| Author | Message | ||
     Jason Michaels (H2eater) Member Username: H2eater Post Number: 59 Registered: 03-2003 |
Does anyone have any info on updating the esthetics on a Series III to that of a Defender? Someone once mentioned it but I can't find any info on the thread... Thanks. | ||
| David Marchand (Dmarchand) Member Username: Dmarchand Post Number: 121 Registered: 09-2002 |
Jason, it really depends on how much you want your series III to look and/or perform like a 110. Both are nice body styles. The options, are limitless in many respects when you talk mechnical. I doubt you would want the 110 3.9 V8. Coil over suspension would be high on the list, etc. Might be best to find a wrecked 110 and swap parts or import them yourself. George at Roversdownsouth is always good help too. He has quite a few 110 cabs/bodies, that would make your change much easier. Anyway, these guys might have some tidbits and parts for you. They "seem" to convert quite a few Series inton 110's. I'm not affiliated in any way: http://www.roverpartsused.com/ Good luck and keep us posted. | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior Member Username: Leslie Post Number: 2089 Registered: 02-2002 |
If you're not worried about performance, ie engine or suspension differences, then it's mostly "cosmetic" differences. The big visual difference is to bring the radiator panel forward (also swapping the bonnet and the wings, too). Do that, and most of it is done. There are some smaller differences, that most people wouldn't notice (unless you're a real Rover nut) - some of them are: the windshield on a Defender is 1-piece, whereas a Series III has two pieces of glass with a strip up the center; the windscreen hinges are different; (assuming an 88" SIII trying to go for a D90 look) the SIII will have a bulkhead of the rear tub right behind the seats, where a D90 is more open from the rear bed into the front cab, using support bars to maintain rigidity instead; some of the lights are a bit different, but they vary over either model's run, and intermingle too, so, nothing to REALLY get worked up over; different paint color availability; different wheels (alloys don't like Series axles, but the steelies will fit either); an SIII has the gas cap right beside the door, high on the tub, where an early Defender has it lower on the tub beside the door, where the later Defenders moved the gas cap to the rear of the tub; there are some differences with the dash bits, like the warning-light panel, etc.; the rear wheel-arch is curved differently, which means that wheelwell moldings would fit different if you try to put them on a SIII; and the list could go on and on... Of course, the "real" difference, the big one, is that the Defenders is coil-sprung instead of leaf-sprung. Defenders could have had anything from the 2.25l to the 4.0V8 petrol, the 2.25 diesel to the Td5, whereas the SIII is gonna be a 2.25 diesel or petrol. But, they don't matter so much as far as "looks" are concerned. The nice thing about the SIII, though, is that it really is a leaf-sprung older Defender, so, what you're wanting to do is feasible, and not too difficult to accomplish. | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior Member Username: Leslie Post Number: 2090 Registered: 02-2002 |
David M. snuck in there and posted while I was typing, lol.... I noticed he assumed a D110, where I was thinking D90.... If you had a 109SW, and wanted it to look like a D110SW, it'd still be pretty much the same things I said.... Let me emphasize something though.... DO NOT! DO NOT!!!, under any condition, bring misery upon yourself by going to the link that David M. posted.... I REALLY do not like talking bad about people, however, I have too many friends that have been shafted by Creed Evans, and I cannot in good conscience let anyone consider looking at his stuff without strongly cautioning them. Caveat Emptor!!! Good luck..... -L | ||
| David Marchand (Dmarchand) Member Username: Dmarchand Post Number: 122 Registered: 09-2002 |
Interesting, thanks Leslie. I just found that site a few days ago. The pictures and info were interesting enough, but I haven't had any contact with them. So you have the scoop on that one. | ||
| David Marchand (Dmarchand) Member Username: Dmarchand Post Number: 123 Registered: 09-2002 |
Oh, and I assumed Jason was referring to the 109, as I remembered a thread where he discussed buying one, or already had. Could be my mistake though. | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior Member Username: Leslie Post Number: 2093 Registered: 02-2002 |
David, You were right, just after posting this, I saw where he mentioned that he was considering trading his RR for a SIII, and was wanting to get it to look like a 110.... Try this: go over to RN's BBS, and start a thread asking for references for Creed Evans.... sit back and watch..... (I'm getting cold shivers just thinking about some of the crap people have gotten.... order "like-new take-off" parts from him, and received rusty junk that's been lying out in a field... the same stories over and over.... eeek! run away! run away!)... Seriously, though, go search on Creed Evans and see what you find... even almost a decade ago: http://www.fourfold.org/RoverWeb/lro/Year-1994/941220.html Just wanting people to be forewarned.... -L | ||
| Jason Michaels (H2eater) Member Username: H2eater Post Number: 61 Registered: 03-2003 |
-L, so if I was wanted to convert just the front end to that of a DF what parts would need to be replaced? Hood, fenders, fender flares, windshield, ??? I am just trying to get an idea of what I am getting myself into here. This guy is serious about trading this fully restored 74 III 109' for my RRC. - Jason | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior Member Username: Leslie Post Number: 2098 Registered: 02-2002 |
The list, if you wanted to be really exact, is long. But.... IMHO.... hinges, the fact that the windscreen is in two halves instead of one, etc., I'd not even bother with.... The bonnet, ie the hood, swaps out, no sweat. You would need to replace the breakfast, ie, the front radiator support, which brings the radiator forward to be in line with the outside of the wings (fenders). Hmmm..... I don't know that you'd HAVE to swap the wings, you may be able to use the SIII ones, I'll have to check on that. I wouldn't bother with much more than that, though... at that point, most people would think that it was a Defender. ++++++++ Now, let me caution you.... a Series is a lot of fun. But, they're not really great commuter vehicles, not unless you've got a really short commute. I'd recommend trying to spend some quality time with one first, before you commit to one. Just something to keep in mind, that the Rangie will be much more comfortable than the Series.... FWIW.... -L | ||
| Jason Michaels (H2eater) Member Username: H2eater Post Number: 63 Registered: 03-2003 |
Thanks for the info Leslie, anything else you can help me on would be greatly appreciated. My office is only 5 mins from my house and I spend most of my time there any how. My other vehicle is a 56' Jaguar XK120 Roadster so I kind of have the "bug" for unconventional vehicles if you know what I mean. Having a normal daily driver just isn't me. With some decent work I can make the III a comfortable driver. Comfortable enough for me that is.  As for the parts required can you recomend a good source? It seems that there are quite a few "bad" sources out there and I don't want to get the shaft... | ||
| David Gage (Davidg) Member Username: Davidg Post Number: 142 Registered: 02-2002 |
Jason, just how "restored" is the S3. I have seen and had literally brand new restorations, you know, the complete nut and bolt jobs, that sell in excess of $20K. David | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior Member Username: Leslie Post Number: 2100 Registered: 02-2002 |
Jason, My recommended source just posted between you asking about and me replying..... lol... Seriously, my first stop is always The Thatched Roof Garage for Rover stuffs... talk to David, and he'll either have it, can get it, or point you in the right direction. (Speaking of, David, I'll be by this evening for the cap & wires...) Jason, If you're used to a XK, then the Series would be a great fit (might have to call you "Bob II", tho', lol.... there's a fella in town here with an XK120, 2 88" Series Rovers, a 110, and a new Mini.... I can only yet aspire to such.... ) As David pointed out, though.... what is restored in this case? In some instances, "restored" is really just a freshening, and not a true restoration. If it's REALLY restored, taken apart and put back together with ALL the things like seals and rubber and wiring, etc., with ANYTHING that isn't identical to new, if all of that replaced, then you're really talking about a restoration. For example, my SIII is apart, in pieces. I'm putting it back together on a new chassis, new springs, new paint, and many of the little bits will be replaced along the way (wiring, trim, etc.). However, it'll be on the stock driveline w/ no modifications or refurbishment other than paint, I'm using the original wings (with little dents and all), I'm using another rear tub that while better than my original is still not perfect.... mine will (hopefully) turn out nice, but I wouldn't call it a "true" restoration.... I've seen less done to Rovers before, and they still are referred to as a "restoration" although they're really not. I guess the whole of the matter is: if you like the Series III better than the Range Rover, if the Series is worth more to you than the Rangie, then trade. -L | ||
| Jason Michaels (H2eater) Member Username: H2eater Post Number: 65 Registered: 03-2003 |
Look below for the details on the tuck: 1974 Landrover Series III, 109 - Restored in 1999 Approximately 55,000 miles on vehicle Body is straight, paint is perfect Interior seating for eight New Hella fog lights Four new tires with only 2,000 miles New shocks and steering damper installed Spring 2002 Galvanized roof rack with ladder Rear step with tow hitch Front bull bar Twin fuel tanks 4 speed manual with 4 WD High and Low range Ex-military truck with heavier frame than civilian spec New headliner, seats and carpet Full underbody coating – similar to Waxoyl product Garage stored and rust free Maintained by the British military with no regard to cost. Similarly compulsive maintenance by current owner Full hoop set and canvas top available for those wanting convertible $15,000 or serious offers Please take a look at the photo's he has sent me so far... The color will have to go. With the DF conversion I will be painting it Bon. Grey... Ugh, those wheels need to go as well.. www.specialtytools.com/series/ FYI - here is the link for the guy I know who imported the Series III and did the work on it. http://www.landroverworldflorida.com/TONYS___MAIN/Page_3x.html | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior Member Username: Leslie Post Number: 2111 Registered: 02-2002 |
Bonetti gray.... Oh wait! How short my memory...... the Tomb Raider! Okay, here's a few things as far as appearance goes.... The hood, easy swap. Add a radiator panel and grill (you actually don't have to take out the Series one, leave it in place with the radiator where it is, and just add the grill and support to the front, which will also support the front edge of the hood). The entire wing doesn't have to be replaced; however, the wheel-opening is different - if you replace the outer panel of the wing, you can add the eye-lip bit to it. Now, the 109 you're looking at has a standard tub on it. The Tomb Raider's bed is a high-cap bed. To swap from one to the other is gonna be ~$2500 in parts for the bigger bits, not counting things like taillights, etc. After swapping all of those bits, then you'll still lack the roll-bar, which isn't "available" - you'd have to have one fabricated. You'll have to remove the hardtop of course; have to admit, the open TR vehicle would bite on rainy days. Now, the TR vehicle had a 4.0 with an auto, but, that's another story.... You'd have to pull out the interior and fabricate your own out of diamond-plate. Hmmm........ To be honest, that's a REALLY nice-looking truck as it sits, color and all. You'd have to tear it apart and start over to build a TR replica, and, it'd still not be coil-sprung nor a V8.... My suggestion is: leave that Series as-is. If you want to make a TR-replica, you'd be better off finding a lesser vehicle for cheap, and building it up into one, than you would to modify a truck that is that nice. That's MHO, FWIW..... -L | ||
| Jason Michaels (H2eater) Member Username: H2eater Post Number: 66 Registered: 03-2003 |
Leslie, you are most helpful. Here is the thing though, I know the vehicle is in great condition and this guy wants to do an even swap for my truck. I am not looking for the exact TR truck just similar. There are things about it that I don't like that because I am starting with this I can change them to my favor. I was thinking I could buy a Safety Devices Camel Trophy roll cage and modify it... Yes, no? I want to leave the tub the way it is just remove the dual side seats and install a single bench seat in the back. The truck already has a new soft top that comes with it along with the hard top. I am good with a parabolic spring setup. I have had CJ-5's and 7's in the past so I am ok with a l-spring ride. I was thinking about the kit by Gon2Far. Something crazy like 20" of of travel. That's good enough for me. As for the engine my local Rover mechanic is working up the plans to install a Callaway 4.6... He has a RRC that can smoke all 4 tires in 4 low on pavement. He's nuts. What about fitting Volvo C303 Laplander axles to a Series? I have read this can be done with little effort. Anyhow, it's late and I need to save my rest for the drive to Uwharrie tomorrow. Let's continue chatting after the meet in NC. - I like a challenge and to have things different so I think that is why I am so psyked about this. | ||
| Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Senior Member Username: Leslie Post Number: 2116 Registered: 02-2002 |
C ya there! -L | ||
| Jason Michaels (H2eater) Member Username: H2eater Post Number: 68 Registered: 03-2003 |
Look for me in my RRC.. See my picture in my profile... |
