| Author | Message | ||
     Glen Hernandez (Polofella26) Member Username: Polofella26 Post Number: 108 Registered: 11-2002 |
The Castor alloys that come on the 94-95 Discoveries...are they made out of aluminum or magnesium. Also..if they are chrome coated....is there a difference? | ||
| Peter Matusov (Pmatusov) Senior Member Username: Pmatusov Post Number: 1431 Registered: 09-2002 |
take a lighter to the wheel, you'll find out quickly. | ||
| Blue (Blue) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Blue Post Number: 1442 Registered: 04-2003 |
LOL | ||
| Glen Hernandez (Polofella26) Member Username: Polofella26 Post Number: 109 Registered: 11-2002 |
Yea...see thats just it. I want to weld on it but I don't know if I should use magnesium rods or attack it with a TIG machine. I want to say that it is magnesium because it looks like it. But I would love to know for sure. Anyone out there know? | ||
| Jack Quinlan (Jsq) Senior Member Username: Jsq Post Number: 620 Registered: 10-2002 |
what exactly are you welding to your wheels Ben Hur? | ||
| Blue (Blue) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Blue Post Number: 1444 Registered: 04-2003 |
they're aluminium | ||
| Clif Ashley (Cta586) Senior Member Username: Cta586 Post Number: 549 Registered: 04-2002 |
Curiosity is killing me as well... If you feel so inclined, please share your plans. | ||
| Chuck Stroud (Str0ud) Member Username: Str0ud Post Number: 47 Registered: 02-2004 |
Clearly he is welding on guides for tank tracks. -Str0ud | ||
| Mike M (Rangeroverhp) Senior Member Username: Rangeroverhp Post Number: 260 Registered: 09-2003 |
Yes. Do tell. | ||
| Glen Hernandez (Polofella26) Member Username: Polofella26 Post Number: 110 Registered: 11-2002 |
Well...I am actually repairing a wheel. I had this baby on a trail and I hit a very hard piece or rock that damaged the outer lip of my wheel, causing a blow out. So, I wanted to make sure what kind of metal I was working with before I blew the rest of the wheel apart. I am using a TIG weld to refill then reshaping the lip to it's original condition. I also believe it is aluminum, however....the profile looke like magnesium. But from my knowledge, they stopped making wheels out of magnesium about 20 years ago. Who knows i guess. | ||
| Wes (Wes) Member Username: Wes Post Number: 241 Registered: 02-2002 |
You're probably trying to save money, but why don't you take it to a professional wheel repair person? | ||
| Glen Hernandez (Polofella26) Member Username: Polofella26 Post Number: 111 Registered: 11-2002 |
Well...they guy that is doing it for me is a proffesional machinist/welder. In fact, he is a technical instructor at a college where I used to fill in at. However, do you know of any professional wheel repair companies? I have confidence in his work but would love to hear of some alternatives. Thanks, Glen H | ||
| Blue (Blue) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Blue Post Number: 1445 Registered: 04-2003 |
I still like the Ben Hur idea | ||
| Dave Statler (Falconx84) Member Username: Falconx84 Post Number: 130 Registered: 02-2004 |
Actually... magnesium won't catch fire in that form. If you're ever camping and use a block of magnesium for a firestarter, trying throwing the block in a fire. Even though the shavings/powder catches fire, the block won't because it is too compacted, the molecules are too close together. | ||
| Glen Hernandez (Polofella26) Member Username: Polofella26 Post Number: 112 Registered: 11-2002 |
I suppose you're right Dave. I like the "Ben Hur" idea too. ha.... Besides, it's cheap and an easy fix. But if anyone else has some more input on this, I could use the advice. Thanks, Glen | ||
| James M. Reed (Utahdog2003) New Member Username: Utahdog2003 Post Number: 22 Registered: 03-2004 |
magnesium's ability to cary a flame is also affected by the purity of the metal. I think most 'mag' wheels are made of some type of alloy...Vanadium, Aluminum etc with Magnesium being the primary component. the torch heat would also be a factor, as your run of the mill campfire wouldn't generate as much heat as a TIG | ||
| Peter Matusov (Pmatusov) Senior Member Username: Pmatusov Post Number: 1436 Registered: 09-2002 |
Dave, pure magnesium oxidizes quickly, and forms an oxide film on the surface that prevents it from spontaneous combustion in the air. But, if you scratch it up, and take a lighter to it, you'll enjoy the show. FWIW, the molecules are nearly as close together in the shavings as they are in a forged chunk of metal. It's just tougher to crack/burn off the oxide film on a bigger piece of metal than it is on shavings. | ||
| Sergei Rodionov (Uzbad) Senior Member Username: Uzbad Post Number: 440 Registered: 08-2003 |
Peter - you still can light up aluminum if you got enough oxygen (can be released by certain other chemicals, while heating  ).. We used to do rocket fuel out of them old aluminium spoons, that we were , ahem.. borrowing from school's dining room Of course we stopped as soon as one of research institutes next to school dumped out piles of circonium rods Those were plain amazing (needs less heat and oxygen to go ). Unless you dont mind some radiation. | ||
| Glen Hernandez (Polofella26) Member Username: Polofella26 Post Number: 113 Registered: 11-2002 |
Wow!...Why did I go to college?...I got all I need in this post. haha. Anyways, I found out that the wheels are indeed made of aluminum...magnesium may be a component of the wheel...but I ran a chemical test on the wheel and it is Aluminum....for those that wanted to know. I used my TIG welder and repaired the damage. Now all I have to do is have it machined. Thanks for the info all! | ||
| James M. Reed (Utahdog2003) New Member Username: Utahdog2003 Post Number: 24 Registered: 03-2004 |
I'm no materials engineer, so take this with a grain of salt (although I was in the bicycle business for years, where I had just about every aluminum related conversation possible!) I understand you damaged the wheel on the trail, so maybe this is your plan all along...so here goes. I'd only use the wheel as a spare. If that wheel is forged and then machined, or cast and then heat treated, then I'd be worried that my repair would still be a strees point on the rim for future problems. Maybe hang that one off the back of the rig? | ||
| Glen Hernandez (Polofella26) Member Username: Polofella26 Post Number: 114 Registered: 11-2002 |
James...From your experience.....what is the worst that can happen. I realize that it will be a weak point on the wheel....I guess I am just looking at the cost of buying a new one. Give me your opinion on using this wheel and what may happen. Thanks, Glen H | ||
| Todd Phenneger (Toddp) Member Username: Toddp Post Number: 197 Registered: 10-2002 |
I've dealt with a few bent or damaged aluminlum wheels. IF they are forged then you can fix them. But if they are cast which the D1 wheel is then I would question the repair. I've had two cast wheels repaired by a well known wheel repair shop that is known for quality work. They warned me that it may not hold and neither repair did. They both eventually broke at the same spot and I discarded the wheels. Now if the wheel is forged then its a different matter. They will bend like a steel wheel and are very repairable. They are maleable, weldable, etc. Wheel repair shops fix hundreds of BBS/Fikse/Kinesis etc wheels every year. With wonderful results. THe exception to this rule are some rare, extraordinary high pressure cast wheels. Kinesis for example has some cast wheels that are very high quality castings. The press is over 5 Stories tall and weighs hundreds of thousands of pounds. It uses immense pressure to squeeze any air out of the castings leavign a cast product that very closely resembles a forged wheel. These wheels, while being very light, are also maleable and weldable with decent results. Hope that helps a little. When you hang out with cars that spend time at race tracks on narrow track tires you see lots of bent wheels. l8r Todd | ||
| James M. Reed (Utahdog2003) New Member Username: Utahdog2003 Post Number: 26 Registered: 03-2004 |
In the world of bicycles, aluminum frames are considered disposable. If you bend one, crack one, badly dent a tube, snap it in half, etc then just put it in the recycle bin. I have no experiences with wheel repair so I'm only basing my point here on the material side of this discussion. Aluminum does not have the elasticity of steel, meaning, steel you can bend once or twice and not snap it. (try this...go to the Home Depot and buy two metal dowels, one steel and one aluminum, then bend both just once. Look at the bend with a glass and you can see cracks in the aluminum. Not so in the steel. Now if you were to straighten the aluminum rod and then fab it up into some structure, where do you think it would fail?) If you crack or break a rim, then, also because of a lack of flexibility, the stress on the rim will focus to the point where the structure is weakest, in this case the repair. It is in this logic that cyclists are told to discard aluminum components that are visibly damaged after accidents. Heck, some MTB component manufacturers actually recomend replacing lightweight aluminum structural components after a full season of competition, visible damage or no. Could you repair the wheel? Sure, and it would look fine. BUT, I wouldn't want to be in that truck on a trail, with the repaired wheel on the outside corner of some rock strewn Colorado switchack dropping down 1000 feet to the valley floor. Now, were this conversation about patching a nonstructural aluminum item, like say the hood of a car, then knock yourself out. But structural stuff? Forged or not, Heat Treated or not, Chemically Treated, Hard Anodized, 6000, 7000, 2000 series Aluminum or whatever, I'd buy a new wheel. Sorry for the length of the post. James |
