By Disco Mike on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 01:30 pm: Edit

Yo, Homeboys;

Just talked to Pat (Top Tech guy) at Warn Winch about some questions raised on Discoweb about the Multi Mount. The receiver hitch is rated to pull a 5K trailer because of road load "spikes". In other words when you are pulling a 5K boat at 70 MPH and hit a pothole or another object the load can spike on the hitch to 15K or more. Their engineers have tested this extensively. The winch puts a slow steady pull on the hitch of 9K or 12K which is much less pressure than a sudden spike. So no wimp problems with the Multi Mount. Unless you just want to do what everybody else is doing (heavy expensive bumper, etc.) the Multi Mount works fine. I like the open access spool and the ability to pile a lot of cable on one side when winching to the side. The guy at Warn thought you guys were "nuts" for putting a 12K winch (more $$ and weight on springs) on a 5K Disco. Although I think with one exception, if you sit in the vehicle while winching and you have a six thousand pound ego, you may need it!

By Moe on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 02:03 pm: Edit

And you wonder why so many jumped on your earlier proclamations? If the Multi Mount works for you, great, but the more you talk, the more it sounds like you are not really satisfied. If you rely on the top tech guy at Warn for all your opinions, I'd be a little worried. He will tell you whatever he thinks you want to hear. If you want advice from fellas on the ground who use the shit day after day, ask the guys on this board. They will be honest and tell you what works and what doesn't. They have a lot of experience and some have the Multi Mount as their second winch. When you throw the 12k on the front, then the maybe you'll stop squawking.

Ian

By Ron on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 02:11 pm: Edit

I am glad the tech at Warn confirmed that you can use a 9k winch on a 5k reciever which no one ever seems to believe me on. One thing though is I would (and do) use a class eight bolt instead of the pin. Make sure you get one long enough that the thread is not on the part where it goes through. The real concern (for me at least) is the strength on side pulls. I would worry about bending the mount or worse, the reciever. Has not been an issue yet but I am not looking forward to it. Ya, 12k is a bit excessive, but like I said no one ever says I wish I bought the smaller winch. If you have some pics of the front Multimount that was raised to inches please show them to us. I am especially interested because if I ever find my RR that is what I am going to do. How come you did not give a shot out to the Homegirls among us as well?

Ron

By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 02:39 pm: Edit

I wonder where that (Top tech guy) guys is when all that crap is stalling and burning the fuck up! Mike , do what you like. As Ian said , if you want the real deal just ask. Keep in mind that the term "Off road" has a different meaning to everyone. By the way , how come you didnt answer about that 100lbs+ bullet getting fired from the back of the disco on a down hill?


Kyle

By Ron on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 02:47 pm: Edit

Kyle,
I read the other post you made and I am trying to visualize the 100lbs bullet. What are you talking about? It flying off under load? Can't see it going very far as there is not enough stored energy in wire rope to more 100lbs very far. This is on the heavy blanket on winch wire principle. Personally I am more worried about turning the back hitch reciever and rear cross member into a pretzel, maybe some flames when it ruptures the gas tank, than it flying off, but I like fear you can conjure up with your stories so will you spell it out.

Ron

By Disco Mike on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 02:51 pm: Edit

Moe,

I think my using my Disco off road for business qualifys as "on the ground" and "day after day". Say hi to Shemp.

Ron,

Good idea (the bolt), I plan on posting some photos of the Multi Mount, installing ARB lockers front and rear and the Brownchurch rack with my home made limb risers, David Bowers waffel (sand ladder) holders, shovel and pick holder (all stainless steel), jerry can holders and a marine plywood floor.

By Milan on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 02:53 pm: Edit

I was not going to reply as replies suggesting other solution seem to upset DiscoMike. I'm not a Homeboy either but her goes:

Nobody said multimount was bad. I just don't like the idea of lugging a heavy winch around, so for multimount I'd prefer the lighter planetary winches of 9000lb capacity or less. Since those are not my first choice for a winch on a Disco, I would not use multimount as my primary winch retention system.

However, if I were, I'd make a custom one that's mounted higher (both front and rear). Since that's kind of what you're doing, then good, I agree (and no you don't have to care). I would also most likely (but not necessarily) use 2 hitch receiver setup over the single one. I believe what the tech said, though 17K sounds a bit high. I think the receivers are stronger than 5K lbs. I know you can lift the whole vehicle by one for sure.


I still don't know what got your panties in a twist the first time.

I don't necessarily see a need for 12K lb winch either but there are poeple here who haul 7000lbs in total and then 12K sounds like a good idea - and not at all overkill - to me. Besides, I belive in having a bigger winch to begin with as you don't strain neither the winch nor the battery that way.

Later homeboy...;)

By Disco Mike on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 02:53 pm: Edit

Moe,

I think my using my Disco off road for business qualifys as "on the ground" and "day after day". Say hi to Shemp.

Ron,

Good idea (the bolt), I plan on posting some photos of the Multi Mount, installing ARB lockers front and rear and the Brownchurch rack with my home made limb risers, David Bowers waffel (sand ladder) holders, shovel and pick holder (all stainless steel), jerry can holders and a marine plywood floor.

By Milan on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:00 pm: Edit

P.S.

I think Kyle was refering to the winch stored in the back of the Disco when wheeling (or even getting to the trail). I think this is one of the reasons people use these (I know at least one preson). It keeps the Winch clean. ;)

Then they put it on when stuck. I'd put it on before the trip and then if you put it in the back it gets more cruddy than on the front (but I guess you have to not care). But if I drive with it on already (rgardless of its position), I might as well have a permanent mount.

Multimount makes sense to me for either 1 winch between numerous vehicles or for a secondary, lighter winch.

I believe you can never have too many winches, so why not permanent-mount them?

By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:05 pm: Edit

Ron ,and Mike.
The bullet I reffer to is the winch stored in the back of the disco while not in use. How much stored energy does it need to come unglued and cause a little pain? I myself try to keep as much heavy shit out of the truck as I can. Yes you can secure it but , shit happens.... Now , what about when the reciever end is filled with mud? Or even under the mud? Hooking that heavy pain in the ass up wont be fun in most situations. For a rear winch I think its cool. But never for a front. Unless ofcourse my idea of "Off Road" was dirt roads and wet grass..

Kyle

By Disco Mike on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:06 pm: Edit

Posted without looking at it.
Miss spelled " qualifies" and "waffle" OOPS.

By Ron on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:23 pm: Edit

I belive it is misspelled. One word if you wish to be picky about it.

Don't worry I can't spel too.

About permanantly mounting on the rear. There is no way I see w/o compromising departure angle. The door limits how high you can mount it. And since I have multiple platforms to mount it, I kinda like it for the rear of whatever vehicle happens to need it at the time. I have to admit though it was kinda an afterthought and I never intended it for that use but I liked the concept when I saw it on RN 1998 catalog and even though I have never had to use it, yet. I am happy with the concept. 100lbs bullet not withstanding. About as bad as a hi lift to the head. Right BJ?

By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:27 pm: Edit

Thats why you have a roof rack. Get that shit out of the truck and up on the rack...


Kyle

By Ron on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:36 pm: Edit

Thats where the hi lift is now. On the rack, well it is actually in the corner of the first floor bath, but I have made a mount to put it up there so next outing up it goes.

Ron

By Milan on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:37 pm: Edit

Yeah, Ron... but you qualify for the multi-vehicle and/or supplementary winch conditions. ;)

Also when I said "I might as well have it mounted permanently" I meant a front mount. Even though I'm conceiving a rear mount in my head. But as you mention clearance is an issue. That's why I think a primary winch on the front - permanently and a second, lighter winch on a multimount for the rear or for any temporary use.

As far as carrying the winch in the back, just wait till you get stuck so that you can't put it in the receiver. If you say you can put it in at the trail head I say you can do so in the comfort of your driveway and if you do that it almost defeats the purpose of being portable (other than for the reasons already mentioned).

By Disco Mike on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 03:54 pm: Edit

Ron;

I recently "waded" through very muddy water. The headlights were under the mud/water. The winch filled with sand and grit. I later winched a vehicle and did damage to the gears. My winch was also full of rust from many river crossings. This rust problem is common with all front mounted winches. I talked with Warn and was told they no longer make the water tight military winch with a vent tube (which is what I wanted). They said one advantage with a Multi Mount is you can put a plastic trash bag (maybe 2 heavy weight) over the winch and bring it down tight to the 2" hitch, then duct tape around it. This will allow you to keep the insides (gears) clear of grit and water and have the winch on if you get stuck while crossing. Just an idea from Warn.
I never put the winch inside the truck. I take it off around town to save my springs. It's on and stays on when traveling or on trail.

By Axel Haakonsen (Axel) on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 04:06 pm: Edit

Disco Mike:

You are a photographer (nice pictures on your web site there, by the way), so your wheeling priorites are going to be different than for some of us "homeboys". Your primary objective I would assume, is to get to your location, taking the path of least resistance for obvious reasons. Nothing wrong with that, time is money, and your job is to shoot pictures. If your setup works for you, that's fine. Sharing your experience is fine, too. That's what this site is for.

Some of us on the other hand, wheel for the sake of wheeling. Our priorities are different than yours, we will go trough an obstacle or a difficult trail just because it is there, and we can. That is why a big winch is the right setup for some of us, we have seen smaller winches fry under extreme conditions.

Nobody is telling you to ditch your setup. You are not wrong for doing what works for you, and we are not wrong for doing what works for us. Why would warn even make a 12 or 15K winch, and ARB design a Rover bumper to accept it if it wasn't the right solution for some people in some circumstances? The same can be said for the Multi Mount, by the way.
And that's what it all boils down to. Different strokes for different folks.

Axel

By Milan on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 04:15 pm: Edit

DiscoMike,
The idea of a bag over the winch is a good one and yes, it will work way better on a multimount than the permanent mount. However, if you get stuck in the conditions you described it's a moot point. You have to unwarp it and get it muddy anyhow. Plus dragging the winch in a rear mount would rip the bag and then it's there just to trap the muck inside. But that's why a mount that puts the winch higher is good.

Furthermore, planetary winches are more susceptible to mud and grit getting inside the winch than on a worm gear drive winch. That's actually one of the reasons I'm now looking to replace my plenetary with a worm. But those weigh more and thus are less suitable to multimount.

By Ron on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 04:23 pm: Edit

Personally I feel the mount on the back limits departure angle too much. Thus it rides inside. I don't think I will REALLY ever need it but it makes me feel better about going through something I don't know what is on the other side. Mud in the gears, ahh, another reason for worm winches ;-)/an 8274. Just drain and refill. none of this relube stuff.

Best Rgds. to All,

Ron

By Disco Mike on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 04:26 pm: Edit

Axel;

Fair enough, thanks for the strokes. Although I also belong to a Rover club and push it pretty hard. Lets rag on those j**ps for a change. I've gotten a lot of good ideas on this site, and will be back in a week or so.

By Milan on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 04:37 pm: Edit

Let's not rag on those Jeeps. Who knows, one might have to pull you out one day.

By Mike on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 08:53 pm: Edit

What is the address of Disco Mike's web site?

Thanks in advance,
Mike

By Axel Haakonsen (Axel) on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 10:02 pm: Edit

http://www.visualpursuit.com (Just replace the michael@ with www. in his email address....)

By Moe on Thursday, March 08, 2001 - 10:03 pm: Edit

Disco Mike, Sorry, it's hard to avoid cliches. But really can you talk? Did you buy a spellchecker from Kyle?

Regarding the Multi Mount. Are you fixing some hitch points to the sides of the Disco too? That would make 4 possible mounts--winch in any direction. I think Lara Croft used this design on her defender. And I know she uses hers day after day.

I like the pics on your site. Must have done a lot of travelling?

By Christian P. Frezza on Friday, March 09, 2001 - 09:40 am: Edit

I would like to make a comment about storing gear etc. in the back of ANY vehicle. If you have to store it then SECURE it. We do this in the cab's of our new fire apparatus. Certain standard's require this so in the event of a crash or rollover, stuff inside don't become projectiles. One experience...I respond many years ago as a volunteer firefighter (before becoming career) to a motor vehicle accident. The passenger was killed when the vehicle rolled over and went down an embankment. He was seatbelted. Unfortunately the vehicle stock jack was not and it became the projectile that hit him in the back of the head when the vehcile stopped suddenly into a tree upside down. Secure it PLEASE! For your safety.

Just my 2 cents.
Christian Frezza
DII 99' and Career FF/EMT

By Christian P. Frezza on Friday, March 09, 2001 - 09:42 am: Edit

I would like to make a comment about storing gear etc. in the back of ANY vehicle. If you have to store it then SECURE it. We do this in the cab's of our new fire apparatus. Certain standard's require this so in the event of a crash or rollover, stuff inside doesn't become a projectile. One experience...I responded many years ago as a volunteer firefighter (before becoming career) to a motor vehicle accident. The passenger was killed when the vehicle rolled over and went down an embankment. He was seatbelted. Unfortunately the vehicle stock jack was not and it became the projectile that hit him in the back of the head when the vehcile stopped suddenly into a tree upside down. Secure it PLEASE! For your safety.

Just my 2 cents.
Christian Frezza
DII 99' and Career FF/EMT

By Axel Haakonsen (Axel) on Friday, March 09, 2001 - 09:54 am: Edit

I couldn't agree more. I am going to start a new thread on how to best secure the items inside your car.