First real off-road test

Log Out | Topics | Search Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Thread Last Poster Posts Pages Last Post   Closed: New threads not accepted on this page

Author Message   Alan Bates (Alanb) Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 03:30 pm:    Hello All: I have been through my recently aquired 92 RRC to the best of my ability, all new fluids, cap, rotor, wires, plugs, inspections, etc. It has 116k miles on it and appears to be your standard mall crawler rover before I got it. Everything seems to be in great working order, no strange noises from cv's, bearings, or engine. I have added OME HD springs and shocks along with 245/75/16 tires and will be adding a front skid plate and diff quards. I have owned Rovers before this one but they have been of newer vintage with much less miles, my question is what else should I look out for before tackling any moderate trails, and should I worry about anything breaking, like axles, cv's, u-joints, driveshafts, etc. The rover has been great so far, but at this point I am little reluctant about taking it on some serious off-roading trials and be stuck in the middle of nowhere. Any input will be greatly appreciated.   John Cinquegrana (Johnc) Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 04:05 pm:    Alan, it's a Rover not a Jeep. Don't be afraid to take it off-road. You will be surprised at how well it handles off-road. Try to team-up with some LR owners in your area and take it off-road. Enjoy the Rangie. John C. 1988 RRC 1996 D1   Randall Smith Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 05:35 pm:    Alan I would be most concerned about the front diff, and the tie rod. The tie rod is directly behind the front axle, and it connects the front wheels together so they turn together. In regards to: "some serious off-roading trials and be stuck in the middle of nowhere"... I personally would never lift a truck without getting longer travel shocks, or at least lowering the upper shock mounts. Randall   AdrianS Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 09:23 am:    Alan Definitely go with longer shocks and extended shock mounts. That will make a big difference. I�ve had my 91RRC for about a year now and the CV�s gave up on me after about two months with the stock tires. Since replacing them I haven�t had any other problems and I�ve been running 245/75�s since then. My truck had 104K when I got it. Good luck and have fun. Adrian 91RRC   John Cinquegrana (Johnc) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 09:31 am:    Here's a pic of Adrian's Rangie:   John Cinquegrana (Johnc) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 09:39 am:    Here's another pic: It's my feeling that the axles and underbody components on the LRs are pertty strong. I don't have any underbody protection other than a rear diff guard (I could not attach the front one w/o removing the panhard rod) and I've never damaged anything under my RR. I have damaged the passenger door (lower section) and the passenger rear 1/4 panel. The driver side 1/4 panel has been protected by the rear muffler. I do have a pair of rock sliders which I need to pick up and install soon. If I had to do it all over again I would start with a 3" lift, longer shocks, longer brake lines, 265/75/16 BFG ATs or MTs, drop cones, rock sliders and front bumper with winch. BTW, our terrain (North East) is pretty rocky and I've never damaged my steering dampner. Just my opinion.   John Cinquegrana (Johnc) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 09:40 am:    Sorry, I can't upload the second pic...   John Cinquegrana (Johnc) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 09:43 am:      Alan Bates (Alanb) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 10:19 am:    Thanks for all the comments, I think it has aleviated some of my fears about taking the old Rover on some rock bashing. I would like to go a little more radical, but the Rover is now also my daily driver and I have to keep it running come Monday morning. I bought it with the intention of building it to become my off-road rover, but had to sell my cushy 4.0se, so now I am trying to get to a happy median between reliable daily driver and weekend off road machine, if thats possible.   John Cinquegrana (Johnc) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 10:32 am:    It certainly is Alan. Adrian uses his RR every day. His commute is a good 15 to 25 minutes (in NJ which is the equivalent to 1.5 to 2 hours driving in the country ). That's the beauty of the LRs, great off-road and on-road.   Peter Carey (Pcarey) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 11:52 am:    If it's your first test be aware of the the softness of the drag link and it's nice vulnerable position. This is what happened on my first 'light' off roading trip. Slipped off an invisible log. Didn't even really feel it till I was on pavement again and wondering why my steering wheel was pointing right. pwc   Peter Carey (Pcarey) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 11:54 am:    That being said, it was a hell of a lot cheaper to fix as compared to my Jeep GC when things go wrong.   Alan Bates (Alanb) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 12:05 pm:    Would installing a front skid guard/steering guard have avoided this situation? I was thinking of purchasing one from Bearmach, which is an aluminum skid with steel brackets, and the price is right.   Alan Bates (Alanb) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 12:18 pm:    Here is pic I found of the Bearmach skid plate:   Blue (Bluegill) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 01:20 pm:    why protect inferior hardware? upgrade the steering links first   John Cinquegrana (Johnc) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 01:23 pm:    Blue is right. I've seen a D90 bend his steering rod in 1 foot of snow. Granted, he is running 33" SS.... But it makes sense to beef up the steering links..   Bill Bettridge (Billb) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 02:43 pm:    Agreed - Go with the RTE drag link and track rod and forget the steering guard - damn thing always hung me up more than protecting anything. FWIW Bill   Dee Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 04:33 pm:    Not sure if DAP still sells the Tie and Track Rod from Bearmach. I bought a set earlier this year the OD is 1.125" and it included 4 new ends that have a zerk fitting for grease. To me it was a great value for both rods and 4 ends $135.00. you will have to paint the rod it is not finished.. and you will have to weld or bolt on a steering stablizer mount. I got a rancho mount for 23.00 I did have the Safari Guard ones a long time ago on my 88 RRC those were 3/4 and cost 225 each. I have not tried it but the pic i have seen show the rod used as a jack point....   Blue (Bluegill) Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 04:51 pm:    DAP has them for $160. Look under "Discovery Series I" and then "Suspension & Driveline" http://www.dap-inc.com/acc_frm.htm I was diggin on these yesterday. The greasable ball joints are key. Are you happy with them Dee? What is the "alloy"?   Dee Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 07:29 pm:    Blue, Well being I'm never realy 100% happy with anything I buy I had to mill 2 flats on one end of each rod to allow for adjusting. I also need to drill the corners of the jamb nuts for safety wire. And im not too keen about Nylocks holding the ends in place i may put the slotted nuts and cotter pin them Not sure of the alloy, I asked Dap when i bought it there answer was steel...   Bryan Wainscott (Bwainscott) Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 02:05 pm:    Dee, What are the safety wires for? I just rebuilt my droparm ball joint and was looking at the stock drag link and how flimsy it really is. I was thinking about getting the DAP ones. If you had to do it all over again would you have bought the Rovertym ones or the DAP ones?   Blue (Bluegill) Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 03:52 pm:    I assume retention wires or pins so that the nuts can't work themselves loose. Also milled flats so he doesn't have to look at pipe wrench grooves on the link. Dee's anal like that...his undercarriage is cleaner than my garage floor   Dee Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 05:40 pm:    Anal... LOL to many years as a Machinist... Blue that's Too funny My Disco is also cleaner than my garage.. Needed it clean to show off my Diff Guards.. I milled the flats by hand with a bench grinder and flat file . the flats are within .005" of being parallel. So yes I am ANAL ... I wanted an easy point for adjustments in the future. About the holes needing to be drilled in the "Jamb Nuts" I was advised to secure them better. easiest way I can see is to drill and safety wire.. Prior to being a machinist I was an Air frames Mechanic... So I guess than makes me major league ANAL now that just an outlook on things not a preference no rainbow stickers here... A few years back when I owned my 88 Rangie I made the mistake of pulling into a local mom and pop shop for an alignment the only mechanic ( and his skills as such are disputable) was a old drunken idiot. I was not driving bad but I thought id pop in there during lunch and have it checked. I did set the new rods to less than 1/16 from the originals and it was driving ok. like I said I just wanted it checked to see how close I really was. Well he was not happy at all about having to work on a LR he was screaming and banging on things in the service pit, he was cursing bla bla dam British POS. Then after I asked him not to use a pipe wrench he then decided to use the next best thing a large set of channel locks to adjust the rods. He pecker-marked all over the rods marring its finish. After an hour of waiting this fool claimed he could not align it, he blamed it on the rear trail arms claimed he need to cut 1/2 off the right side and re-weld it. Needless to say I did not pay and wanted a pound of flesh for marring up the rods. This fool was not worth the effort nor the expense of a good criminal defense lawyer, and of course the owner was not there that was the last time I ever let anyone touch my LR's I replaced the frame bushes the next day that cured the 1/2 " discrepancy in the rear end. Well I never was able to get the alignment rechecked, I was only able to drive the Rangie for a few more weeks until the gutless wonder (3.5) died for good. That's another how I love my LR's story... what mental midget design's a plastic coated pot metal framed timing gear... Its funny I changed the tie and track rods because. The Range Beast stalled on me on the way home from work (Fuel Pump) and when it was the monthly time it needed to be towed home. well in transit it fell 1/2 off the tow trucks cradle, It was dangling by the left front tire for about 100 yards. In retrospect I wish the dam thing would have just flipped (Opps I used the Flip word) and been a total loss. Well both the Tie and Track rods were smiling at me well one was smiling the other was frowning. The Tow Company paid me for cost of new genuine rods and an alignment, yep that was a fight also. When I finally got the check I decided to upgrade with the SG rods. Well it took SG 2 tries to send me the correct rods and I did not get a sticker either Ho, also the paint was very oil soaked. Well being no one else was making this stuff back then I was stuck with it. so I cleaned and painted them it was the only thing on the Rangie that looked new. boy I was proud of those rods...   Dee Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 06:37 pm:    Bryan, I am not sure what RTE has to offer. The Bearmach rods sold by DAP for I guess 169.00 now still seems a good deal remember there also giving 4 new ends and not just the rods.. . Some will argue a thick walled tube is better, well IMO that short of span I doubt if it makes a difference when compared to a solid bar that has a 1.125 OD. The Bearmach Rods are still better than the stocker. for that matter any thing made is an improvement. Rockware offers a Z bent track rod to correct the steering geometry for the large lifts. As for me id rater have a lowered pitman arm to correct that. Besides if you use a thick wall tube it will need machined inserts and those need to be seal welded. that's adding a possible point of failure. If you snap the Bearmach rods I would believe the truck has rolled over several times first and that will be the least of your worries... Some other types I've seen use a chrome molly tube that slide over the stock rod.. Well I like Heavy metal solid rods and the drill and tap is in the rod and not some pressed in insert, keep in simple and stout. Sort of like the "Fat Boy rack I'm making... Paul start making some bars and recoup your tap money ...   Blue (Bluegill) Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:22 pm:    I'm sure that the RTE links are up to the task and then some, but I want new, greasable, joints too.   Bill Bettridge (Billb) Posted on Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 08:56 am:    FYI - I took apart the stock tie rod ends - drilled and tapped them for a zerk - there ya go - greasable ball joints for the princely sum of $0.23/each (cost of zerk). Work fine so far. Bill   Bryan Wainscott (Bwainscott) Posted on Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 05:41 pm:    It sounds like the Bearmach rods are the way to go. I trust a machinists' pov. That is one hell of a deal with greasable tie rod ends included!Thanks Dee So since you are so ANAL about cleanliness can you tell me the best procedure and best cleaner on the market for a 1989 3.9 covered in grease and power steering fluid?   Dee Posted on Friday, August 30, 2002 - 10:45 am:    Bryan, the best procedure have some one else do it... LOL. Well if your sick enough to take on ther task you will need. lots of grease cutting soap. I put the disco up on some car ramps i have a gas powered pressure washer with a low pressure tip. I do this after all muddy trips. You can do it with out one but its a PIA. I had som long handled scrub brushes to get up in the tight area. Take care around the vent ports and electrical and hub seals. If you use simple green keep it off the alu parts and hose it all off or it will corrode the parts... I used Mguriers grease cleaner. DONT USE GUNK it will srtip the undercoating and rot all the plastic and rubber After you drive it a few days you will see all the areas that need fixing... Land Rovers are sealed about as good as old Harley pan heads....   Rob Davison (Pokerob) Posted on Friday, August 30, 2002 - 12:16 pm:    dee, so what if the simple grean eats the aluminum a little bit? do you think it will have a detrimental effect? i always noticed that it will etch into it, but i figured it has to go thru a 1/4" until it starts to effect something, or are you thinking that it is creating a relitive weak spot? just curious rob   Dee Posted on Friday, August 30, 2002 - 03:55 pm:    Rob, no real effect on etching the Alu and if you flush it good and get all the soap off it wont do much harm... I only soap the areas im working and flush good when i move on. The wife almost killed me doing this in our new driveway but it was her car i cleaned last....