| Author |
Message |
    
Jeffry Scott (Jeffry)
| | Posted on Friday, January 24, 2003 - 04:39 pm: | 
|
I have always loved the defender, but I have recently purchased a Disco because there is no way I can afford a Defender. So, as the post says, I have a few general questions. Sorry if they are naive or been hashed over again and again.
Why are Defenders so bloody expensive in the U.S.? (aside from supply and demand currently, but originally they were bloody expensive too from what I remember) It seems that in many ways they are a very basic 4x4 (naive?) and shouldn't be so pricey. Compared to the Discos and Rangies with all the leather and plushness they seem quite utilitarian, which is certainly much of their charm.
What makes them such incredible beasts? -It seems they are an incredible 4x4 even compared to the Disco and Rangies. Watching Camel Trophy Mundo Maya with the great introduction of the Discovery, the D110 always seemed to be leading the way to winch the Discos out of jambs.
Why did LR pull them out of the U.S. market?
Will they return to the U.S. market? Will inexpensive imports from across the pond become available once the model is 25-years old? (dreaming).
thanks for indulging me.
jeff |
Phillip Perkinson (R0ver4x4)
| | Posted on Friday, January 24, 2003 - 04:57 pm: |
|
I guess prices could be reflected bu supply and demand maybe. Or just that there arent that many of the trucks over here. I think the reson they were initially $$ was to bring them up to US spec in terms of DOT standards or whatever. Not sure tho. they are extremly utilitarian. I guess Rover did thier research. they knew they could sell them for what they wanted and they got what they wanted. I think there were close to 7,000 Defenders brought over here. In terms of Rover bringing them back I dont think it will be likely they sell to many of them world wide to bring them up to spec for our small market. I would think Rover sold more Defenders than anything else world wide. Perhaps it wouldnt justify thier expense to send the D-90 over here. or they just wanna keep the market for RR and DIsco's the way it is now.
The reson they quit bringing them here were the US governments "saftey" requirements. D-90's dont really have space for a passenger air bag, and I have also heard of things such as crumple zones. my guess is mostly emissions regulations. In terms of saftey I think the D-90 was to unsafe for lesser automobils to be on the road with such a substantial truck. I think if it comes back it will not be anything like the Defender we currently are interested in. there are some new ones over here but the legalitys and process to get one over here jurts my head to even think about it. If you have $$ you can get a new one but you need $$.
As far ass ofroad superiority I think someone else would have to add to that discussion. I would think the DIsco or RR would have an edge over the 110 due to wheelbase but I am not sure. Gotta watch out what you say about the DIsco here you can get blacklisted. |
Milli (Milli)
| | Posted on Friday, January 24, 2003 - 05:09 pm: |
|
The Defender has withstood the test of time and the is built like a brick shithouse.
I think they pulled them out of the US because of safety regs (airbags, external roll cages, etc). Plus the US is full of fat, stupid slobs who can't get in them. I think they got ours in by making their gross vehicle weight that of a truck. I didn't spend a lot on my defender, just got it from a guy who wanted a fair price and also felt the inflation ridiculous. I was sinking tons of cash into electronics in another car that I fried and couldn't budget it anymore. Anyhow, I feel it has extended value because of the craftsmanship and durability and it has proven it's point over this last year. |
Troy M.
| | Posted on Saturday, January 25, 2003 - 12:27 am: |
|
Man, I have wayyyy too much time on my hands tonight, but here goes.....
As for prices and sales .... Supply and demand ... and emotions certainly play(ed) a big part in the used prices of D90s. Though deals can certainly be found. However, when they first came, many dealers couldn't even move them off their car lots. The only way they were initially brought in was thru some sort of heavy truck clause/law reserved for vehicles with GVW >6k lbs. D90 GVW is listed at 6001 lbs. They were pulled out because they failed to meet new federal auto standards for safety (specifically, no side impact door beams and no airbags) that went into affect in 1997. As for cost, they are essentially hand built .... which costs more $$$$ compared to automation-built trucks like the Disco or Rangie ... which makes them more expensive to build.
As for being basic ....they are a "basic" 4x4 in terms of ammenties. But at the time they were introduced, D90s were the only true, 'basic' truck geared primarily toward off-road use in the US with fulltime 4wd, full-floating front and rear axles, 4 wheel disc brakes, axle breathers, 32" tires, a low range that was actually low, and a lockable center diff. The next closest thing to it was the Hummer (which at the time was more than double the price). To even get a Jeep Wrangler near that you were talking lift kits, axle swaps, new tires,...etc., etc.
"What makes them such incredible beasts? -It seems they are an incredible 4x4 even compared to the Disco and Rangies."
Mechanically, they're the same (assuming Disco 1s and Rangie Classics). I may get flamed for this (especially by posting this on a Discovery website) but, having owned both a 'built' Disco 1 and a 'built' D90, I can tell you ... for me ... the Defender is a better off-road vehicle. This is primarily due to the design of the body, my preference for short wheelbases & short front and rear overhangs, and for the ease of modification ... specifically the ability to fit larger tires (name another vehicle that you can fit a 37" MTR on with only 2" of lift!). But, as with anything, it all depends on application. For my type of 4-wheeling, my Disco just had too much sheetmetal 'sticking out' all around the truck to get hung up and damaged (though, my defender has its share of dents). Defenders, with their flat body panels have less body to get hung up. For example, on my Defender the rocksliders, tires, and bumpers all stick out further than any of the sheetmetal. There's basically, a ring of protection all the way around the vehicle. The same can't be said for my Discovery. Also, the door sills sit some 5" higher on a D90 compared to a Disco (read: more clearance ... ie like I said, less body to get hung up).
Will they return ... who knows ... there's a lot of rumors.
I'm sure when the 25 year clause comes into effect (only 5 more years!!!), there will be some Defenders coming to the US.
My $1.00 worth-
T |
Jeffry Scott (Jeffry)
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 28, 2003 - 09:42 pm: |
|
Thanks for all the info. I wish I could afford a 110 to go with the Disco. Damn this Rover bug ... |
Jason Habbal (Jason97d90)
New Member
Username: Jason97d90
Post Number: 12
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Monday, October 06, 2003 - 09:43 am: |
|
I don't know about you guys but the pics i have seen about the new D-90 that may be here in a few years is quite ugly. Its a Jeep Liberty on steroids. I didn't think land rover could make something so ugly. I will gladly stick with my 97 D-90 Soft top. |
Wicks (Wicks)
Member
Username: Wicks
Post Number: 96
Registered: 03-2003
| | Posted on Monday, October 06, 2003 - 01:54 pm: |
|
Yeah, the California club president just replaced his disco with a Defender cuz his disco was litterally cracking apart after years of leading club runs. Not that it was disabled at all, he just didn't want to do a lot of welding and so forth. ;) |
|
Closed: New threads not accepted on this page