| Author | Message | ||
     Shawn McKenzie (Shawn) Member Username: Shawn Post Number: 217 Registered: 10-2002 |
Steve, If the winch shown in your profile isn't electric, what are you using to power it? My understanding is the D1 PS pump won't run a MM. | ||
| Steve Rupp (Steve_rupp) Member Username: Steve_rupp Post Number: 147 Registered: 03-2003 |
It will run a milemarker, but the LR pumps aren't powerful enough to get you maximum rating of the winch. If you are considering the MileMarker, I would email my brother Mike [email protected] or Thom Mathie [email protected]. Thom and my brother know much more about the winch than I do. | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 336 Registered: 02-2002 |
I'm not sure what Thom is planning to do with his MM to power it, but I use a variant of the ZF pump rated at 1850 psi. This is more than enough power for the 9,000 MM. The 9K winch is rated as such at 1500psi, so in theory I should have more than 9K of output. Since the ZF pump replaces the stock pump, you also need a relief valve to lower the pressure to the steering box. There are other options as well, like using a PTO driven isolated pump. The benefit of this is that it will be much quicker than what I did. I like the simplicity of my system; simple install and simple operation. Performance wise, the PTO is the best method. All in all, I'm happy with my setup. I haven't really had a chance to see how it performs on a hard pull yet since I only installed it late fall last year. I've only used it twice since the install on easy pulls: pulling a pizza delivery kid out of a ditch in snowy weather, and pulling myself out of 3' of snow. | ||
| steve herrod (Sherrod) Member Username: Sherrod Post Number: 81 Registered: 02-2003 |
Mike, did you go with the ZF74 pump from 4x4 winch? I have this set up and am very pleased with the outcome. | ||
| Perry Ray Miller (Discojunky) Member Username: Discojunky Post Number: 130 Registered: 03-2003 |
I went with the Mile Marker 12,000lb electric and it works great. Its only a year old and I've only used it a few times so I can't speak for longevity yet but I'm real happy with it so far. Not tying to hyjack the thread just adding to the mile marker issue. | ||
| Aaron Richardet (Draaronr) Senior Member Username: Draaronr Post Number: 520 Registered: 09-2002 |
Perry I was thinking of getting the same winch lately. Other than being slow I am not sure what the negatives would be since it is so large. | ||
| Perry Ray Miller (Discojunky) Member Username: Discojunky Post Number: 131 Registered: 03-2003 |
Yeah, your right Aaron its not real fast but when I'm stuck I'm just happy to be getting on my way again and a little extra time doesn't bother me personally. Its also much cheaper than the others winches but like I said, so far (fingers crossed) its performed very well. | ||
| Steve Rupp (Steve_rupp) Member Username: Steve_rupp Post Number: 152 Registered: 03-2003 |
Aaron, If you're considering an electric winch, think hard about a worm gear setup. Like the Ramsey RE or Superwinch Husky. They are a little slower than the planetary winches, but much more reliable. I've had them all. Don't buy a winch because it is inexpensive. | ||
| Steve Rupp (Steve_rupp) Member Username: Steve_rupp Post Number: 153 Registered: 03-2003 |
The MileMarker is a great winch too, when it is setup correctly. | ||
| Shawn McKenzie (Shawn) Member Username: Shawn Post Number: 218 Registered: 10-2002 |
Thanks for the feedback and suggestions guys. I like the idea of a non-electric winch but have been put off by not knowing how to run one on a D1. My PS system has at least one good leak right now, and maybe more. Looks like the hose terminations are the culprit. If the system was bumped up to 1850 PSI, what kind of hoses would be required? I have a friend in Edmonton who swears by his 9K Milemarker in all conditions. | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 337 Registered: 02-2002 |
Steve: yes, I went with the ZF74 from 4x4winches.com. So far so good. Shawn, the hoses that are available from most hydraulic shops are rated at about 3000psi, if I remember correctly. You will need 3 high pressure hoses: one from the pump to winch, one from winch to relief valve, and one from relief valve to steering box. The overflow from the relief gets plumbed into the low pressure line from the steering box to resevoir via a T fitting. On all of the low pressure lines, use the conventional screw-type hose clamps instead of the crimped on factory clamps. | ||
| Aaron Richardet (Draaronr) Senior Member Username: Draaronr Post Number: 524 Registered: 09-2002 |
I like the worm gears better also, I just hate paying for name brand. | ||
| Chris Nestor (Heavyhorseman) New Member Username: Heavyhorseman Post Number: 9 Registered: 07-2003 |
I installed a milemarker #12000 hydro winch on my RRC last fall. I tore out the aircond. and used that spot for a ZF pump.I use the winch quite heavily pulling out logs. It is slow, but will quietly pull anything. I have stalled it quite a few times. I do have some pics of the install, but dont know how to send it to a post, so just email me with any questions, and will reply. | ||
| Alan Stuart (Alan_stuart) New Member Username: Alan_stuart Post Number: 30 Registered: 12-2003 |
"I have stalled it quite a few times" You have the MM 12,000 with a dedicated ZF 74 pump...and you stalled it quite a few times? Am I understanding that correctly? I have the puny little 9,000 lb run by the puny little power steering pump, and I have stalled it out quite a few times! Why is yours stalling out? Alan | ||
| Steve Rupp (Steve_rupp) Member Username: Steve_rupp Post Number: 161 Registered: 03-2003 |
Chris, If you're stalling your MM 12000#, chances are it's not set-up correctly. That's a lot of force. I find it hard to believe that a 12000# MM would stall with a LR even in the worst conditions. If it is, you would need a force acting against the winch in order for this to happen. Electricial or Hydraulic it doesn't matter. Just sounds hard to believe. | ||
| marc olivares (Pugs) Senior Member Username: Pugs Post Number: 407 Registered: 12-2002 |
steve or mike, did either (or both) of you go with the 75 series setup with the remote control? marc | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 339 Registered: 02-2002 |
Marc, I can't remember what the 75 series setup is, but I have the 2-speed 9K MM winch with the hydraulic valve / solenoid that mounts to the back of the motor. The electric connection is in a little box above the motor. I hope that makes sense. | ||
| marc olivares (Pugs) Senior Member Username: Pugs Post Number: 408 Registered: 12-2002 |
yep, it was my understanding that the 70-....... winches were manally controllable at the winch only and the 75-...... winches were controllable manually at the winch or by remote control via a hydro valve/solenoid connection. about how much was the ZF74 pump? i too was looking into the "4x4 winch " set up but hadn't gotten prices yet. marc | ||
| steve herrod (Sherrod) Member Username: Sherrod Post Number: 85 Registered: 02-2003 |
several people have asked for this information so i thought i would share. this is the set up i put on my truck. hope this helps. HYDRAULIC WINCH INSTALLATION 1988 RANGE ROVER � Mile Marker 12,000 lbs. 2-Speed Hydraulic Winch Source: Rovertym Engineering Part Number: 70-52000C (see note 1) Price: $875.00 � Mile Marker Valve Adapter Kit Source: Rovertym Engineering Part Number: 34-5010-45 (Landrover Discovery) (see note 2) Price: $300.00 � Mile Marker Wireless Remote Source: Rovertym Engineering Part Number: 7075 Price: $95.00 � Thin Line Cooler Source: Winches Plus, Inc. Part Number: Cooler-03 (see note 3) Price: $35.00 � Mile Marker 204cc UK Spec Winch Motor Source: Mile Marker Part Number: 97-50040 (see note 1) Description: RS1204060A1 (10.5) Motor 151-2016BP Price: $205.56 (swapped out at no charge) � ZF74 Power Steering Pump, Pulley, Bracket, Pressure Relief Valve and Hoses for NAS V8 Landrover Source: Alfred Murray Ltd. Part Number: none (see notes 2 and 4) Price: $368.00 (based on estimated exchange rate of 1.6 x �230.00) � Landrover Power Steering Pump Bracket Source: Alfred Murray Ltd. Part Number: none (see note 4) Price: $35.20 Surcharge (based on estimated exchange rate of 1.6 x �22.00) � Carriage and Packaging Charges Source: Alfred Murray Ltd. Part Number: none Price: $81.60 (based on estimated exchange rate of 1.6 x �51.00) � Winch Installation Source: Trans-it Automotive Time: 16 Hours + (see note 2) Price: $800.00 Page 1 NOTES: Note 1: The winch motor supplied on Mile Marker Part Number 70-52000C is a 293cc motor. Alfred Murray Ltd. specifies a 204cc motor to work with the ZF74 power steering pump and pressure relief valve. Mile Marker agreed to swap out the motor for the UK 204cc motor at no charge. Discussions with Allan Byrne indicated using a 293 cc motor and the standard ZF74 pump will not stall the winch until 14,500 lbs, making it unsafe. It is possible to get a 9,000 lb winch, part number 70-50080C with 3/8� diameter wire and use the standard ZF74 pump but this puts the stall load at 12,500 lbs and is still too high. Another solution is to have Alfred Murray supply a down graded ZF pump to work with the 293cc motor, but the winch will be slower. According to Allan Byrne, �the down graded ZF pump will be 2.3 times faster than the stock pump and will pull 1.8 times the load. Down grading the pump will add �25 to price, whereas if you swap the motor the line speed will increase by a further 50%, without the loss of power and use the standard ZF74 pump�. I opted for the correct winch motor and pump to get full benefit from the hydraulic winch set up. Note 2: The supplied valve adapter kit and the UK kit did not come with all the correct plumbing fittings. Winch installer had to get the required fittings from NAPA; they are standard hydraulic parts and connectors. There is room to mount the solenoid pack under the air cleaner horn, but you will need to relocate some other items. The hoses supplied are the correct length for this installation. Note 3: The in line fluid cooler is recommended. It can be mounted in front of the AC fans behind the plastic grille. I have noticed a lot less power steering fluid leaking from my steering box since the winch installation. A in line power steering fluid filter is not necessary according to Mile Marker. Note 4: The instruction sheet supplied from UK is not easy to follow, it leaves out some information and does not show the correct schematic drawings required. Requested pictures of the installation never got posted on the emails. When ordering the pump, make sure you request special protective shipping materials, as the outlet connector nozzle on the new ZF74 pump was damaged during shipping. Luckily the part is a standard item on a stock pump and can be easily replaced. However, there is a trick to removing it. Insert a dowel rod that is the same diameter as the nozzle and lift up on the rod with a rocking motion; be careful as we damaged two nozzles before we learned this trick. When ordering the power steering pump bracket, there is a need to know what type power steering pump you have, either the cast iron pump or the sheet metal body casing. I don�t know why there was a surcharge. Page 2 Source Information Rovertym Engineering Bradley-Smith, Inc. 3930-F Castle Rock Road Midlothian, Va. 23112 Phone: 866.768.3786 Web Site: www.rovertym.com Contact: John Bradley-Smith Winches Plus, Inc. P.O. Box 1263 Meridian, Id. 83680 Phone: 208.898.0093 Web Site: www.winchesplus.com Mile Marker 1450 S.W. 13th Court Pompano Beach, Fl. 33069 Phone: 800.426.8646 Contact: Bob Pearsall Web Site: www.milemarker.com Alfred Murray Ltd. Bell Lane Cottages Chilworthy, Somerset TA20 3BG England Phone: +44 (0) 1460 61674 Contact: Allan Byrne Email: [email protected] Web Site: www.4x4winches.com Trans-it Automotive 162 Craemer Way Alpharettta, Ga. 30004 Phone: 770.754.9231 Contact: Bud Donnelly Compiled by Steve Herrod on 09-10-02 from emails with vendors, owners and other information gathered while researching the Mile Marker hydraulic winch system. Revised 02-11-03; added wireless remote information. Page 3 | ||
| marc olivares (Pugs) Senior Member Username: Pugs Post Number: 409 Registered: 12-2002 |
steve, that was a tremendously helpful bit of information, so by what i've gathered, your pump pushes your steering box as well, not just dedicated to the winch? i noticed that alfred murray had dedicated setups as well. marc | ||
| steve herrod (Sherrod) Member Username: Sherrod Post Number: 86 Registered: 02-2003 |
marc: that is correct, the zf pump runs both the winch and ps box; this is accomplished through the preasure relief valve. | ||
| Chris Nestor (Heavyhorseman) New Member Username: Heavyhorseman Post Number: 10 Registered: 07-2003 |
Been busy, so haven't checked back to this post. Sorry. In question is my saying the #12,000hydro winch stalling. Several times during logging out an area in Wisconsin, while working the winch hard, it just made a sound like it was at its limit, and quit working. Now mind you this is when I had a HD custom made rovertym welded on bumper against a host tree and pulling some big, full length logs.There is a tremendous amount of weight and drag there. One time I remember I had a huge cherry I had cut, and hung up. I wrapped a log cable around the but low, and started winching (the process here is to pull the butt along the ground to create a steeper angle, and hopefully cause the top of the tree to release and cause the hung up tree to fall down) The entire weight of the tree is in the ground,at almost a verticle angle, and I am pulling the butt acoss the ground (digging in a pretty good trench also). Now the winch did pull this, to my amazement, and pulled it about 3 feet ( distance the butt traveled since being cut and falling down hill) But when the butt now became lodged against the fresh cut stump, I kept winching, hoping it would slide along side of stump and break loose. This is one time it stalled. I am sure it was stalled, and I am sure the winch is set up and matched components correctly. I will call milemarker next week to see it that is what happened. I just assumed it was a stall. I could have very easily been maxed out. All other instances were similiar situations like this, with a big tree, and lots of factors enabling it not to move cleanly. | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 340 Registered: 02-2002 |
FYI: The setup for the Disco is simpler than the RR. The ZF74 fits inside the standard housing. Like Steve, I had to source the hydraulic fittings for the relief valve locally. The install was fairly simple once I had the correct parts. It probably took 3 hours from start to finish. This only accounts for switching the ps pump, high pressure lines, and relief valve. Installing the winch itself took about 3 hours by itself. Since I bought the 9k MM before I knew that the PS pump was inadequate, I chose to keep the winch as-is rather than replace the motor. In my situation with the 9k winch and the 1850 psi pump, I should stall at 11,100lbs. Since the cable is 3/8" and used on the 12K winch also, I assumed that my setup should work ok. | ||
| Mike Rupp (Mike_rupp) Senior Member Username: Mike_rupp Post Number: 341 Registered: 02-2002 |
http://68.49.112.94/hydraulicpump/ New tech article. | ||
| Shawn McKenzie (Shawn) Member Username: Shawn Post Number: 224 Registered: 10-2002 |
Thanks guys for the awesome info and tech article. |
