| Author | Message | ||
     Andrew Clarke (Aclarke) advanced member Username: Aclarke Post Number: 222 Registered: 10-2002 |
OK so the Discovery has 4-channel ABS, right? Correct me where I'm wrong, but this means it has a wheel speed sensor at every wheel, and the ABS pump has the ability to release braking force at any wheel individually as needed. Right?? So, my question is, does the ABS system also have the ability to APPLY brake force at any individual wheel? BTW I posted something similar in a different thread a day or two ago so my apologies if you ignored it there too  | ||
| Ho Chung (Thediscoho) Moderator Username: Thediscoho Post Number: 20 Registered: 02-2002 |
as interesting as ETC may be, a TT front and detroit rear will be more effective AND probably cheaper.... don't you think? The DiscoWeb Store - Videos, DVDs, Tshirts and Stickers | ||
| Carter Simcoe (Carter) Senior member Username: Carter Post Number: 1803 Registered: 04-2002 |
I was about to say the same thing Ho, if you want traction lock that bitch up. | ||
| Michael Noe (Noee) advanced member Username: Noee Post Number: 433 Registered: 03-2002 |
Do you mean, "Why would you pay for ETC for a Disco 1" | ||
| Mark & Bev Preston (Markp) Advanced member Username: Markp Post Number: 130 Registered: 02-2002 |
While it probably is technically feasible, I'll have to agree with everyone else. Not to say that I haven't thought about it. Would a DII ABS/ETC fit in a DI. Maybe. I had the opportunity to watch 3 different trucks climb a broken down rock/shale hill a few years ago. 1 - a D90 with open diffs, 2 - a D90 with lockers, 3 - a DII with ETC. The first D90 had trouble but made it up. The rock and shale was causing traction problems. Solution was 'give it hell'. The second D90 walked up like a walk in the park. The DII had to take several shots at it. A little better than the first D90, but not much. The rock/shale would slip out from under a tire and cause spin, ETC would kick in and transfer power but there was a 1/2 to 3/4 rotation before this would happen. Now imagine all four tires doing the same thing. Basically the rocks flying but little forward progress. He needed speed and 'give it hell' to make it up. Lockers it is. - Mark | ||
| Greg (Gparrish) advanced member Username: Gparrish Post Number: 1015 Registered: 04-2002 |
Well, my limited experience has told me so far that my ETC is great for on road driving in inclimate weather. Up in PA, it works great on snow and rain, or just general driving. For off road driving, it seems to suck in lots of situations as pointed out above. The ETC sucks the power and momentum out of your movement just when you seem to need it most. I think the best all around daily driver and off roading situation may be a combination of ETC on road, locked CDL with switchable front/rear lockers when off road. That way, you get the reaction speed of ABS/ETC when on road, but you can resort to locked diffs when off road with NO ABS/ETC. | ||
| Andrew Clarke (Aclarke) advanced member Username: Aclarke Post Number: 225 Registered: 10-2002 |
All good points, but my question is still, "can the ABS pump apply braking pressure to one wheel at a time?" I know that lockers front and rear are a better off-road solution than ETC. At this point this conversation is mostly theoretical, but ... well ... you're all going to laugh at me for this (go ahead) I've been thinking that it MIGHT not be that expensive to fabricate a chip that measures wheelspin and operates the ABS pump accordingly. I don't really know much about this sort of stuff but I'm very interested and am trying to learn as much as I can. If I or somebody made such a device, it would have to be tested rather extensively before it was recommended for general on-road use. I'd feel a lot more comfortable using it in an "occasional use environment" like off-roading where I don't have to worry about it misbehaving on a stretch of black ice around a corner and braking both outside wheels or something! I can see a lot of advantages to a system like this too. You could lock individual wheels quite easily with the right software, for instance. | ||
| Andrew Clarke (Aclarke) advanced member Username: Aclarke Post Number: 227 Registered: 10-2002 |
Also Ho, I went to this one web site (what was the URL again, darn) and a TT/Detroit setup will cost $950 in hardware alone, not to mention installation of a couple hundred more if you're not a DIY sort of person. It's not inconceivable (I keep using that word. I do not think that word means what I think it means) that an aftermarket ETC system could cost quite a bit less than that. | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior member Username: Leslie Post Number: 1762 Registered: 02-2002 |
lol, I like the P.B. reference there, Andrew.... Now, just wonderin' here.... Doesn't an ABS system essentially just momentarily release the brakes, over an over, very quickly? Whereas ETC actually brakes independently each wheel for you.... I think it'd take a lot more to accomplish adding ETC to a D1 than it would to just lock it up... Brake-swap, sensors, ECU, then, you have to get it to work right, troubleshoot it out... labor alone would probably be a lot more than just swapping diffs.... I don't think you could get ETC into a D1 for less than $2k, or at best-case, for what a rear Detroit would be to buy and install.... IMHO, FWIW.... -L | ||
| Andrew Clarke (Aclarke) advanced member Username: Aclarke Post Number: 228 Registered: 10-2002 |
Thanks Leslie. That's what I was asking. So the ABS can release braking power from an individual wheel, but cannot APPLY it to an individual wheel? | ||
| John Moore (Jmoore) advanced member Username: Jmoore Post Number: 370 Registered: 10-2002 |
When the TC comes on in my 99D2, it sounds just like the ABS system, a fluttering sound in the dash. You can also feel the brake pedal vibrating. I may be wrong, but I don't think that it is clamping the brake down on one side. It seems like it is "pumping" the pads on and off. -John | ||
| Willie Joubert (Willie) Senior Member Username: Willie Post Number: 81 Registered: 02-2002 |
You sell a ETC kit for a D1 at $400, you will sell them faster than you can make them... | ||
| Greg (Gparrish) advanced member Username: Gparrish Post Number: 1029 Registered: 04-2002 |
I think that's all that TC does is manipulate the ABS system............. correct? | ||
| Michael Noe (Noee) advanced member Username: Noee Post Number: 436 Registered: 03-2002 |
Alright, right out of the D2 shop manual:
The implication is that there are 3 braking modes: Normal Braking Mode ABS Braking Mode Active Braking Mode (ETC/HDC) | ||
| Michael Noe (Noee) advanced member Username: Noee Post Number: 437 Registered: 03-2002 |
How 'bout a little more info...
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| Greg (Gparrish) advanced member Username: Gparrish Post Number: 1049 Registered: 04-2002 |
Thanks Michael, I think that is helpful. |
