:    For the purpose of deterring mis-guided kids with sharp keys, and the environmentally righteous I like the idea of a big 'Tread Lightly' sticker.   michael burt (Mikeyb) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 12:17 am:    good point erik... but i also hate being grouped in with italian loafer wearing, chrome plated lamp guard having, retractable running board using posers that own a SUV for it's image and not for it's original purpose. maybe both stickers would be good? ;) mike   Kim S (Roverine) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 12:38 am:    LOL!! Ya just can't win ... Kim BTW: Sadly, SOME of the "Treadlightly" people I know personally are the worst (ignorant) hypocrite offenders I've seen (when it comes to going somewhere that suits their own selfish interests).   M. Recke (Disco_Obsession) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 04:09 am:    SHAME on you Yanks! I heard it on the radio this morning here is Australia. Gas guzzlers etc etc, At least they didn't pick on Rovers in particular. After all the high consumption of Oils needed to replace the oil leaking out of our Discos could make headlines too LOL   Jack (Olered) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 09:23 am:    If the advertisement is stating that if I drive a SUV then I support terrorism (meaning that I am a terrorist of some sort). I own a SUV so doesn't this ad target me? Does this not sound like slander or something? He is stating that I support terrorism and I don't. He is defaming my character (and yours). Does anyone smell class action? I wonder if anyone has thought of this. I know there's some part of the slander or lible law that I'm ignoring but...   Brian (Rover_Wannabe) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 09:37 am:    Maybe we SUV owners that actually use the utility part should get together and call Johnny Cochran on that class action suit.   Eric Pena (Evalp) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 10:40 am:    Jack, I like that idea...Although I don't think it would work. If the story was reported in the news (paper or tv) almost anything is fair game as long as it does not make anyone loose money or ruin the reputation of individuals permenently and is very false. That would be slander so unfortunatly this is not, but it still pisses me off! Maybe some of the car makers could get those high priced lawyers on this, they could probably drum something up!   R. B. Bailey (Rover50987) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 10:55 am:    Am I missing something? All this time I have been going to the SAME gas station, and getting the SAME gas that all the other little cars on the road get. Is there as special gas, or gas station for terrorists - I mean SUV's? Let me know, I would like to see it. http://landrover.mrbaileyshistory.net   andy Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 11:20 am:    We need Jackie Childs on this ... I would like to here from the suv owners on this board that also happen to be in active military service. I really want to hear from the ones that are currentally letting there suv's sit, as they are in Afganistan or Kuwait right now on how they are terrorist supporters. By the way, the US military uses Hummers, they are suv's does that mean they are terror supporters? What about the brits and their use of LR's? Maybe the US should get rid of all those H1's and by a bunch of honda insites. Andy   Brian Friend (Brianfriend) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 11:31 am:    I saw one of those Honda Insite things the other day. It even had happy tags on it. Probably one of the ugliest cars I have ever seen. It is right up there iwth the Aztec and the old 4x4 eagle.   Eric Pena (Evalp) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 11:35 am:      R. B. Bailey (Rover50987) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 11:46 am:    Actually, I just heard that the new Hummers in the Military will have hybrid turbo diesel - get 30 mpg... Without a loss in HP or Torque. Why can't we get power plants like that in our SUV's? http://landrover.mrbaileyshistory.net   Mike Carino (Mikec) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 12:23 pm:    Does anyone else NOT consider their discovery an SUV? I mean the whole SUV acronym was started by Detroit. I never considered any predecessor to the big three's offerings an SUV. I think Land Rover and Toyota and even Mitsubishi built their vehicles for a specific use way back when, and that did not include some tatooed, pierced, neo- outdoorsie type or image concious person who had to be like everyone else. I think the only thing we have in common with an SUV is 4 doors and a covered cargo area. That is where the likeness stops. So if some hippocritical person wants to single out SUV's as being linked to terrorism and destroying the environment. And forgets that they themselves have vehicles, houses that need to be heated and wear some form of polyester, I say go ahead. I'm not one of them! OK, I'll get off my soap box now. And please know that I have nothing against people with tattoo's, body piercings or who wear polyester. But I do have a problem with people that follow the crowd to fit in! " Happiness is being a social outcast! " Mike   R. B. Bailey (Rover50987) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 12:34 pm:    Actually you are right, usually, I just refer to my Discovery, and especially the Series IIa, as a UV. My Discovery uses WAY to much gas to be an SUV, it should really be put into a whole different category. http://landrover.mrbaileyshistory.net   andy Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 12:45 pm:    I think the the discovery is considered a sports wagon in the mother land. Funny here in this country we try to avoid calling suvs station wagons because it makes us look old or like a home body. I drive a discovery "station wagon" because it fits my needs to carry stuff for house projects and carry climbing, hiking, biking, kayaking gear to remote locations in the back country. My wife drives an Audi A4 "avant" or "station wagon". We don't have kids but 2 dogs. Nothings better to carry backcountry skiing gear or go for long trips and carry two adults and two large dogs than a station wagon. I hate that this country we need "lifestyle" cars to fit an image. Just be yourself and let others decide if you have a lifestyle image. Do other countries worry as much about there image while driving? Andy on the soapbox   Mike Carino (Mikec) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 01:00 pm:    Amen Andy. When I purchased my Disco in 98, I bought it because I wanted to go camping and travelling into some remote areas in this country. And I wanted a vehicle that could take me there and back without worry. And the Disco fit that profile perfect. I guess I am the type that has a specific goal in mind for my vehicles. I do the research, test drive and buy what I think will accomplish it best. Just like I am sure you purchased your Audi because you wanted a sports car with some quality luxury to it, but could also carry the dogs. You know I just laugh at those that buy vehicles because it is what everyone else is getting or is the in thing now. I find that when things become a fad, they get over done and then they become open to scutiny. I'm sure you will see SUV's fade away ( they are starting to already) and we will once again be back where we started.   Brendan Kearns (Howboucha) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 01:46 pm:    I like to consider mine an AV for Adventure Vehicle. I never like the SUV acronym because it seemed to start when Ford came out the the Exploder, then the Excrumersion. I have had many people ask me about my "Jeep". Kind of the Coke for soft drink thing. I had a large sticker on the back of my Pinzgauer that in UN style fonts (White backround, black lettering) said UAV. My inside joke was Urban Assault Vehicle. I promptly removed it on September 12, 2001 after a guy tried to take me out in his tiny car while yelling at me on Hwy 46 in Elletsville near Bloomington (eco terrorism captitol of the US). I figured my timing was poor, and I should have left the pinzgauer at home for awhile. (if you don't know, it's an austrian made troop carrier). I was going to make up an anti ELF sticker and put it on my disco, but I figured they would just burn it like they have been the homes around Lake Monroe and the chicken distrubution place down the road. I proudly have the DIRT (Discover Indiana Riding Trails), EE (Expedition Exports) Howboucha.com (my site) and soon to have Discoweb stickers. People grin when they see the Howboucha sticker, I bet they think is a porn site. So I guess I will add a new sticker that says AV-not SUV. Maybe I will even remove the rocket launcher off the roof rack since I don't want to be considered a terrorist supporter. B.K.   Peter Carey (Pcarey) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 01:59 pm:    Before I read all this and was driving around today, I was thinking something about that first sticker didn't sit well. And it was the fact that an SUV in no way needs to go off-road to be an SUV. It's Sport (driving around town and such in a fancy) Utility (carrying stuff). now if it said "My 4x4 has been off-road..." that might be a bit better. Of course, then people are left wondering if their SUV has 4x4 (don't get me started about the TrailBlazer I rented last winter because it was supposed to snow on my trip and when it snowed, I found out it was 2WD). But an SUV doesn't need to go off-road to fulfil its "true calling". I tow a trailer and zip around town real quickly in my Jeep GC, so it's SUVin' just fine. pwc   michael burt (Mikeyb) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 05:00 pm:    the sticker was just an idea for a starting point. i don't necessarly agree that an SUV does not need to go off-road to fulfill it's true calling...i think that is what detroit wants us to believe...and that is why they are making these PSeudoUV's today. i have never purchased a SUV (or whatever you feel is the more correct acronym) without planning to use it for what i have always was the purpose: to boldly go where no other vehicle can go. most allegedSUV owners could boldly go in a yugo where their PSUV's take them. i agree to a point that most PSUV owners waste fuel by driving these ill suited for their actual uses vehicles and in the light of trying to end our addiction to foreign oil, are not helping. however i own one, not because i want to be "cool," or "rugged," or "stylish," or becasue i like getting 14 miles to the gallon, but because i actually use it to do things few other vehicles can do. i would like to get some distance (in a metaphorical since) from these other 4X4/PSUV/whatever owners who contribute nothing to the outdoor world, or the tread lightly world, or the personal responsibility world... IMHO...;) mike   OLIVER CLOTHSOFF (Everythingleaks) Posted on Tuesday, January 14, 2003 - 10:32 pm:    How bout : " My SUV was actually made to go off-road, how 'bout yours?"   michael burt (Mikeyb) Posted on Wednesday, January 15, 2003 - 01:27 am:    in munich once...i was leaving the hauffbrauhaus beer garden where across the street there were hoards of american tourists at planet hollywood. they were across the street from a german beer garden and the chose to go to the most american of places...a place they could just as easily seen at home. in paris once...i was on the metro and i had to listen to several women complain that the only thing they could find to buy was a watch from the hard rock cafe...what? i did not even know there was a hard rock cafe in paris...the fashion capital of the world and they find a hard rock cafe watch to be the best of the best... shit man, i am tired of being overseas and grouped in with these people...and i am tired of driving a disco and being grouped in with these people... i have read on park service boards some of the comment cards left behind by visitors...comments such as: "there are too many bugs here, can we have the wilderness sprayed?" "there are too many hills on the walking trails." "if bears are such a threat, can they be eliminated?" maybe it is just me... dinks just really get on my nerves... mike   andy Posted on Wednesday, January 15, 2003 - 11:34 am:    Funny Mike, My wife and I drove to alaska this summer from salt lake city. We were amazed on the number of "dinks" in RV's that never stopped until they got to rv parks. Once there all they did was sit around outside of there rv's. They didn't go sample all the great local food, they never went on even small day hikes in national parks. We would laugh at the fact they wouldn't even stop to watch Denali at sun set. You don't have to be over seas to have dinks around. I feel your pain. Andy   Mike Carino (Mikec) Posted on Wednesday, January 15, 2003 - 11:41 am:    I agree Mike. Makes you wonder why they spent so much money to leave home, when in reality that is where they really wanted to be. Going to europe to experience america and into the great outdoors just to get a good view is truly idiotic to me. Mike C   michael burt (Mikeyb) Posted on Wednesday, January 15, 2003 - 11:45 am:    yeah...amazing, huh...? and denali is such an amazing mountain...that is a BIG SOB...! i have been climbing at red rocks, outside las vegas, often and it cracks me up to see people (as we are getting gear together) pull into the parking lot, barely open the window just enough to stick a camera outside, snap one photo of the rock, then leave. some people work so hard to look like travellers, or wheelers, or climbers, or skiers, or whatever...to me it is like stuffing a sock in your pants to impress the girls...sooner or later the truth will come out, so why not be who you really are from the start? mike   James F. Thompson Jaime (Blueboy) Posted on Wednesday, January 15, 2003 - 12:31 pm:    my wife calls it a "drive-by shooting"! Jaime   Norm Posted on Thursday, January 16, 2003 - 10:00 pm:    Any one who says that SUVs support terrorism ought to be taken out and shot. Preferably gut shot. Same goes with those PETA motherfuckers. Then take them out to "hang" with some feral hogs and coyotes and see how well they support the environment on the low end of the food chain. The fact is, self righteous tree huggers support terrorism and make us more dependent on Middle East oil by stopping oil and gas exploration and pipeline construction in the West. The funny thing is most of these idiots have never even set foot in the wilderness, yet they believe everything the Sierra Club spoon feeds them. The fact is, oil and gas exploration has very little impact on the environment -- after the wells are completed and the pipelines are laid there's no impact at all. Not to mention, when these idiots attack the oil and gas industry, they harm the enonomy as a whole by driving up energy prices, depriving us of jobs, money, tax revenues, and so on. If using energy is supporting terrorism, then they better turn off their gas and electricity this winter as well (Don't burn any wood, either, because wood smoke pollutes). Better get some batteries for their computers -- but no -- batteries are toxic. So go ahead and drive your gas-guzzling SUV over a tree hugger -- it's patriotic and will help us stamp out terrorism!!! ---Norm   OLIVER CLOTHSOFF (Everythingleaks) Posted on Thursday, January 16, 2003 - 11:07 pm:    I hear ya mike What part of wild-erness didn't they understand. If you wanted to walk down a straight concrete path with no bugs and bears they call those malls. Go there and stay out of the woods.   michael burt (Mikeyb) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 01:39 am:    it is funny to be around the dink squad from time to time though... last fall a buddy and i were trying to get back into shape for the new ice climbing season. well...we live in texas, so extreme measures are required to do that. measures such as attaching 2 16 foot 2X6's to the tree in the back yard and setting up a top rope. the looks on the neighbor's faces to see a guy in shorts, no shirt, plastic boots, ice tools and crampons, dry tooling up two wooden planks while on a top rope was priceless... it was a good thing it was the back yard and not the front or we would have had a traffic jam. but i have been thinking about the telephone pole out front lately... mike   Jeff E (Jeffe) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 01:56 pm:    I have been seeing many Hummer H2's of late. I wonder what kind of gas mileage those boxes get. Probably makes the Disco MPG look pretty attractive!.   Jaime (Blueboy) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 02:15 pm:    from 1 report I read: "test H2 averaged just 10.7 mpg, even with mostly highway driving. Uses regular-grade fuel." Jaime   Brian J. Rohan (Rover_Wannabe) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 03:35 pm:    I am having a hard time believing that the big 3 are not putting out their own ads on the subject considering that the SUV market is their biggest and most profitable. Perhaps a nice ad with a huge American flag waving in the background as they show all of trucks and SUV's used at the world trade center rubble (ambulances, suburbans that hauled crews, etc.) How about another ad that is focused on the F-22 Raptor, then it pans back to show the parking lot of Lockheed or Boeing, with nothing but SUV's in the parking lot with nice patriotic caption. There is always the choice of using some older footage of the auto factories during WWII cranking out all of the Jeeps, and other big military hardware with a person saying "Since when did we support terrorism?" Just a few thoughts FWIW. Brian   Brian J. Rohan (Rover_Wannabe) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 03:41 pm:    OK, I know I am a little slow, but now how about what I think may be the best counter ad. A blank TV screen. The caption comes up, "Do SUV's really support terrorism?" Then fade in footage of those nice white with black lettered UN SUV vehicles driving all over the world snuffing out the bad guys. Nuff said.   Peter Carey (Pcarey) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 05:01 pm:    Now that would be funny.   KJ Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 05:30 pm:    Hey, heeeyyyyyyyyy.....I'm a DINK, and all that means to me is just what it stands for: Dual income, no kids. Cases can be made for just about any point of view one wishes to espouse. I pay my own bills, try to respect other's POVs (as long as they don't over-work my B.S. detector) and do my own thing. In this age of information over-load, spin-doctoring to the Xtreme (G), part of the story MAKING the story, accountants cooking the books and all the rest, I rely upon myself to decide what I'll do in this life. Karen   KJ Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 05:47 pm:    And ANOTHER thing, LOL! All this terrorist support crap reminds me of when we first got our Disco. One of my BILs and his wife live in D.C., in the city itself. They'd just turned in their leased Jeep GC the week before, after three years of 99.9% city driving. His wife looked at me and said (try to create the whiniest voice able to be discerned within the range of human hearing), "Whyyyyyyyyy did you get an SUVeeeeeeee?????? We'd NEVER have an SUVeeeeeeee after what Dick Cheney said." I said, "And what did Dick Cheney say?" She replied, "He said it was American's God-given riiiiiiiight to drive gas-guzzlerrrrrrrrrs, so we CAN'T do thaaaaaaaaat!" I laughed in her face and replied,"Well, when Dick Cheney pays my bills, perhaps I'll give a rat's ass what he has to say. And didn't YOU drive an SUV for the past three YEARS??????" She said slowly," Yes, I loved that Jeep. Steeeeeeeeeeeeve......I WANT THE JEEEEEEEEEEEEP BAAAAAAAAAAAACK!" LOLOLOL! Not the first time she's looked like not the brightest candle in the box! Karen   muskyman Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 06:12 pm:    hey now back off us PETA people   Geoff 93 RRC (Geoff) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 06:25 pm:    Who can deny that SUVs guzzle fuel and that most of our imported oil goes to gasoline refineries? Nobody. I read an article in the New Republic (unabashedly liberal magazine) that SUV buyers are sociopaths and factor in the "intimidating" size of the vehicle in their purchasing decision. Ridiculous hogwash. That's like saying all people that buy small cars want to prevent terrorism. The point is that an SUV makes a lot of sense to many people for many reasons. The cost to operate one is not material at this time. When it comes to expensive purchases like houses and cars, most people make their choices seriously and practically. From this perspective I agree with Dick Cheney that buying an SUV is a "God given right". Nothing will change until rational folks (the majority) are faced with choices that make SUVs too much of a burden (such as higher fuel costs) or are presented with a better alternative. Personally, I am hoping for stability in oil prices until good alternative power is available to the SUV, perhaps in 10 years or so.   adtoolco Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 06:45 pm:    To be honest I don't care why someone buys what. It really is non of my business. I don't care if you buy something for its "intended purpose" or for some unintended purpose. No justification needed. This is a basic, fundamental freedom question. These enviro-fascists will not effect my choosen lifestyle . Jumpin gehosephat!!! Life is too short for crap like this. -Chris   adtoolco Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 06:48 pm:    Great website Musky. Can I be an official member of PETA? -Chris   Brian Friend (Brianfriend) Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 07:07 pm:    I don't need my discovery and I sure don't need to go off road. For me it is a gas guzzling toy and the only thing that bothers me about the amount of gas it uses is paying for it and I wish there were someone that I know that would be opposed the this...it would be fun to point that out. The anti gun people, and anti whatever people all tend to be the of the same mindset. very anoying.   KJ Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:45 pm:    Brian, We're all pro some things and anti other things. It's human nature to pick and choose and also human nature to not necessarily be consistant in our choices. I love animals, I eat meat. Taking off on your last line, I drive a Disco and I'm not fond of guns, so that goes against that generalization. Humans do things, think stuff, act various ways. Annoying? Hell yes, sometimes.... Karen   Norm Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:13 pm:    Karen, Not fond of guns? What the HELL is your problem???? ---Norm   Norm Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:26 pm:    Actually, being in the oil and gas business, I am totally opposed to public transportation and the whiny little fuckers who ride it. Not only do those god damn buses get in the way of my patriotic, gas guzzling 4.6 D 1 on the street, they're actually robbing me of God-given petroleum revenues. That's positively UnAmerican, god dammit!!!! I have half a mind to open up on the Sierra Club with a Barrett .50 BMG... On a positive note, the spot price for natural gas is up to $5.64 per mcf -- and the temperature is dropping!!! I've got my eye on a new Mercedes G-Wagen, so, dammit turn up the heat, all you sniveling little eco terrorists!!! ---Norm   KJ Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:34 pm:    Heehee...sounds like Norm has been warming himself up with a different kind of spirit(s) tonight... Karen   muskyman Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:52 pm:    lol   M. K. Watson (Lrover94) Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 09:23 pm:    public transportation is the down fall of civilization! mike w   robert Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 10:47 pm:    What I don't understand about all this SUVs support terrorism is that they are forgetting about alot of other things that consume alot of gas. My dad's F250 would never get above 10 mpg, and he has recently changed over to a F150 that gets about 17 mpg. My Disco gets around 14mgg. Ok, another thing, what about all the damned people using private jets, etc., that has to use more gas in a week than my Disco does in a year. Until gas is $5.00 a gallon, fuck these people, fuck them right in their stupid asses   Daniel Rivenbark Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 11:01 pm:    My wife and I have four children. We love the outdoors, and that's why we have a LR. We tried the minivan, but it didn't do well on rutted gravel roads in the backcountry, loaded with gear, towing a trailer with kayaks. I'm sick and tired of the communists/ socialists in this country who want to take away my personal freedoms. DON'T TREAD ON ME. If we come up with a viable alternative to low gas mileage Adventure Vehicles, sign me up. Those same people who call us terrrorists, complain about the emissions of a diseil engine, and prevent it from being offered in the US. My brother-in-law in France has been driving his diseil-powered Disco for more than 10 years now.   Tom Rowe Posted on Wednesday, January 22, 2003 - 02:00 pm:    It's all just a replay of history: 50's "We will not knowingly employ a communist" 70's and 80's "We will not knowingly hire a drug user" 90's "We will not knowingly hire someone who fits our definition of contributing to terrorism" Communists, drugs users, SUV owners It's all just busy bodies feeling they should mind other people's business and force their ideas on you, rather than just presenting honest facts and letting you decide.