| Author |
Message |
    
Phillip Perkinson (R0ver4x4)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 16, 2003 - 11:36 pm: | 
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subject speaks for itself post. |
Blake Luse (Muddyrover)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:18 am: |
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i've always liked the dead, i probably have 10 cds.
but i like every kind of music
NIRVANA DAVE M. B.
STP GUNS N ROSES
KORN
here's my room posters alone.
 |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:19 am: |
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We go through this topic about two or three times a year.... but, that's okay, I get to find new things to listen to this way....
A little Dead (actually had a t-shirt on under my suit when I got married), much more of a LedZep and Pink Floyd fan, though... lots of Celtic rock stuff (bagpipes and electric guitars! 7N, Mackeel, Clandestine, Kilt, Enter the Haggis,Celtic Soul, etc.), and a lot of Tori Amos' b-side stuff... Good Charlotte, Red Hot Chili Peppers, old GnR, Eagles/Stones/Beatles, REM, Police, Black Crowes, Blind Melon, Eric Clapton.... Green Day, Dead Milkmen, Shakira, Violent Femmes, the Alarm.... old Iron Maiden, old Van Halen, Deep Purple, Hendrix, Jethro Tull...
I'll pretty much listen to anything that's on the radio, too....
-L |
John Moore (Jmoore)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 08:43 am: |
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I listen to The Clash, Smiths, Good Charlotte, Travis, The Who, Nelly, Dixie Chicks, AC/DC. And of course the Dan Patrick show on ESPN Radio.
I like a diverse group of Artists. And like Leslie said this has been discussed a few times. I would like to add a twist.
I work for a large Record Company. CD sales have been down 10% in 2001 and another 10% in 2002. Many of my colleges believe this is due to burning and downloading. I believe this does play a part, but I really think music is stale. The boy band thing has gone away, Latin was a mere flash. The last two big changes in music were Grunge and the mainstreaming of Hip Hop in the early 90's.
To entice buyers, record companies have lowered the price, most CD's are $7-$15, and added additional content(DVD and bonus tracks).
Also, there is much more competition for Music these days with Games and DVD.
To spice up this thread, in addition to what music you like. Would you mind adding:
-How many CD's you buy v. burn a month.
-How many DVD's or games you buy v. CD's a month.
-What would you like to see from the Music Industy or where are we going wrong?
-John |
Will Bobbitt (Rkores)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 09:01 am: |
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John,
To be honest with you, I hardly ever buy CD's, I am a poor high school student, and forking out 15 bucks for a cd that usually has 5-6 good songs on it is too much. It's much easier and cost effective to burn CD's, and put what songs I want on it. As far as current music goes, a fair amount of the new stuff stinks. I listen to all types of music, and rock is heading towards this screaming psycho crap, and most rap now has crappy lyrics (they just repeat the same stuff)and/or a crappy beat.
Just my .00002
Will |
Sean Hanagan (Seanh)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 09:47 am: |
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Phillip,
As I type I'm listening to a sweet boot jam of St. Steven. On the way to work I had Europe 72 on the box. Might take the VW camper from the wife (her daily driver) and do a little mini summer tour with the Other Ones. One of the great benifits of teaching, Just a week or two though. I'm getting too old for the full deal. We are everywhere! Cheers, |
Jess Alvarez (Jester)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 09:48 am: |
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Leslie,
If you like celtic rock, you ought to check out Flogging Molly. Pretty decent. I have never heard of the ones you mentioned. I will make sure to DL some from Kazaa.
If you want, I can post some MP3s of F.M. so you can hear them. |
perroneford
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 09:57 am: |
|
Interesting John, and a nice twist.
I also have a background in music, having owned a post-production studio for some time, and having been a DJ (radio and club) for 7 years.
When I left the music business, I dropped it completely. I didn't listen to the radio, I didn't go to clubs, and I didn't buy any music. I haven't bought a piece of music in almost 5 years. To be perfectly honest, I hadn't burned a music CD until the second week of November 2002.
Last summer I spent a goodly amount of time piddling on the Rover, and I fired up my old boombox in the garage. I found a station to listen to and just listened for a few hours. I repeated this for about 4 weekends straight. I realized I hadn't missed much.
The most innovative sounds are coming from Rap and Country. I had never listened to country in my life (other than my parent's or for business purposes) but I've enjoyed quite a lot of what I've heard recently. Rap has really evolved in the past few years. It was terrific when it started, lost it's way, and seems to be finding its way again.
I looked around in November for some mp3 players and downloading software. I wanted to make a christmas CD. I ended up downloading some really nice songs. I am sensitive to the "starving artists" issue and was careful to download only a few things. Mostly stuff recorded in the 50s or 60s.
In the past month or so, I've downloaded about 390 songs. Probably 85% of those are things I already own in a different format. Primarily vinyl singles. Some of the other are new country songs, old classic country songs, new rap songs, and some gospel.
So to answer your questions in turn
1. I don't buy or burn CDs
2. I don't buy any games, I own about 5 DVDs, and I own maybe 10-15 CDs.
3. There are a number of things I'd like to see from the Music Industry.
The first is to stop raping consumers by charging $10-20 per CD when they could make a healthy profit charging $5. When I bought albums as a kid, you could actually enjoy 3/4 or more of the songs on an album. Today, there are maybe 1 or 2 good songs and the rest is garbage.
The second, is to get the hell out of the lawsuit business. Everytime RIAA drags their feet and gets behind the technological curve, they want to hire a roomfull of lawyers to stop people from doing what they should have done in the first place. I've been through this 3 times already. With the prolifiation of small cassette tapes, RIAA got pissed and said it would kill album sales. Didn't happen. When I had the recording studio, it was the same issue with DAT tapes. My SV-3700 cost 3x what it should have because of that foolishness and we still overpay for pro-DAT equipment becase of SCMS. Now it's downloading of mp3s.
In the first two cases, album sales increased as people embraced technology. What RIAA is facing now is something different. People are angry that any joe blow artist with 1 song can make a million bucks while the consumer has to shell out $18 for a CD 1 good song and 13 filler songs. When I was a kid, I could buy two singles for one hour's minimum wage pay. At today's prices, and with the lack of singles, it takes the average kid 3 hours work to afford a single CD. Considering many High School kids only work 10-15 hours a week, and they'd like to see a movie, that means it takes ALL WEEK to be able to afford a single music purchase. These kids have no affinity for the recording industry and I don't blame them. Record companies have gotten wealthy off the backs of ignorant consumers and marginally talented artists. We have simply reached a balance point where consumers have a choice and are voting with their computers.
Now, I say all of this as someone who has spent thousands of dollars and thousands of hours on the other side of the equation. The music industry is going to see some tough times ahead, and to be honest, it's well deserved.
That's my $.02 and a bit extra.
-P |
Jaime (Blueboy)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:08 am: |
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yes - all Dick's picks and all CDs.
the site http://www.dead.net/
Jaime |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:38 am: |
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John,
I listen to a range of music from Rock, Country, Jazz, etc. Don't listen to Rap and Hip Hop because I prefer music and the talent in this areas is virtually non-existant. I tell my friends that we are in the dark ages of music right now. Who wants to listen to a bunch of angry, foul mouthed, drugged out, lazy idiots. The recording industry is reaping what the sowed.
Last time I bought a CD was at WestFest. The band is little known, Hot Club of Cowtown, and the CDs looked semi-professional. A three person band with more talent than the entire Rap/Hip Hop industry.
A raw CR-ROM cost on the order of $0.20-$0.25 each. A retail CD is $12-$18. People understand this. I bet some idiot in the music industry thinks the solution is to tax the cost of a raw CD up closer to a music CD.
Today computers with CD burners are a commodity.
For $5 to $10 a month you can get a satellite feed of continuous, advertisement free, music. This is for home, office or in your Land Rover. Before long your PDA/Cell phone will integrate a XM/Sirrus reciever. Bev and I have Dish Network and if we are listening to music its one of many theme based channels. Why do I need to buy a CD?
The recording industy thinks that pirating is the problem and have an army of lawyers. As long as they continue down this path they are doomed.
Success has always been about the quality of a product. The music industry doesn't have a product.
- Mark |
Kennith P. Whichard III (Kennith)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:46 am: |
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I too, am a music lover,
I enjoy a large variety of musical genres, some of my favorite bands include:
Led Zeppelin
Dream Theater
Shadow Gallery
The Strawbs
Queen
Jimmy Buffet
David Bowie
Deep Purple
Freddy Mercury's solo projects, to include Barcelona and Mr. Bad Guy
Queensrych
And a few others, to include Enigma.
Your enthusiasm for the Dead has left me with no option other than buying a CD and giving them a serious listen. Do you reccomend a particular album for the aspiring Dead-Head?
Cheers,
Kennith |
John Moore (Jmoore)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:49 am: |
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P-
Thanks for your well thought out response. I too started out in recording and engineering before I got into sales. Here are a few points.
-Under the current business model, record companies can't turn a profit on full length CD's for $5. Generally, 1 out of 20 CD we release actually makes a profit. That 1 CD pays for the rest. Also the sales of our deep catalog, supports the signing and marketing of new releases. But what has happened, due to the longevity of the CD, is that our catalog business is down.
-I agree about too much crap on an album. I think many Will is right about spending $15 for one good song. Unfortunately, we are selling albums in a single market. Look at the sucess of the "Now" compliations. But again, singles don't pay the bills.
-Recordability - I used to make cassettes too. One at a time, it took awhile. MP3's are different. Can be downloaded fairly quickly, decent quality, and can be quickly distributed to everyone in your address file by hitting "send". Can't compare MP3 to tapes or DAT. But I do agree that record companies need to find a way to make this work for them, if not for profit at least to market records.
I think Will summed it up, the music is not that great, it's expensive and it's just too easy to burn a CD.
I really hope that a new trend in music will excite people and they will want to buy records.
-John
Keep it coming. |
Eric N (Grnrvr)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:52 am: |
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well, in the Disco's cd changer I have
Nelly, Puddle of Mud, Jimmy Buffet, Van Hallen, and two Zeppelin discs.
However, I also have a 20gig MP3 player with a little over 200 cds on it in the Disco as well so on that I have every thing from Classic Rock to Classical, and oh yes some Grateful Dead. |
Sean Hanagan (Seanh)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:57 am: |
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Kennith,
Dick's Picks volume 6 (Hartford Civic Center 10/14/83)All the Dick's Picks can be had at Boarders books or at Dead Net.
2nd choice would be "Ladies and Gentlemen The Grateful Dead" ( Filmore East 1971). I love the period when Pigpen was playing with the band. He brought some cool blues/ southern influence.
Sean |
joshua Frances (Joshua)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:01 am: |
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Phillip...Heads are here...we are just kinda in hiding i guess.
My father took me to my first show when I was 3, and it was all downhill from there...or should I say up-hill...I hit about 53 or 54 shows. Most of it was when I was younger, but my father was into the dead.
Then Came phish...I started seeing the live music in the late 80s up in VT, and have seen 103 ( soon to be 104and 105) shows.
Im a huge live music-jam-band lover.
If your interested in any tapes, I have a sweet collection, some soundboards of some great shows, all recorded on a Nach dragon.
If your interested |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:32 am: |
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Jess,
Mackeel split up a few years ago, only had one CD calid "Plaid" (has a cow on the cover)... if you find a copy of it, BUY IT! You won't regret it. Kilt had a couple of CDs, but they, too, broke up a year or so ago. Both bands were out of the Nova Scotia/ Cape Breton area. Kilt was having trouble with Canadian taxation running them into the ground.... Enter the Haggis is from there, too, along with SlainteMath... EtH is harder, whereas SM's CD is a bit more mellow... they're much better live. And, Clandestine's last gig is February 1st in their home town of Houston, Tx....
I guess that you can only do the Celtic-rock-touring-thing for so long, eh?
7N, though, Seven Nations, is still going strong, it seems, just came out with a new album. Haven't heard it; the last few albums, they've been straying a little from the Celtic influence, heading for more mainstream with only a tinge of Gaelic left...
I have not heard of Flogging Molly... I'll have to keep an eye out for 'em... sounds interesting... email me if ya want, I'd like to find out about 'em...
+++++++++++
John,
Here's my take on it... I don't burn CDs ('course, I've just recently gotten a burner, but I can say that I'll lay odds that it gets used more for data-archival and making compilation-CDs of music I have). I don't download MP3s.
Thing is, look at what I listen to, what most of us listen to... mostly older "classic rock", that once you have it, you have it... I've got oodles of CDs, but I don't really buy many more anymore...
I buy, maybe, a CD or two a year. Games? I don't have nor want a PS2 or an X-box or anything... I have a couple of PC games, but not many, and I buy less than one per year for sure. DVDs, I'm now starting to buy instead of VHS tapes. But, I don't buy a lot of them, though... if there's something that I HAVE to have, such as LotR, I'm gonna buy it, but I'll just rent it otherwise (and not from Blockbuster, they overcharge, I go to the little one at the grocery store instead).
It's not neccesarily that the music is "bad", it's just that I still go back to listening to the older stuff... I'll have a Zep and an Eagles CD, and maybe Shakira, in the car for a month, then I'll swap out and have the Allman Bros, Neil Anderson, and REM... then a month or so later, I'll switch to Jewel, Floyd, and Hendrix.
Thing, though, is, I don't even wear those out... I usually listen to either a classic rock station, NPR, or a harder rock station. If there's nothing on that I want to listen to, then I'll switch to CD for a bit, but I'll go back to the radio after awhile...
At work, I only listen to radio... http://www.appalshop.org/wmmt/... a really neat eclectic non-NPR public station - has bluegrass, classic rock, REAL alternative stuff... not your top-40 alternative, but stuff that you never hear anywhere else...
I'll agree, I have to really want a CD to spend $15 on it... Also, part of the reason why the last 80% of the CDs I have bought, have been at Celtic Rock concerts, is that I'm handing the money to the artist directly... I know that they're putting the money in their pocket and eating dinner on the way home.
Look at Courtney Love's idea (not that I like her, but, she had a point)... what percentage of a CD's sale actually goes to the musicians? How much of that $15 is ending up in the artist's pocket? Not a lot... I would feel better spending that $15 for a CD if I knew that the really cool artist was making $10 off of it, but knowing that they're getting only a small bit of it, and the retailer is pocketing a bigger chunk, well, I don't want to help Wal-Mart out that much...
I think you struck on it, when you said Under the current business model...
The model's gonna have to change....
IMHO, FWIW...
-L |
perroneford
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:45 am: |
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Mark,
Please. This is a very good thread with a lot of potential to be useful. Please let's not let it degrade into a slanderous, and bigoted discussion where we belittle music that other people find value in. If you don't like Rap music or it's supporters that's fine. I generally find that people who dismiss an entire genre of music out of hand, have usually not spent any time exploring it or it's nuances.
It might interest you to know, for instance, that there are several rap artists who are classically trained musicians and who have the words "Juliard" on their resumes. Despite what you may think, or what music videos would have you believe, there are many rap artists who are lucid, intelligent folks simply making a product for mass consumption.
Let's not paint everyone with the same brush stroke ok?
John, I know the industry can't survive on $5 CD's. I didn't offer that as a viable price point, only a suggestion of lowered prices so as to bring things more inline with what consumers might be willing to pay. If the recording industry is going to woo customers back from the world of "free downloads" they are not going to do it by lowering CD prices from $17.99 to $15.99.
The idea of singles is sound. They aren't paying the bills for you because the marketing structure has moved. The music industry was BUILT around the single. Many years ago with the 45 (remember those), then the 12" long play, then the casette and maxi-single, and for a short time with the CD single. Capital costs are increased by stamping mini-CDs so that's not the way to go. The thing to do is to stop signing one-hit wonder artists for 10 year multi-album, multi-million dollar contracts, and then blame poor sales on consumers for not supporting the charade.
Remember when getting a record deal meant someone picked up distribution of the single you had been driving all over town and begging record store owners to put on their counter? It was a distribution contract for the most part, and hitting the big-time was when you got offered a chance to record your next single in the studio at the company. Today, with digital technology, the home studios of many artists rival the best of studios of 15 years ago. Hell, I remember when flying faders on a board were a novelty and only came on 64 imput boards are more. Today that's passe and only impresses the uninitiated.
The recording industry as a whole needs to find a new methodology for reaching the 12-25 year old buyer. Those who have never owned vinyl and who expect their songs to come to them over a computer and not at the record store. I don't know how DJs survive these days. Unless you're getting promo singles in a pool, you can't go get singles at the record store anymore like I used to do.
As for the Cassette/DAT/MP3 comparison, my point was simply that technology marches on, but the problem is the same. With Cassettes, you had opportunites to make reasonable copies. Certainly good enough for the car or truck. With DAT, you could make PERFECT copies that would stand up to any scrutiny, but it was still real tiem. Now the technology offers a reasonble facsimile of quality to DAT or CD, but in a very short period of time. I disagree about sending mp3 files via email. Most good mp3s are too large for email, but I get your point.
Like I said, RIAA is in real trouble, and lawyers aren't going to save them this time.
-P |
John Moore (Jmoore)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:52 am: |
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L,
Yup your right, the model does have to change, we talk about it everyday here in record land.
One bit of interesting reseach I heard, is that the music you listened to while you were 16-23 years old, tends to imprint on an individual and continues to be their favorite.
Of each $15 dollar Nirvana or Hole CD sold at Wal-Mart. $4 goes to Wal-Mart 36% margin, Wholesale is $11. $4 goes to the Record Company and between what her contact specificies and mechanical royalites, Courtney gets a mere pitance of $7. But artists must pay back the record company their advance and cost of making the record before they see a dime. That's why most new artist don't make any money off the sale of records initailly.
Even, your Celtic bands that you buy records from directly, still have to pay for the cost of production before they turn a profit. They just don't have to share with anyone.
-John |
Paul D. Morgan (V22guy)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:53 am: |
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In the changer right now is:
Dave Mathews Live in Chicago, disk 1
David Gray, White Ladder
Dave Mathews Live in Chicago Disk 2
David Gray (sequel to white ladder)
Bare Nakid Ladies
Van Morrison, The best of
When I go on a long drive, I'll load up a second magazine with Limp Bizkit,Kid Rock, Rage and whatever else keeps me awake. |
KJ
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:53 am: |
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Well, Paul Simon put it in lyrics a few years ago when he penned (and sang):
"The music suffers, baby,....the music business thrives....."
Now, it seems the music business is getting its' comeuppance.
Karen |
Phillip Perkinson (R0ver4x4)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:55 am: |
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Grateful Dead are the best by far. If any of you folks wanna exchange boot legs please please e mail me. I have a few shows and have access to others. |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 11:57 am: |
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perrone, when you say you were a DJ, do you mean ... some guy with stacks of wax that plays songs at weddings or do you mean DJ in the creating live new music from prerecorded media?
i have been getting into electonic music as the industry calls it. some of the the work that is being done in europe is amazing. for example st. germain who is release on blue note jazz lable is combineing techno with live dj efforst and a jazz band. sort of like portishead does, but much jazzier.
i have at my desk.
Colplay - rush of blood(current favorite)
st germain- tourist
royksopp - melody am
zero 7 - simple things
incubus - morning view
rd
ps. leslie, since you admit to the tori amos i admit to being a rather large fan of bjork. i actuall can't get enough... |
Paul D. Morgan (V22guy)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:01 pm: |
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Well Leslie and Rob, if your are going to talk about chicks....I am a big fan of the older Natlie Merchant stuff. |
James F.
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:03 pm: |
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Yeh, I'm a head....Phishhead or Phan or whatever. But I also have an extensive collection of Coltrane ta boot, ta boot. I just love going to hear live music though |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:10 pm: |
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rosco p coltrane is the best
http://www.dukefarm.com/rosco.html
lol |
James F.
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:17 pm: |
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Man, when I was younger, I lived for those shows: Dukes, Knight Rider, Miami Vice, Airwolf, the A team, CHiPS. Most of those are reruns now. I try to watch them now, and I can't make it to the first commercial break. Man, they are bad. What was I thinking? |
Jaime (Blueboy)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:19 pm: |
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Kennith,
"Without a Net" is a good choice. As is "Terrapin".
"Europe '72" is also pretty good.
Personally partial to the live vs studio stuff.
Jaime |
Paul D. Morgan (V22guy)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:19 pm: |
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James,
At work, We talk about all the bullshit that Hawk Stringfellow pulled flying that POS helo around! Airwolf Afterburners my ass! |
Eric N (Grnrvr)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:21 pm: |
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Tales of the Golden Monkey.. Too bad it's not on any more. My shows ( and still are ) were Magnum PI, Simon & Simon, and MASH |
Glenn Guinto (Glenn)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:24 pm: |
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For those of you who have Kazaaa or some other type of MP3 download, and are tired of same old rap songs....you should try downloading ludakrishna  I guarantee you, it'll give you a chuckle! 
-glenn
I want some feedback to those who download it. please |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:24 pm: |
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LOL
stringfellow,, the man who never smiled.
what was that lame ass heap roy snyder flew around in? blue hawk or some shit?
i was always a fan of the transformer motorcycle show, i cant remember that name either...
rd |
Jason Bard (Jbard)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 12:36 pm: |
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Yeah James, I hear you man. Used to watch all of those same shows. You try and watch them now and they are absolutely horrible! What were we thinking?
Music wise, I've got over a thousand songs on my work PC which really pisses off the IT guys.
Anything from The Doors, Burning Spear, Jeff Buckley, St. Germain, Turin Brakes, Neds Atomic Dustbin, DMB, Morphine, Snoop Dog, Guster. Kings of Convenience, ATB, Smiths, Ocean Blue, Badly Drawn Boy, David Gray, Gomez, Led Zepplin, Miles Davis, Joshua Redman Quartet..............and the list goes on. |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 01:27 pm: |
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Peronne,
I was responding to John's question "What would you like to see from the Music Industy or where are we going wrong?" I wasn't trying to be slanderous or bigoted. I read in the local newspaper that this weeks AMA awards were so vulgar that you couldn't follow what some were saying becuase every other word was bleeped out. Patricia Heaton walked out even though she was suppose to present an award. While Rap isn't the only music that is vulgar, it has defined itself in that way, along with disrespect for females and the whole gangster mentality. I agree we shouldn't paint everyone with the same brush, but this is the message that is coming across loud and clear. Its impossible to address the question of "Where did the industry go wrong?" and not include this. People and families are sick and tired of the hate and anger in todays music. They will steer their children away from this music, the very people who become teens and drive the industry. The same trend is happening in the school system with home schooling. So while an artist has the words "Juliard" on their resumes, what good is it if it doesn't result in a quality product? So again, I still say it the quality of the product. The question is - when will there be a renaissance?
Mark |
perroneford
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 01:32 pm: |
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>>>
perrone, when you say you were a DJ, do you mean ... some guy with stacks of wax that plays songs at weddings or do you mean DJ in the creating live new music from prerecorded media?
>>
i have been getting into electonic music as the industry calls it. some of the the work that is being done in europe is amazing. for example st. germain who is release on blue note jazz lable is combineing techno with live dj efforst and a jazz band. sort of like portishead does, but much jazzier.
<<<
Club DJs have been doing this stuff since the 80s. It's just getting mainstream. Record companies that don't do dance music are always 3-5 years behind the trends..
-P |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 02:04 pm: |
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throught the 80's it evolved, but never was polished as i liked. house never did it for me , tecno had little soul. the french dj's started doing some things that made the music interesting, and that influnced some folks and that is what i am liking.
when you have a live jazz band and a live DJ mixing and matching it is the best of both worlds.
the interesting thing about portisheads 2nd album is all the music/records thier dj is using for effects are stuff they went into the studio and layed down for the specific purpose of making interesting rythmes and samples for there dj to mix in with there produced studio & live songs.
rd |
todd slater (Toddslater)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 02:05 pm: |
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When it comes to Heads...Dead and Parrot are nice but I prefer mine Talking. |
perroneford
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 02:06 pm: |
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Did you like Us3?
-P |
John Moore (Jmoore)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 02:09 pm: |
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P-
We've tried and do suck at Dance music.
Mark & Bev -
It was Ozzy and family that were bleeped not Rap or Hip Hop artists. I do understand what you say about vulgarities in music. Because of that we aren't loved by Ccongress, like the Film industry is today. For a lobby they can send their most well known actor Tom Hanks, who are we going to send? Our best selling artist Emimem?
But there are many talented Hip Hop artist that do have something important to say and just as many that don't. Lauryn Hill v. 2 Live Crew
I look at it this way. The older generation doesn't like what the next one does, and that's what makes it fun. My parents hated punk and safety pins, my Grandparents hated the Stones and Beatle for thier long hair. Older people hated Sinatra for his Mafia connections and he was friends with Sammy Davis Jr, OMG! a Black Man and on an on. It's all OK as long as you don't take it too seriously. On the other hand, I do listen to and want to know what my kids are doing. You have to be the parent, not the record industry.
-John |
JMoore
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 02:11 pm: |
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Todd,
Love the Talking Heads!
-John |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 02:13 pm: |
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Rob,
It was Blue Thunder....
Bjork's fine, too.... lol...
Thing is, look at reruns of ER compared to the current season's stuff... heck, look at TV today compared to movies from the 70s and 80s... it's like Perrone pointed out, what you can do at home with a DAT recorder beats what was done in professional studios 20 years ago.
Okay, so, I have a couple of mikes and a guitar, set up a drum kit, (heck, bagpipes and fiddle).. Write some tunes, record 'em myself. Tinker on it on the PC... at that point, just using what's on hand. Then buy in bulk a whole spool of blank CDs, and burn 'em, print a bunch of jewel case covers, and get 'em packaged... a small local band with a sharp head on their shoulders can get the cost of a CD run down quite a bit, and have no-one else involved...
-L
PS: Paul, BNL is great, too! |
TPH (Snowman)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 03:10 pm: |
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-How many CD's you buy v. burn a month: I've owned a burner for over a year and have burned maybe 8 songs total.
-How many DVD's or games you buy v. CD's a month:
Games, a big zero, they do nothing for me. Just got a DVD player in December and I doubt I'll own many. I rent them, see them once and that's enough. I buy maybe 2 music CD's a year now because of prices.
-What would you like to see from the Music Industy or where are we going wrong? Price, price, price. I just refuse to pay that much money for a CD, it's a joke.
I like and listen to the following: John Hiatt, Van Morrison, Stones, Van Halen (with Dave), Talking Heads, Tina Turner, Bonnie Raitt, Chris Isaak, Crash Test Dummies, Strangefolk, Aretha Franklin, B-52's (sorry), Led Lepplin, Bob Marley, Allman Brothers, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Marshall Tucker Band and our household favorite "The Neville Brothers". I also recently discovered the music of Robert Johnson, Son House and many other fine Bluesman. Truly without them the above might not have ever happened. |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 05:23 pm: |
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perrone, i just downloaded some.. they diced up that funky version of that herbie hancock song, cant remember the name but i think it's similar. searched bn.com and found they are on a blue note compilation called jazz chillout all the samples sound good.
thanks fro the tip.
rd |
perroneford
| | Posted on Friday, January 17, 2003 - 10:52 pm: |
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Tukka Yoots Riddim is the one to get. And Cantaloop. Those are the ones that were club hits.
-P |
Robert Sublett (Rubisco98)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 12:12 am: |
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Here's what's framed in my house thus far...
Many posters rolled up just waiting for their chance to be displayed..
 |
Robert Sublett (Rubisco98)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 12:22 am: |
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The only CD I've purchased within the last year was "THE VINES", excellent disk, only one song that I didn't enjoy thoroughly. This new heavy cloned rock crap just doesn't have any heart, at least for me it doesn't. It's not about selling records, it's about bringing on a good vibe, making someone happy w/o trying too hard The Dead Milkmen were always good at making me smile and they suck! That's what's great about them. Anyhow, the above pics show a Blind Melon show that was cancelled due to Shannon Hoon's death, a very rare Pearl Jam poster s&n from when they played here in Knoxvegas, a rare Nirvana poster s&n by the artist Frank Kozik, another rare Nirvana poster from their Aussie leg of their Nevermind tour with a ticket signed in person by Kurt Cobain (not in aussie but in FL) but I framed it with the poster anyhow and finally a cheesey Dead Milmen poster which most people look at and say, who the hell are the Dead Milkmen? Oh well.. Later.. Rob |
Leslie N. Bright (Leslie)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 11:50 am: |
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Rob, you punk rock girl, you'll dance to anything, won't ya? And, how'd you get that car? Did your parents drive it up here from the Bahamas?
-L |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 01:28 pm: |
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I haven't bought many CD's lately, either. There isn't much coming out right now that I feel like paying $15-$18 for. The CD's I tend to get are for the most part scaninavian releases.
I don't download mp3's. Two reasons for that, For one, I find it to be a royal pain in the ass to sift through the myriad of mp3 sites whith all their pop ups, redirects, useless links and attempted spyware programs. I have no interest in any of the "Napster" like services either, too much of a security risk for my taste.
The other reason is copyright. I will not shoplift from a store, so how is downloading someones intellectual work as an mp3 any different? Unless an artist distributes their work freely, downloading an unauthorized mp3 is stealing in my book.
For the same reason I will not use any copyrighted music on the DiscoWeb videos. Sure, there is music out there that is far better than what I can create myself, but securing the proper licenses and permissions would just bring up the cost too much.
I do have a large collection of mp3's, however. I have a 20Gb MP3 player, and I ripped most of my CD collection and loaded it up to that. This is perfectly legal, and it is very convenient to be able to carry my entire CD collection in a device not larger than a Discman.
Downloads is the distribution model the recording industry should take a closer look at, I think. If a record company had a nice, easy to navigate content library with their entire catalog available on line, I would be perfectly willing to pay a reasonable fee to be be able to download the music I want. $1 per mp3, any 10 for $5 or something along those lines would seem perfectly reasonable to me. Other formats should be available as well, if someone wants to download wav files they can burn to a CD, they should be able to do so for a fee, also.
The recording industry needs to wake up and realize that the Internet is not going away. Technology can't be stopped. New formats and storage methods will be introduced at a rapid pace. The industry can either fight it, or jump on the bandwagon. The earning potential is there, too. Once the content has been produced, the only cost to the industry would be to maintain the servers and proper bandwidth, which has to be a lot cheaper than producing and distributing millions of physical CD's that end up collecting dust at Walmart.
This model has been used successfully by the software industry for years, I see no reason why it should not work for the music industry also. |
Mel A. (Krawlrovr)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 01:39 pm: |
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Incubus, Coldplay, Ben Folds, 311, Radiohead, the Beatles, Dream Theatre, Nirvana, Logh, Thursday, Ace Troubleshooter, the Ataris, old school Hoobastank, Rage Against the Machine, the Refused, Pink Floyd, Metallica. But when I wheel, it's always jazz or funk |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 03:33 pm: |
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ax,
i have a craving for new music. i dont have access to other musics as pittsburgh is a small city and we dont have a very diverese radio selection. i resort to downloading mp3's as a way of finding new music. usually buy searching for songs i know i like and then browsing peoples directories that have those songs downloaded. i find bands i dont know of and download. it is a random process but what tends to work.
i have collected 1200 or so mp3s of test music. i have none burned to cd. i'd say for every ten mp3's i download i end up buying the CD in the store. not because i feal guilty, but because i am anal about the quality of the CD and i want the names of the songs and the artwork that was intended to go with it.
many progressive artists realize there are folks out there who do what i do and some tender thier songs for free. great place to find this is on amazon.com they have a huge selection of FREE mp3 downloads from artists that would rather be heard and possibly make money than be poor and without a job.
also you can goto yahoo 'launch' website and listen to streaming radio services, you just need to pick a genre and it will pump out songs. i have found a few new bands this way.
if you look back into history, specifically in great britan when the radio became popularized you will find that the musician's unions were fearing if you can hear a song on the radio for free, why would anyone pay to see a live musician? legislation went thru requiring a certain percentage (that i dont recall) of music on radio bbc to be 'live recordings' the resulted in all those great bbc session that are bootlegs, like the ones led zepplin, pink floyd and jimmy hendrix fans search for in small record shops.
point is want till the 1980's that the bbc finally realized radio wouldn't put musicians out of business... it only helped the business ad ended the restriction. or at least that the version i remember reading.
rd |
Tom V (Cozmo)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 03:39 pm: |
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Rubisco
You're no supposed to like The Dead Milkmen let alone know who they are. You're too young and from TN. They are one of my favorites if I were a band I would be just like them, well almost, its just shockingly rare for me to find someone else that knows who they are.
Tom |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 03:49 pm: |
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bitchin' camaro donuts on my lawn |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 03:55 pm: |
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Like I said, if an artist publishes their work on the internet in order to be heard, that's fine. There is nothing wrong with with downloading that music.
On the other hand, if an artist don't want their work published that way, there is no way that you can justify your "right" to download that work just because some pimple-faced 14 year old ripped the bands CD and put the mp3's on his homepage. It's stealing, no matter how you look at it.
This is exactly why I think the music business needs to step up to the plate. If they were smart, they would make some songs available for free to get new artists exposed. If you like what you hear, you can download more, of higher quality for a nominal fee, or you can order the entire CD and have it shipped to you with all the artwork, or you can download the artwork, too. Some sites are doing this already, and I think it is the distribution model of the future. If done right, it's a win-win situation for everyone, except Walmart. |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 05:06 pm: |
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I agree with Axel. A musicians material is IP (intellectual property). They should recieve some kind of compensation for the effort. Ripping for yourself is ok. Distributing that material to others is a problem.
As for the music business, they are operating under an old business model that doesn't work with the new technology. They need to adopt the copy protection scheme of the software industry. Protect IP. Software and music are now the same. Its all bytes. You buy music you get a activation number. That way you can install it on all your own machines. The music industry needs to stop attacking technology and rethink strategy.
Now that doesn't address why their sales are down. The current product is still mediocre. Not much difference between some of todays bands and the WWF.
Mark |
Rob Davison (Pokerob)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 05:49 pm: |
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i guess i'm a theif. actually society has made things so warped that i feel if you arent stealing of off the big guys you aren't getting your fair share. like the auto insurace statistics state that 50% of your rates are becasue people inflate claims and fake shit. well if i am making a claim you better believe i'm boosting the claim, if i dont i'll be on the loosing end of the statistic.
same goes for software. i buy what isn't given to me.. why dont i buy all the software? becasue the make it so high priced i cant justify it, why is it high priced becaue 9 out of ten users have a borrowed copy.
and then we arrive at music.. same thing.
it's all justified in my my , your honor.
rd |
perroneford
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 06:08 pm: |
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While I generally agree with Axel here, I make one exception (selfish or not) to meet my needs. And that is, I don't have the means to "rip" the hundreds and hundreds of vinyl records I have in my collection from my days as a DJ. There are also a great many records that I have owned and have given to other people, mostly DJ's.
I have bought original copies of those records, I have enticed others to go and buy perhaps hundreds of copies of that same music. I feel no guilt in downloading MP3s of that material.
To some degree, I don't feel guilt in downloading music of deceased artists. Much of what I listen to is older music.
But like, Axel said, I would be perfectly willing to pay for downloading high quality mp3s from licensed sites. The problem with this of course, is that by the time the record companies agree to offer this kind of service, there will be a new paradigm. They are always far too late in listening to what people really want. Exceptions exist in certain genres of music, most notably rap, and house/dance. This is because DJs play exceptionally large roles in this style of music and the artist and the DJs often work together to get the music to the people.
-P |
John Moore (Jmoore)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 07:48 pm: |
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The record companys do have a legal site to download, it's:
http://www.pressplay.com/
Check out the "tour site" button. This site features music from Universal and Sony.
-John
PS: Bitchin' Camero, Bitchin' Camero, I ran over my neighbor, .... Because my dad is the mayor...
LOL!
Robert, cool PJ poster. I have serval litographs my self, from Pearl Jam, Rage Against the Machine and Springsteen. |
cheap bastard
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 08:02 pm: |
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I download lots of music. I find KAzaa to be one of the better programs. If you are trying to get old shows or new shows. Grateful Dead Phsih Widespread bela fleck sting cheese etc etc the list goes on www.furthurnet.com <--excellent resource for any live music. |
Chad Meyer (Ccdm3)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 08:50 pm: |
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I listen to "electronic" music primarily. It started about 10 years ago when I was exposed to the "rave" scene. I focus mainly on DJ sets. A good DJ can hold your attention for the duration of a 80 minute disc. It is not a single driven genre like most others. I truely enjoy most forms of music though, but like many have pointed out it is hard to find a solid CD these days. I will always support artists who have the talent to write/produce/perform their music,and have some vision to put out music that is experimental like Prince or Lenny Kravitz. Anyway...that's part of my .02.
Chad |
Robert Sublett (Rubisco98)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 10:59 pm: |
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I'm glad to see some Disco owners actually know of the Milkmen. I started listening back in sixth grade and haven't ever stopped.
And Leslie, I must be kidding the Bahamas are lslands..
Tom V Cosmo or whatever your name was(I'm too lazy to scroll back up) I'm a fu*(king old 28 yr old man, and glad to see another on here that enjoys them as much as I. I have a couple of Milmen bootleg videos which have all of their official MTV style videos, interviews, and a concert or two which kick some ass.
John, the PJ poster came from the source, Ames Bros. or something like that. My wife was actually the one I bought it for. Just got her a WEEZER poster by Jermaine, yet another to be framed. I've got a Nirvana poster from a show that was cancelled due to Kurt's death as well, kinda rare shit now a days. Oh well.. Off to bed.. Rob |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 08:33 am: |
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Quote:The record companys do have a legal site to download, it's:
http://www.pressplay.com/
I didn't know that. I checked the site out, and it seems to have the features I was describing. The concept seems very reasonable. $9.95/month for a subscription that gives you unlimited copy protected downloads, and a purchase option that gives you ownership of any file you want so you can keep it forever and do anything you want such as burning a cd and/or putting it on an mp3 player. I will be signing up for this, $18 per 20 permanent downloads I choose that I can legally put on my mp3 player or a CD and keep forever is a lot better than $18 for a CD with one or two good songs.
They should add one more option, though. You should be able to purchase individual downloads without having to subscribe to anything. Maybe there is an option for that, but I didn't see it.
This is the future of music distribution. My only complaint is that the music industry needs to do a better job of getting the word out about this kind of service. I think this can be very successful for them and for the artists that are part of it, and that is a good thing.
The next thing they should look at, if they haven't already, is an easy way for new bands to get into this distribution model. Forget the old style exclusive contracts with their huge advances, and let any new band submit their work online. As long as the recording meets a certain technical criteria (Which should not be hard, quality recording equipment is dirt cheap these days), it goes on the servers. If the music sells, the band and the company split the profits. If it doesn't, too bad, but at least the band got some exposure. Build a good search engine to find the new stuff, and the sky is the limit.......
And if a band becomes popular this way, there is of course nothing to stop the music company from investing further in them, put them on the road for live shows and so on. Who knows, the next Elvis or Rolling Stones may be discovered through this model... |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 08:52 am: |
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Quote:"While I generally agree with Axel here, I make one exception (selfish or not) to meet my needs. And that is, I don't have the means to rip the hundreds and hundreds of vinyl records I have in my collection from my days as a DJ."
While I don't know the technical legality of it, I would say that if you already have purchased a recording on whatever medium, you are not doing anything wrong by obtaining a digital copy of that same recording. I am in the same situation. I have a large collection of vinyl from my college days. My mp3 player have the capability of being hooked to my stereo so I can make mp3's of those. It's time consuming however, so whether I actually do the conversion myself or obtain it elsewhere, I don't see that it makes any difference, as long at it is of a recording I already legally have in my posession.
In my opinion, this is no different than when you get a new pc. You had a licence to run a certian program on your old pc. You don't have a physical copy of the disks, because you downloaded the program directly from the software company. (Norton antivurus, for example) As long as you have your license information, you can legally download the program again to your new PC. (Symantec has this feature)
From what I read, the pressplay.com subscription works this way, too. They will let you move your collection of licensed, downloaded music from one pc to another through some kind of autosynch feature. |
John Moore (Jmoore)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 10:08 am: |
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Axel,
You are right, the way the copywrite law is written, if you buy are record you are allowed to make a copy for your personal use.
I too believe that Pressplay.com is part of the future of music distribution. Legal, good copies of music. But if you didn't notice, here's it's problem. Pressplay only has music from two of the five major distribution companies, Sony and Univeral. You won't find any music from BMG, EMD or WEA. For a site like pressplay.com to be really successful, you need all record companies on board, or someone will have to have multiple subscripton servies.
-John |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 10:30 am: |
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Yes, I did notice that Pressplay only has music from Sony and Universal, and that is a drawback. All the companies need to be part of the same service. They can still retain their individual copyright, technologically it should be no problem to route the proper payments to the right owner. In the investment banking world where I work, we do this kind of routing every single day. Pressplay, or whichever site ends up being the major player, needs to be a clearinghouse for all the major distribution companies, AND for the little, independent guy too, in order to be really successful.
It is certainly a step in the right direction, though. |
Eric N (Grnrvr)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 10:50 am: |
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I don't download MP3s for my jukebox.. I don't like anything that is going to open up my hard drive for other people to pull files off plus, most MP3s that you can down load are at 64k-128K. I don't think that the quality is very good at those levels. I buy the CD and convert them to MP3s myself at about 160K-256K and then load them onto my MP3 player. |
Axel Haakonsen (Axel)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 11:32 am: |
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That's the same reason why I don't download mp3's now. That's also why I like the Pressplay concept, with it's high quality, legal downloads, and no opening up of my hard drive. I have no problem with paying a nominal fee for that privilege. |
perroneford
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 05:11 pm: |
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Where are you guy getting your MP3? I find most of the MP3s that I download are at least 256 and quite often 320s.
I use WinMX and find it to be quite good.
Eric,
You need not open your computer to anything just because you download mp3's. Pop me an email privately and I'll explain the technical issues to you. Remember, I do computer security for a living.
-P |
Eric N (Grnrvr)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 09:20 pm: |
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That's OK Perrone, I am happy with just buying the CD and converting them myself. |
Phillip Perkinson (R0ver4x4)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 09:44 pm: |
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does anyone have the New Years Phish show? |
James F.
| | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 11:02 am: |
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Phish NYE run is streaming at nugs.net, and you can buy the soundboard mp3's from livephish.com. I'm sure there are auds you can get on furthernet. |
Phillip Perkinson (R0ver4x4)
| | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 11:11 am: |
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nah its not on furthurnet. I wanted to burn it on CD free. |
markp
| | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 11:59 am: |
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More reasons why the recording industry is headed for a crash.
Music Exec: ISPs Must Pay Up for Music-Swapping
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/825685/posts
Lets tax everyone. Welfare for the music industry!
- Mark |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 01:44 pm: |
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I'll draw a parallel here:
Reign of modernism will end in 21st century, critics contend
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/825959/posts?page=1
Music is Art. The recording industry is focused on the wrong thing, it's not piracy, it's product. Like an alchoholic, you have to hit bottom before you can get better.
- Mark |
perroneford
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 21, 2003 - 10:37 am: |
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I thought this article was absolutely on-point:
"Napsterization" of Video?
Steal This Song
Opinion by Charlie White, Senior Producer, Digital Media Net
Adapt to New Technology or Die!
Let's take a dip into the Dark Side of copyright law -- the one where record companies have a double ripoff going on.
As digital video editing becomes more prevalent in our society, it becomes more newsworthy. For instance, the other day there was a report of guerilla digi-vid cutters taking liberties with George Lucas's Star Wars Episode I, where the rogue editors re-dubbed most of the inane things uttered by that annoying character, Jar-Jar Binks. Nice work, troops!
But wait. As an editor, how would you feel if someone got their hands on one of your prime projects, one that you spent the better part of a year editing, and turned it into something completely different? Then, say they took that new and "improved" edition and sold it on the street, making profits on your work and pre-empting legitimate sales of it -- effectively taking food from your mouth. This, friends, is the reason for copyright laws. Lock 'em up and throw away the key, says I.
That said, let's take a dip into the Dark Side of copyright law -- where record companies have a double ripoff going on. First, they make a "deal" with some talented, but unfortunately business-challenged musician. For every CD the company sells of this artist's work, the artist himself gets about a nickel, if he's lucky. Then, on the other side of this grim equation, consumers are charged (gouged) $17 for a CD that has only one or two good songs on it.
Sounds like a pretty good racket to me. Get your content for next to nothing, promote it every which way, and then sell it for its weight in gold. Granted, the record companies do have to spend some money to make money, but what the record companies should be bringing to the table here is good musical judgment and selectivity. From what I can see (and hear), not much selectivity is actually going on. As they have for decades, the tin-eared record companies dictate what everyone will hear by seemingly throwing darts at a list of hapless musicians tacked to a dart board. Then trend-aware buyers snap up whatever they're told to buy by the constant promotion and propaganda machine.
The problem with all this is that the sales of recorded materials is based on an old-fashioned reality that doesn't hold true any more: It used to be extremely difficult to get that music from the artist to you. Still clinging to that premise, the weasels at record companies stall or quash any attempt to lubricate that channel where music flows from artist to listener. Look back about a decade, and you'll see a perfect example of this -- the ill-fated DAT (digital audio tape) as a consumer-based distribution format. Even though the new format represented a vast improvement over the ubiquitous audio cassettes, record companies were totally opposed to any format that could make perfect copies of their products, and so these powerful corporations effectively eliminated the format through both neglect and subterfuge. That's a laugh. Imagine a company quashing a method of distributing its products because it's too easy to use and its quality is too high.
Now jump ahead ten years, to the present, and we see a distribution method that makes using DAT tapes look as difficult as working in a coal mine. That's right, it's the MP3 format, and record companies are bending over backward to keep us from using it. It's too easy, too convenient, and the record companies are running scared. At first, the labels hid their collective heads in the sand, hoping the digital music revolution would simply go away. Now they're doing all they can to add as much friction to the process. As you may agree, this isn't going to work. There's no stopping technological progress. And speaking of progress, now there's a new MP3 format, called MP3Pro, that can bring you the same music quality at half the file size. But the record companies don't like it. Why? Well, there's no provision for copy protection in there, so they won't be able to control how you use the music. Note to record companies: You don't get to decide how people listen to music any more. Listeners do.
I keep thinking that if this music were priced reasonably, there would be no need to steal it. I think the way to ensure that it's reasonably priced is to remove from this transaction all the bloodsuckers who aren't musicians and who are leeches on the creativity and skill of those who are. Advances in digital audio production have already set many musicians free to explore their own muse without record company jackals breathing down their necks. Beyond that, the vast delivery system that is the Internet has the distribution chops to leapfrog the record companies and all their hangers-on.
Don't get me wrong -- I was a professional musician for 16 years, and don't think musicians should work for free, ever. I also know that slavery was outlawed a long time ago, and it's time for the best musicians to emancipate themselves from these blood-sucking greedmeisters at the record labels. Let's lubricate the channel between musicians and their audiences. Why not just steal music from the record companies (easy enough to do), then send a buck for every song you grab directly to whoever performed it? It would be like shareware, only with music instead of computer software.
And finally, as a digital video editor, learn from this. Remember to price your products reasonably, because if you're price-gouging your customers, and your products are easily stolen, in this juked-up distribution environment, video files are next in line for "napsterization." Learn that if a new technological innovation comes along, don't just sit there and be comfortable with what you're using now. Don't think that it will just go away. Embrace it. Keep yourself current. There's no stopping the tide of technology. Go with the flow (of technology), and the flow (of cash) will come back to you.
Charlie White has been writing about new media and digital video since it was the laughingstock of the television industry. A technology journalist and columnist for the past eight years, White is also an Emmy-winning producer, video editor and shot-calling PBS TV director. Talk back -- Send Chazz a note at cwhite@digitalmedianet.com. |
James F.
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 21, 2003 - 11:13 am: |
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Phillip- The entire run is sitting at phatphiles.org under Greg's Picks. Its an aud but I am not aware of the quality. Have Fun. |
John Moore (Jmoore)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 21, 2003 - 12:16 pm: |
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P-
Makes me sound kinda like a bad guy! "blood-sucking greedmeisters" That's nice!
I agree that too that Record Companies do need to figure out how to make the internet work for them and their artists.
-John |
perroneford
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 21, 2003 - 12:48 pm: |
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Well,
I wasn't trying to paint you in so poor a light, but the fact is, the record companies have certainly not modified their price structure to reflect the reduced costs of distribution. The costs to record, mix, produce, copy, and distribute music today have all come down due to the benefits of technology, consilidation, etc. In fact, record companies have raised relative prices (or so it seems) as though making and distributing music is harder today than 25 years ago when 8 tracks and LPs were the medium of choice.
I think the backlash was inevitable. Similar inane rules and laws have met their fate. The 55mph speed law is a similar one. As cars became more fuel efficient than ever, and were capable of safely handling triple-digit speeds, that bad law just hung around while us "lawbreakers" sped anyway. Eventually, it just became to difficult to enforce. Much the same will happen with mp3s and record companies. You guys will try to sue your way into profit again and that will fail, and you'll jump on the bandwagon years to late for anyone to care. I suspect we are less than 10 years away from the great majority of artists from bypassing record companies completely.
The average $3000 computer with pro-tools, a good Mackie or Carvin board, and some talented people working post can produce a very viable recording. You won't have the polished Top 40 sound, but in most genres of music this is immaterial. Top 40 and Country will be the staple of the industry, and most of the rest will be moved out of your studios and into larger home or small recording shops. They will distribute via internet for a fraction of what the big boys charge, they can get radio and club drops just as easily by sending mp3 promos to the pools. By the time they come to the big boys, they will have sevaral singles prepared and will be looking for concert and video deals. And with the prolifiration of digital video and Adobe Premiere/After Effects or Final Cup Pro, they will be able to make their own videos for $20k or so, and have it rival the stuff you guys are spending on unproven acts.
I really think record companies are in trouble. There is only so much Tiger Beat and CMT stuff to go around.
-P |
Read (Read)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 21, 2003 - 03:10 pm: |
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Dead Milkmen fans unite!
Can someone feed the big lizard in my back yard? I can’t afford to feed it any more. All my money now goes to my D-90. |
honu
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 22, 2003 - 02:07 am: |
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hey all, phil i used to follow the dead from 85 until 93, hardcore style. Vending, swinging on shakedown, selling veggie burritos, and just seeing the boys do there magic on stage.
I listen to all kinds of music. Including the dead milkmen (boy there is a blast from the highschool past)
anyway i have tons of live dead as well as other bands. I only collect and trade super high quality material. the same or better than the dicks picks series.
anyway if any of you heads are traders send me an email and we will go from there. I havent done a formal trade in a few years, but i am always looking for super cool stuff. Looking to trade all kinds not just dead. Cheers and hope to hear from you..any of you who are into it. |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 22, 2003 - 03:18 pm: |
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The collapse is accelerating:
Wherehouse Files Chapter 11
The San Diego Union Tribune ^ | 1/22/03 | Frank Green
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/827413/posts
Fewer outlets, fewer sales -> death spiral
Maybe this is the emerging model. I enjoy 'Hot Club of Cowtown' out of Austin. If I go to their website http://www.hotclubofcowtown.com/ you can buy their CD's from Amazon. On the Amazon site you can buy new or used. The used like new are $7.00. Amazon has become the "order fullfillment" arm of Hot Club of Cowtown.
Anyone remember New Riders of the Purple Sage? The Dead helped get them started by playing with them. Good band and some good Country / Rock mix.
- Mark |
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