| Author | Message | ||
     Keith McFatridge (Mcfatty) New Member Username: Mcfatty Post Number: 4 Registered: 02-2003 |
What are the obstacles, if any, in mounting a hydraulic winch to an 01 Disco? I've heard that the LR steering pump is not up to par for the job. Any feedback would be helpful. | ||
| Joey (Joey4420) Member Username: Joey4420 Post Number: 233 Registered: 04-2003 |
I have been thinking the same thing. I would call MileMarker up and ask. I do know that they offer a secondary PS pump for those with concerns. The big thing to think about is are you going to be steering alot while using the winch. If not, then I don't think you should have and issue. (I have never done any winch yet). But if you do a lot of steering while winching, then a back-up PS pump would be a good Idea, that and the fact that it would be dedicated for this job. Kind of like having a second battery for an electric winch. | ||
| Brent Fox (Bfox) Member Username: Bfox Post Number: 107 Registered: 10-2002 |
I spoke with someone at MM about that very thing. They said that our PS pumps were not up to the job and they referred me to a 4x4 company (can't think of their name right now) who had a package for our trucks. It was basically a GM high output PS pump and brackets. If I remember right the cost was somewhere around $400 plus the winch. That was all the convincing I needed to buy an electric. Brent | ||
| Joey (Joey4420) Member Username: Joey4420 Post Number: 242 Registered: 04-2003 |
Try these guys... http://www.winchesplus.com/index.html $860 for a 12k hydrulic winch $100 for the HD PS pump. The average cost of a 12k warn is around a $1000 or higher....hmmmm seems cheaper to me. | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 832 Registered: 02-2002 |
A D2 is up to pressure (1500 psi) on the ps pump, so it will pull as rated. But it will be very slow. D1 owners are out of luck at around 1100-1200 psi Get the 12k its the same size as the 10k and not much more $$$. Dean ps www.TruckFarm.com was cheaper than that I think. | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 275 Registered: 02-2002 |
Dean, Did you see that they sell a bolt-on pressure gauge? I'd like to see how much pressure the D2 pump puts out. I'd be surprised if it really does output 1500psi. I'm going to buy one just to check out my system. I bought a 1850psi(supposedly) pump and relief valve from 4x4winches.com. After installation, I could barely turn the steering wheel when stopped or going slow. It turned out that the relief valve was set incorrectly and I was getting probably about 300psi to the steering box. Without a gauge, I've had to try to get the relief valve setting correct by feel. Joey, Where would you mount the saginaw pump? It's not as simple as it seems. | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 834 Registered: 02-2002 |
Mike, all I'm going on is what the shop manual says. To test the PS pump it says to pressure test it for no more than 10 seconds (because of heat build up) and that it should be 1500 psi. Look, just try the thing first. If its too slow for you, then try getting a different pump. You can always re-connect the original ps line together again. The important thing for me is that it gets me out if I'm stuck. If it takes 2 minutes instead of 30 secs, well that's better than digging for 3 hours. And in general I think the set-up time for finding a good anchor or tying two vehicles together or whatever is much longer than the actual winching time anyway, unless its a really long pull. If you put on a more powerful pump, you might also need a cooling radiator and/or expansion tank, so keep that in mind. Dean | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 276 Registered: 02-2002 |
Dean, I'm not concerned about the speed of the winch. With the stock pump, my MM was not doing the job. I was bringing out the snatch block on even somewhat easy pulls. Imagine how slow the MM is with a snatch block. Keep in mind that higher psi doesn't make the winch faster, its the volume of the output. | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 835 Registered: 02-2002 |
Mike, As I have said over and over again, the D1 is not up to pressure! You have a D1, Keith is asking about a D2. Dean | ||
| Keith McFatridge (Mcfatty) New Member Username: Mcfatty Post Number: 5 Registered: 02-2003 |
I e-mailed MM regarding the D2 Pump. Gave them the specs and all. I'll post their response as soon as I get it. It does appear that the PSA pump may be adequate, but let's see what MM position is. | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 836 Registered: 02-2002 |
I checked the manual again last night. It says the maximum pressure is 1500 psi, but that it should test at idle between 1200 and 1500 psi, so I guess it may depend on a few factors like age, temperature, flow rate in the winch, etc. Then again, I would expect this same to occur for any other hydraulic pump. I've not yet been really stuck hard, but what I have seen in similar situations compared to other 8-9.5K electrics (my MM is the 12K) is that it is equally or more powerful (it has never stalled when the electrics have). More time will tell, but right now I am happy with it on the D2. Interestingly, it is almost completely silent, so you get to hear the cable stretching and creaking! Dean | ||
| thom mathie (Muskyman) Senior Member Username: Muskyman Post Number: 346 Registered: 11-2002 |
Dean, that has always been the part that scares people about my MM...as the cable is stacking the sounds are very loud. I have a load holding valve on mine so you can spool in and stop the winch at any time anywhere in a pull with zero movement after the button is released. when you are using the winch to pull motors or move logs or other odd jobs it makes the winch much much more user friendly. I still would like to see someone with a well set up MM say they would go back to electric? THOM | ||
| OLIVER CLOTHSOFF (Everythingleaks) Senior Member Username: Everythingleaks Post Number: 313 Registered: 10-2002 |
What about using a ACE pump on the D2? The output is 1958 psi operating pressure. The flow range of the pump is from 7.0 l/min (1.85 US gallons) to 9.25 l/min (2.44 us gallons). The ACE pump will bolt on to any d2 with minimal effort because all the front brackets are designed to accept ACE pumps. All the pulleys are the same on a non-ACE truck as a ACE truck. Another nice thing about this setup is that the belt would be availible at any LR parts source. The only difference between the ACE belt and the non-ACE belt is length. With this setup if you do not wish to power the pump for on-road use you could switch the belt back to the non-ACE belt with little difficulty. the high pressure fitting on the pump is a banjo bolt and the low pressure port is a nipple. The pump operates on Texaco cold climate power assisted steering fluid 14315. This is the same fluid run in the power steering system. For a reservoir the stock ACE unit should work fine. It would just take the place of the current power steering reservoir on the LH side. It is the same size with a divider in the center of the reservoir to house both the power steering fluid and the ACE fluid. I would recommend looking under the hood of a ACE truck and then decide what route to take. If I can help answer any more questions let me know | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 850 Registered: 02-2002 |
Oliver, You have this setup already? What is the upper pressure limit of the MM? I don't have any ACE at all right now so this is something I could do in the future. Dean | ||
| Joey (Joey4420) Member Username: Joey4420 Post Number: 248 Registered: 04-2003 |
$949 with free shipping for a MM12k Hydraulic. Not bad....too bad I don't have the spare cash or the bumper to mount yet. If interested you may want to call and see if they have the adapter kit that you want. No I don't know these people nor have I ever bought from them...just search for good deals. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6763&item=2434 037908 | ||
| OLIVER CLOTHSOFF (Everythingleaks) Senior Member Username: Everythingleaks Post Number: 317 Registered: 10-2002 |
No, I have not performed this add-on. I don't know anything about MM other than what has been posted here on disco web. I was just doing a little brainstorming last night and figured once I put this info out there someone would run with it. The ACE pump spec info is off of RAVE. I know the pulley sizes and belt swap info are correct because I have actually performed this swap from ACE to non-ACE for testing purposes. I heard a story about when the ACE trucks first came out. Some of the people at LRNA would carry a non-ACE belt around with them in case of system failure. Nothing like confidence in the LR engineering dept. | ||
| Frank Rafka (Mongosd2) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Mongosd2 Post Number: 121 Registered: 02-2003 |
Hey Dean, I'm working on that application for my MM. Top end pressure limit on the MM is 1800, so I'm working on the pressure limit problem...let you what I come up with... frank | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 277 Registered: 02-2002 |
I've got a 1850psi pump, so I doubt that an extra 100 psi will hurt the winch. The valve might need to be changed out to one that can handle the extra flow. With that psi, I would probably only get the 9000lb winch because with 1950 psi you would probably end up with slightly over 12000lb. of pull. If you use the 12000 winch you would probably have problems snapping the cable. If the 1950 psi truly presented a problem, you could always plumb in a relief valve before the winch. |
