By Clint on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 08:45 pm: Edit

The Ibex is a neat vehicle based on LR mechanicals.
http://www.ibex4x4.co.uk/

http://4wd.sofcom.com/Foers/Winch.html
Check out the center mounted winch.
With one of these, you wouldn't have to worry about multimount/frontmount/sagging springs...

By Milan on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 11:59 pm: Edit

Thanks for the link. I've been trying to figure out how to mount the winch in a center of vehicle but I could not figure out how to make it work from either end. This idea has something to it.

By nadim on Thursday, March 22, 2001 - 11:51 am: Edit

yeah...but remember that the ibex has no gas tank in the middle in the rear, and that there are no seat in the rear as well, therefore the winch has a perfect setup...if you guys can tell me how to do that on discos...i'll be the first to try it out!

By nadim on Thursday, March 22, 2001 - 12:06 pm: Edit

i am thinking about this...is it possible on a disco, because that would be more than great!

let us see...

there is space right before the rear differential, where there is a cylindrical crossmember...i think a low profile inch can fit there....and pointing it backwards, well, we can do that, but where can the cable go?...there is no space between the cab and the gas tank, so we'd have to go along the chassis, then out the bumper in the middle...then back along the chassis somehow in a straight line...to the front, then out the middle....mmmm...nope, i do not think it is possible!

oh, well, any suggestions?

By Milan on Thursday, March 22, 2001 - 03:24 pm: Edit

The winch cable does not have to come out in the center of the front/rear bumper/crss-member. I'll just be happy to end up on the right end.

Anyway, I actually was not thinking about my disco, initially.

By nadim on Thursday, March 22, 2001 - 03:45 pm: Edit

Yeah..I know about the setup...that it must not have to come out of the center...however, I think it would be ideal for me, that is why I am thinking about it...

Do you think it is doable...I mean, on the driver's side, there is nothing but the exaust...so maybe we can mount it where I previosly mentioned, outside under the rear seats, and route it following the driver's side...

I have a 4 inch lift, therefore I think there might be enough room to pass a 1" diameter galvanized tube around for the cable...

I don't know...it would be great though!

your thought?

By Clint on Thursday, March 22, 2001 - 04:06 pm: Edit

If I did it, the winch would be against a frame rail and the free end of the cable would be wrapped all the way around the truck and attached back to the winch body. Draw a hexagon for the approximate cable routing with both the front and back extended. The cable routing could follow the sides of both frame rails. I would use pulleys at each corner. There would be a total of 4 fixed pulleys and 2 pinable/removable pulleys.
The front and back are each double pulls.

Am I making any sense?

Clint

By nadim on Thursday, March 22, 2001 - 04:21 pm: Edit

come again?

By Milan on Thursday, March 22, 2001 - 08:07 pm: Edit

Well Nadim,
You got the wheels in my head turning. I will have to crawl under the Disco tomorrow or on Saturday. We got a cold spell today and the garage is not heated and since it's midnight here, I'm not about to look now, even though I want to. I'll et you know what I think. The one idea I don't like about winches mounted under the body, is how dirty they would get and possibly sieze when you most need them. Making a box for them makes little sense as the cable still has to come out through some opening. I also like to be able to easily access the spool. Oh well. I still think it would be neat.

Hey Clint,
What is it you're drinking? Can I have some?
I think so many pulleys would make the winch painfully slow and you'd need about 200' cable as well. But interesting concept nevertheless. I want something simpler, however. On the other hand, I think multiple pulleys may be necessary.

By Clint on Friday, March 23, 2001 - 03:51 am: Edit

Milan,
What i'm drinking right now is lots of water...
And yes, you can certainly indulge...

The only reason the winch would be slow is because of the double pulls. But that also reduces the LOAD on the winch. Electric motors increase speed with decreased load, so I think things would equal out. The four pulleys are there guide the cable around corners and reduce friction as much as possible.

You would need 200' of cable, but not all of it on the spool. 40' would always be out and wrapped around the vehicle. You would need a longer length for the double pulls. But you could also run thinner wire and put more on the spool. You can get away with this because you are always using a double pull.

The dunking issue is serious. Although a front mounted winch can get full of mud and quit working also. I would try to get the most waterproof winch you can find.

I would probably put a skid plate below the winch to protect it from splashing and bashing. You are never going to keep it dry, and any attempt to seal OUT water will only seal it IN.

The accessablility issue is more serious. Hopefully you won't need to get at the winch. Leave the clutch engaged and power in/power out.

Clint

By Clint on Friday, March 23, 2001 - 03:54 am: Edit

I'm trying to upload a picture

By Milan on Friday, March 23, 2001 - 05:03 am: Edit

Thanks for the pic,
I actually understood the setup from the beginning. Like I said, I think that more than 2 pulleys might be necessary and I was only razzing you.

I'm also aware of not all of the cable being on the drum but I just don't like the idea of so much cable wrapped around underneath the vehicle. Furthermore, each anchor point would have to be really strong and I think it's easier to design 2 strong points opposite each other as opposed to several pints placed assymetrically. One would have to be careful to not crumble the frame. I don't think the frame is as strong when it comes to side forces. However, the 2 pulleys exerting most side-load are near a crossmember, anyway and one could always brace it more.

Anyway, like I said, I'll take a look and see what I'd like to do on my vehicle. Good pint on the thinner cable. I'd still have to think whether a situation could arise where even with the pulley, you could brake the cable before stalling the winch. Besides, I'd be using Amsteel Blue anuway and even the 5/16" is rated at 11,700 lbs.

As far as sealing goes, I agree about boxes only trapping moisture in. In a salty climate your winch would be a pile of rust in one winter. I think a worm gear winch is a given. I would like to have access to the clutch lever though.

By Clint on Friday, March 23, 2001 - 07:29 am: Edit

About that lever...
Since you are out of the vehicle to winch anyway, it would be ok to attach a linkage to the clutch handle. The linkage would pass over the frame and be accessable if you reach under the passenger door. You might also run the linkage out the back or something.
Clint

By nadim on Friday, March 23, 2001 - 08:23 am: Edit

ok...

well, milan, you are lucky to have the luxury to have youre disco here with you, mine is thousands of miles away...but i have been under it soo many times that i think that i can imagine a little bit...

the space right behind the cylindrical croosmember i think is as good a place as i can think of now...it can easily fit a nice ramsey RE series winch...which i think is up to all the punishment!

ok, so we have the place, the winch, and now what...well...

is there a space between the gas tank and the body...that would be ideal to pass the cable there, then through a pully, back to the front following the right chassis rail?

does that sound good?

By Milan on Friday, March 23, 2001 - 08:53 am: Edit

Clint,
Exactly what I was thinking! A lever or linkage to under the drivers door. I think that would be ideal (short of cutting a hole in the floor and reaching it from the cab). A cable operated linkage might be good too and that one could be mounted almost anywhere.

Nadim,
I'll check that out for you. Since my disco's fairly new to me I've only been under it a few times. I don't like crawling there as without the lift I can't really fit. Maybe I should loose some weight, eh? ;) I can comfortably read a magazine under my other vehicles so I like crawling there much better.

BTW, has anybody fabricated a body lift for the Disco? I think 1" would be safe and it would help clearing bigger tires as well as a cable under the body. However, I'm not a big fan of body lifts to begin with and I find the stock Disoc body mount stalks a bit tall right from the factory.

By Milan on Monday, March 26, 2001 - 06:02 pm: Edit

Nadim,
I'm sorry but I have not been able to look yet. I have too many things going on this week and the next, so I won't have time to look properly until it's all done. I will keep entertaining your and Clint's ideas, though. So, I will post more once I have some data.

By nadim on Tuesday, March 27, 2001 - 04:36 am: Edit

No problem...it seems we are all pretty busy...