| Author | Message | ||
     Ian Kreidich (Ian95rrc) Member Username: Ian95rrc Post Number: 102 Registered: 03-2003 |
I need to replace my rear loadspace floor panel which involves drilling or cutting the spot-welds. There seem to be alot of various drill bits and cutters designed to remove the spot-welds. Any advice on cutters and/or technique would be appreciated. Snapon appears to have a variety of sets and specific bits, but I am somewhat clueless as to what will work best for this application. http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/pro.asp?tool=all&Group_ID=1801&Group_Name=Spot+We ld&Sub_Cat_ID=2038910&Sub_Cat_Name=General+Service+Tools&Cat_ID=2038897&Cat_NAME =Body&store=snapon-store | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 195 Registered: 07-2003 |
just get the set and be done with it. http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/pro_det.asp?P65=&tool=all&item_ID=15150&group_ID= 1801&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog Whats a 100 bucks for something thats going to need to be done right? | ||
| Ian Kreidich (Ian95rrc) Member Username: Ian95rrc Post Number: 112 Registered: 03-2003 |
Why would I purchase a set of cutters when I only need one size? I don't enjoy throwing my money away that much. Anyways. I purchased a 1/4" cutter from Matco. http://www.matcotools.com/Catalog/toolcatalog.jsp?cattype=T&cat=2283&select It worked okay. After about 5 spot welds I got smart and predrilled a little with a 1/4" bit first. I would definitely recommend getting one if you have a lot of spot welds to drill. My old floor is out and the new one is ready to be installed this week. I will probably post a writeup with some photos on the process later in the week if anyone is interested. | ||
| Axel Haakonsen (Axel) Moderator Username: Axel Post Number: 626 Registered: 02-2003 |
It wouldn't be throwing your money away to buy a good set, even if you only need one size today. You buy good tools once, and keep them for life. When you need another size in the future, you have it already. Money spent on good tools are never wasted. But, that's my opinion. I'm like Tim "The Tool Man" Taylor....  - Axel | ||
| Ian Kreidich (Ian95rrc) Member Username: Ian95rrc Post Number: 113 Registered: 03-2003 |
I hear what your saying Axel. I just can't see myself using it enough to justify buying a set. I realize that I'll probably one day need a 3/8" cutter and not have it right on hand, but that's the price I pay for being some what poor. I refuse to be a cheap bastard when it comes to tools and my truck so that means I have to spend more money on fewer things. I also totally agree that spending money on good tools isn't a waste. I just want to spend my money on a variety of tools. Since I don't have a limit less supply of cash I need to spread out the wealth. | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 231 Registered: 07-2003 |
Well, if you are anything like me, I cannot use a drill bit over and over without breaking the dam thing. These spot weld cutters are close to drill bits. It's always good to have a back up, even if it is not the right size you need it will get you by. | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 700 Registered: 03-2003 |
I have never used those spot-weld cutters, so I don't know how well they work. But I have always hated trying to drill large holes. It is much harder to drill a large hole than it is a small hole. Those cutters also look really hard to sharpen. If I were in your shoes, I would buy a good small drill bit to start the hole, and then use a UNIBIT to make the hole larger. Here's a UNIBIT: http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/pro_det.asp?P65=&tool=all&item_ID=8173&group_ID=9 48&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog UNIBIT's come in various sizes. That one is just an example. This way, you can sharpen your small bit as much as you like with a Drill Doctor and then use that bit to make the guide hole. Then insert a UNIBIT and ream out the hole to the required size. One thing cool about a UNIBIT is that you can keep on enlarging the hole if you have a stubborn or uneven spot weld or if your first hole was slightly out of center. | ||
| Axel Haakonsen (Axel) Moderator Username: Axel Post Number: 631 Registered: 02-2003 |
I hear you, Ian. Bying one good tool instead of three shitty ones, is ok too. - Axel | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 701 Registered: 03-2003 |
Ax, Speaking of nice tools and being broke, I got serious wood for both of these but can't finance them right now: http://www.discoweb.org/hdsliders/holeready.gif http://www.discoweb.org/hdsliders/drillguide.gif Someday.... | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 1155 Registered: 02-2002 |
That unibit tool - do yuo guys think it would work well in enlarging a hole in 1/4" steel plate? Or is it mainly for reaming thinner gauge? | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 234 Registered: 07-2003 |
I drilled 1/4" steel just the other night. Went right thru it like hot butter up to 1/2" | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 705 Registered: 03-2003 |
Yeah, 1/4" steel is child's play for the UNIBIT. Just try one and you will truly be amazed. Remember to drill a pilot hole first though. The UNIBIT is awesome at enlarging but not drilling. Once the pilot hole is there, the UNIBIT just cuts like butta. | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 236 Registered: 07-2003 |
Dam, Mark this day down, John and I agreed on something. | ||
| Rob Davison (Nosivad_bor) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Nosivad_bor Post Number: 1369 Registered: 02-2003 |
i've never used the unibit but i can't imagine how you could get an unsteped thru hole when you are reaming plate that is thicker than the steps on the unibit. the step would bother me. i own a drill doctor and i dont care for it either. it was the $100 model and it's like cheap junk. I just buy set of quality coated bits they will drill thru thick plate with ease . i do drill a small pilot hole first. i've never wished it were quicker. | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 237 Registered: 07-2003 |
With 1/4" there was a small "step". The Unibit will drill MUCH faster than any regular drill bit. But, by using the unibit you get that 1/2" hole much faster. My Unibit is still sharp, so a pilot hole was not needed. I can see where when the bit dulls a pilot hole will be needed. With the 1/4" plate I was drilling I went up to 1/2"/ After I was done with the unibit I used a 1/2" drill bit to finish up. Took less than 30 seconds to change the bit and drill out the hole with the drill bit. Awesome tool! I just bought a second just in case the first one breaks. Does Snap-on warrenty broken bits? | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 706 Registered: 03-2003 |
Rob, there are different UNIBIT's available and different ones have different length "steps". This one here is a good example: http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/pro_det.asp?P65=&tool=all&item_ID=8169&group_ID=9 48&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog We have that one but with the titanium nitride coating. The steps on this one are 3/8" long. That's pretty long. I don't remember drilling sheet metal that thick. I think the thickest I have drilled has been 1/4" or just slightly thicker than that (I use these mainly to install recovery points on HD bumpers), and 1/4" thick is pretty damn thick. I don't think I've ever seen a bumper that was 3/8" thick. You don't like your Drill Doctor? Does your econmy model grind split-points? If not, I can see why you don't like yours. I'm just amazed how sharp the bits are after literally a few seconds on the Drill Doctor. I think this is the one we have: http://www.drilldoctor.com/store/images/750_LG.jpg This thing is awesome. I used to work with dull drill bits and curse and moan when the bit didn't want to cut or merely displace metal instead of drilling or I had to use a lot of hand pressure to get it to cut. Now whenever a bit is dull, I just toss it into the Drill Doctor and the bit is so sharp that when drilling it throws off those ribbons of steel that you get with a very sharp bit. I love our Drill Doctor. Both our UNIBIT's and Drill Doctor are from our Matco guy, who gives us a lifetime warranty on both items even though they're not supposed to have a lifetime warranty. I already snapped a UNIBIT and Rene gave us a new one free of charge. | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 707 Registered: 03-2003 |
You clean up the hole with a 1/2" drill bit? I have always thought that the UNIBIT makes a much cleaner and square hole than any other 1/2" standard bit that I have ever used. Regarding the broken UNIBIT, it's basically up to your Snap-on guy. If you support him and you're a good customer, you'd be surprised what he will do for you. I'm highly confident our Snap-on guy would warranty a broken UNIBIT or Snap-on bit for us. Thus far, both Rene Pauer (Matco guy) and Steve Hertzmann (Snap-on guy) have been very good to us, which is one reason why we buy our tools from them instead of Internet Tool Discounters or some other place. | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 708 Registered: 03-2003 |
http://www.expeditionexchange.com/snap-on/DSC08200.jpg There is the three UNIBIT's we have. I love these things. These and those airhose swivels are my favorite things in the tool box. | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 238 Registered: 07-2003 |
I'm not sure on the depth of my Unibit. With a 1/4" plate there was a small step. So mine must be 1/8"? I used the 1/2" bit to "finish" the hole off. I was not aware of the different lengh "steps". I will look into that. I buy few things from the snap-on guy. I see him fueling up about the same time every few days on my way home, so that is where I get my parts. The Matco guy lives down the road. I have gotten a few sockets from him and a 18" breaker bar. I'm not a huge customer, but maybe when I hit the lottery. | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 239 Registered: 07-2003 |
John, I see the Dewalt Cordless units in your box. Would you buy them again? I have the 14.4V that is about dead. I have been looking at the Hilti. What's your take? | ||
| Rob Davison (Nosivad_bor) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Nosivad_bor Post Number: 1371 Registered: 02-2003 |
again it seems that i am screwed because i bought the cheap one. http://www.drilldoctor.com/store/product_info.php?cPath=1_54&products_id=29 my main beef is that it takes too much effort to get the bit in the holder. you have to push the bit in this hole with wire springs that aligns the flutes and the angle. this is never as precise as i would like, as a result on my smaller bits the orintation of the drill point in relation to the flutes is off. since you enjoy sharpening bits john I can mail you mine and you can sharpen while you are sitting around in the shop. i guess i need to take the pepsi challenge with the unibit. Yes I tend to get a nice clean hole with the 1/2" bit. i go back in and chamfer the opening with a file too. "Remove all burs and sharp edges" a motto to live by. while building the rack kyle was getting pissed because i insisted on taking all of the fishmouthed cuts on the pipe to the wire wheel and cleaning them up. Yes they would be welded over but _ I _ knew that if this rack was cut up and inspected the quaility would be seen throughout. rd | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 709 Registered: 03-2003 |
I think you have the UNIBIT with lots of very fine steps instead of the one with five or six large steps. Both are useful and I think you really need both. I like to use the UNIBIT with fine steps when I'm drilling holes for SMB's or other recovery points with 1/2" holes. The UNIBIT with fine steps cuts in what feels like one continuous cut. The UNIBIT with the taller steps definitely cuts in steps. Those Dewalt tools in our box are all 18v. I generally dislike electric tools, so I don't really know anything about them. They're heavy and noisy, and they get hot, so I don't like using them that much. So I have no idea which ones are really good or bad. I like the Dewalt ones for two primary reasons. One, they're bright yellow and I'm less likely to leave them inside a customer's truck (good advice from Kyle; this is much easier to do than one might think). Two, Dewalt has a very large selection of 18v tools and so we could get a large selection of various cordless tools all running off the same battery/charger system. You can save like $100 per tool if you buy it without the battery and charger (which you don't need if you have other Dewalt 18v tools already). In addition to those tools there, we also have a 18v cordless circular saw that won't fit into the KRL. I would definitely buy these again. I don't use these that much because electric tools are so large and bulky (I'm dying for a Snap-on pneumatic drill). The two that get used the most by far are the drill and angle drill (which I need for Dreadnought installs and some bumper installs). The 18v drill is really nice. It has a brake on it, so the chuck remains stationary when you're not using it. So you don't need a key to get the chuck very tight on the bit. The inside of the chuck also has teeth that grab the bit very tightly. I have never had a bit spin on the chuck with this drill. | ||
| Ian Kreidich (Ian95rrc) Member Username: Ian95rrc Post Number: 115 Registered: 03-2003 |
The UNIBIT is on my wish list. However, it won't do the same job a spot weld cutter will do. The idea of the cutter is that you don't drill through the second sheet of metal. It doesn't always work out that way. I did drill through a couple times. If I used the UNIBIT I would just have a regular 1/4" hole in the steel. You're right about sharpening the spot weld cutters John. A Drill Doctor won't do the job. Matco will sharpen it for $13.50. Thankfully, after about 50 spot welds I am finished with it and it's off to get sharpened. | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 710 Registered: 03-2003 |
Aaaah, so that is the point of the spot weld cutters. I have always drilled through the bottom later to get a spot weld off. LOL. Butchery. Definitely good to know. | ||
| Ian Kreidich (Ian95rrc) Member Username: Ian95rrc Post Number: 116 Registered: 03-2003 |
Will, I have a 15 year old Hilti hammer drill that just won't die. I haven't really looked at the new ones lately. My favorite brands are Makita and Porter Cable. IMHO Dewalt uses cheap plastic parts. | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 240 Registered: 07-2003 |
I have the Porter Cable Electric drill. Allot of torque there but, not as much as my Milwaukee. I first saw the Hilti when people came to install new cabinets and counter tops in my house. Looked like a stought drill. I only have one DeWalt cordless product, so swaping batteries is not a big deal to me. I have been happy with the life of the drill and batteries, but once it's time to get something new I want to spend the money where it counts. | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 1161 Registered: 02-2002 |
So the unibit - are the ones in home depot good, or are the snapons the only ones to get? | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 711 Registered: 03-2003 |
If Home Depot sells the "UNIBIT", made by Irwin (the makers of the famous Vise-Grip pliers), then they're one and the same. The Snap-on and Matco guys sell the exact same Irwin UNIBIT on their trucks. There are several copycat UNIBIT's around. This is a genuine UNIBIT: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2367922710&category=50384 This is a UNIBIT: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2367757132&category=50383 And this is a UNIBIT: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2367084111&category=50383 This is a copycat: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2583063585&category=25259 Vermont American also makes a copycat UNIBIT. I have no idea if the copycats are good, bad, better, worse, etc. I just buy our UNIBIT's from Rene Pauer because he'll give us a lifetime warranty and he delivers to our door. | ||
| Ron Brown (Ron) Senior Member Username: Ron Post Number: 627 Registered: 04-2001 |
"LOL. Butchery" Did you just drill them out or were you welding something back together? I mean if you were not worried about one side an air chisel works wonders. | ||
| Will Cupp (W_cupp) Member Username: W_cupp Post Number: 241 Registered: 07-2003 |
Air chisel= $100.00 Spot weld cutter= $15.00 | ||
| Rob Davison (Nosivad_bor) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Nosivad_bor Post Number: 1374 Registered: 02-2003 |
it's funny i love the electric tools. i hate battery powered. the drills are all too slow, weak ,wear out too soon and heavy. | ||
| Michael Noe (Noee) Senior Member Username: Noee Post Number: 818 Registered: 03-2002 |
Thanks guys, got a lot outta this thread. | ||
| John Lee (Johnlee) Dweb Lounge Member Username: Johnlee Post Number: 712 Registered: 03-2003 |
The only time I ever had to deal with spot welds was back in college when I was restoring a 1974 Vespa Rallye 200. I can't even remember why, but we thought we had to drill through the spot welds to remove some body panels. Next time I'll be using that spot weld cutter. Pretty cool. | ||
| Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) Senior Member Username: Deanbrown3d Post Number: 1166 Registered: 02-2002 |
If anyone's interested, I just picked up a 3-pack of Irvin Unibits from Lowes (same thing as HD) for $59. Individually they are $33 there. Dean |
