A Land Rover thread on a Jeep board

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Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 03:58 am: Edit

A buddy here at work (a J**p Cherokee driver) sent this link to me.

Interesting thread, the way a bunch of Jeep guys ended up defending the Rover against Jeep...

http://forums.jeepsunlimited.com/ubb/Forum18/HTML/009406.html


-L

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Anonymous on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 04:40 am: Edit

Land Rovers can kick a Jeeps ass. I just can't afford one.

yup

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 05:59 am: Edit

nice post on that jeep board, Kyle...you beat me to it :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 06:01 am: Edit

Someone had to crash the party.... :)

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chris Merritt (Smokinbro) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 06:03 am: Edit

Kinda of funny actually. Typical comparison is with a stock Disco and a modified Jeep. hmmmm apples to apples?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Moe on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 06:10 am: Edit

"Someone had to crash the party" I thought that was an invite to the 'only' party in town. Maybe we will convince some to convert :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Jeremy A. (Jmansphc) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 06:34 am: Edit

Just looking at the Jeep thread. That was a well said post RoverGuy!!!

Ignorence is bliss....

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 06:48 am: Edit

Please, surely you're not touting LR's realiability.


I think he got you there :)

Ron

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Lynden on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 07:09 am: Edit

Thanks Jeremy... I think this whole thread could go under the URS thread. We're all sick of the same of crap, "expensive SUV that won't go off road because you only bought it for the name and the leather seats."

Some of us bought them to scratch, but to get scratched in comfort!
Lynden

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Jeremy A. (Jmansphc) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 07:28 am: Edit

Yeah whatever. If people want to judge me because of my LR (they think I've got lots o' money or my parents bought it) so be it....

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Eric N (Grnrvr) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 07:45 am: Edit

The only question that I have is that the one jeep guy has a Land Rover Recovery Team sticker on his grand.. Did he recover a Land Rover to earn this sticker or did he just slap it on?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 08:41 am: Edit

what do you think? :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Moe on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 10:34 am: Edit

A big NO on that one. If he had earned it, he would know what a LR can do.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By MA on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 11:30 am: Edit

The same thing happenned in the Nissan Xterra board. I think the topic was "Ok guys, can my my Xterra school a Discovery?" Something like 80% of the people(including the site administrators) said that he shouldn't even try.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 11:57 am: Edit

but the xterra looks like a disco with the stepped-up roof...that's a start, isn't it? My wife wants one to haul the baby gear - a hip-hop mini-van :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By lynden on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 12:23 pm: Edit

What I really like is the fact that the clown that started that thread is nowhere to be found. He talked trash then all his buddies told him he's stupid so he left. Pretty funny. One guy even said something like "Yeah but at least Rover advertises their trucks really offroading, J**p just has comercials of trucks on dirt roads." Pretty good observation.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Andy Nix (Andy) on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 - 06:32 pm: Edit

They obviously didn't know what the hell they're talkin' about. "Rovers don't flex because they have a stiff ride". His hemmoroids must have been hurting him from wheeling his ch**p when he took a spin in the Disco.

I didn't know ch**p owners talked so much smack about us !

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By ARog on Wednesday, August 22, 2001 - 05:22 am: Edit

Kyle, man, that shit was cracking me up. I'm reading the thread as they are all trashing LR and then BAM, you jump in there with some nasty zingers. Good show man, that shit was funny as hell.
And you made some solid points too...

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Fast Eddy on Wednesday, August 22, 2001 - 05:35 am: Edit

Kyle is the designated hit-man :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Karen Jones on Wednesday, August 22, 2001 - 05:41 am: Edit

Oh geez, that thread over there began to get a bit ugly. I say to each their own and let everyone take pride in what they have. I like to do the Superiority Dance as much as the next guy, but usually in the privacy of my own home. Guys, we're a priviledged crew and we should always remember to be thankful we can have what we love. I know it took me a long time to be in a position to get here and I'm grateful to have made it. Rover on, eh?

Karen :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Discosaurus on Wednesday, August 22, 2001 - 06:40 am: Edit

Xterra - hehehe

See http://www.rfspecialists.com/lrx/Badlands/badlands3.htm

keith
discosaurus

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Wednesday, August 22, 2001 - 06:59 am: Edit

Very nice! On my last trip to Crown King (ancient little po-dunk mining town in mountains of AZ), I drove into the middle of an XTerra jamboree. They all stopped what they were doing and stared - I saw lots of drool. :) I drove right up the front steps of the saloon and parked it there (luckily the law is pretty slack up there).

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By discoman on Wednesday, August 22, 2001 - 07:50 pm: Edit

if ch##ps are so good why do most of the guy's with heavy mods run chevy power train ? And what do you do with all that plastic on the grand ch##p before you go off road. The only fair j##p is the tj. all the rest are trash.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Moe on Thursday, August 23, 2001 - 05:19 am: Edit

Is someone in MD going to school 'The Dillinger' over on the Jeep board? He flashed a pic of his rig--how intimidating :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Glenn Guinto (Glenn) on Friday, August 24, 2001 - 05:30 am: Edit

Very interesting/entertaining thread over there. Kyle, BlueGill, Ron and the rest of the D'web boys that went there, hats off to ya guys! I think it's somewhat flattering to see how many j**p guys would actually defend LRs in their own turf. That's like us saying "we have discos but we're lusting over j**ps". I get the shivers just typing that.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By John on Sunday, August 26, 2001 - 08:15 pm: Edit

I went to the jeep forum and was very amused at the comments. Comparing a j**p with a 6" lift and such to a stock rover. That is way to funny. However, there are a few posts on the 6th page of the thread from "green rover". Anybody know who this is? he seems to be covering every possible defense of rovers and knows his stuff. From the camel trophy to 'Mogs. Very interesting reading.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Monday, August 27, 2001 - 01:36 pm: Edit

bet you it's Ron in another disguise (no, not EvilRon). :)

hope you don't mind my posting your rig, but it was the perfect illustrated comeback to that super-duper sky-high cherokee articulation shot.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By pic on Monday, August 27, 2001 - 01:54 pm: Edit

super-duper sky-high cherokee articulation shot?

There was another shot of another Jeep,
spin

That's pretty good flex, but still "LIMITED"
LOL

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Monday, August 27, 2001 - 02:01 pm: Edit

notice which wheel is spinning in that shot...if only air were denser, then maybe those spinning lugs would bite into it and move him forward...

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By pic on Monday, August 27, 2001 - 02:12 pm: Edit

Wonder if that state of the art 4x4 system is working on that shot. YES, it's working, but still LIMITED!

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Wes Legaspi (Wes) on Monday, August 27, 2001 - 02:29 pm: Edit

The questions is this...how did the cheap look like after landing?

my picture

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By jon on Monday, August 27, 2001 - 03:51 pm: Edit

broken engine mounts, busted axle, bent chasis, etc.... 'this ain't your daddys shotgun!!!'

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Dale on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 06:44 am: Edit

I remember it like it was yesterday. The year was 2001 and the month was May. I was on the Moab Rim Trail minding my business. I look up ahead and what catches my eye? Why it's a D90, yes, that's what I spy. Then to my horror I notice something amiss. Why the D90's engine is taking a piss! The thing went on fire and smoke was all around. The driver jumped out and rolled on the ground. His yuppy friend grapped an extinguisher and jumped out of his seat. He sprayed the engine, man what a feat. The owner, disgusted, gets strapped down the trail. Tis a true story, I hope you enjoyed my tale.
-Dale
Happy owner of a '00 XJ and 73 CJ-5

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 07:12 am: Edit

LOL , I dont like the short bus much anyway. Most of the owners leave something to be desired as well... The ful size bus on the other hand is a completely different story... :)

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 07:17 am: Edit

"The ful size bus"

You mean the 110, right. hehehe

Ron

PS Kyle check your email

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By AL on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 07:48 am: Edit

Dale,
My horror story was 1999 Grand cherockee LTD.that i was driving with 24k on od. The entire dash
caught on fire on I94 in Chicago. My friend driving from Miami to Chicago in 2000 with ony 6k
on his wrangler engine electronics caught fire.
Hate to burst your bubble
I own 2001 DiscoII outperforms any stock J**P

Very happy owner

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Dale on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 08:08 am: Edit

I was just relaying my experience that's all. I have never heard of a Jeeps eletricals causing a fire, but everyone knows that is happens a lot more on British automobiles.
Plus, I just felt like putting it to a lovely rhyme.
-Dale

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 08:20 am: Edit

Yes , the full on defender is a force to be reckoned with. The short bus is just a toy.

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 08:47 am: Edit

Which mail Ron?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 09:11 am: Edit

You replied already.

Ron

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 09:13 am: Edit

> The short bus is just a toy.

Kyle,

You never cease to amaze me. The frequency with which you dismiss everything as crap is quite amazing. As the saying goes "ignorance is bliss!"

Just pickin' a fight for the hell of it.

nathan

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By George Stavros (Txwj) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 09:40 am: Edit

I am the guy with the Land Rover Recovery sticker, yes I have recovered a Disco. The reason that I got was was more tounge in cheek than anything. After a group of Disco's blew us off after we waved at them on the trail. Funny thing was later in the day they were winching up a hill we drove up.

Last time out, we had a Landy with us. I think that you could say that he was impressed. The hill that you have with my Jeep with it's wheel in the air, here is the Landy on the same hill

[img]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=977432&a=13565233&p=53527920[/img]

[img]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=977432&a=13565233&p=52389914[/img]

BTW, the only two vehicles in our group to make it through that was my Jeep and the Landy.

On another hill, they only one to try it was two Grands and the Landy. Here are the pic's of the Landy coming up and the carnage afterward.

[img]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=977432&a=13565233&p=53527919[/img]

[img]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=977432&a=13565233&p=53527917[/img]

[img]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=977432&a=13565233&p=53527915[/img]

BTW, I made it up and my ARB Bull Bar is just fine ;)

I don't dog Landys because I know that they and Jeep are the only real off roaders. With Solid axles they can go anywhere you are ballsy enough to point them.

I wish there were more Landys around to go wheeling with, the guy in the Orange Disco was great. We had a guy with us several months ago that did one trail with us then went home. Said that the trails were too tough for him, he didn't want to tear up his rig.

Hope to see you on the trails, my solid axle brothers :D

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Bill Bettridge (Billb) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 09:58 am: Edit

Good post George - enough of this LR vs Jeep bulls**t. (well -except for that schmo with the wing on the Jeep :) -but I'm sure someone out there has done something equally horrendous to a Disco)
With the direction both Chrysler and Ford are heading no one will have solid axles to play with soon!

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By chuanchen on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 10:07 am: Edit

god bless land rover!!

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 10:53 am: Edit

LOL Nathan , its a toy. Let me here about what you can get in that 90" bastard and how far you are gonna feel like driving it after you got it all in there. School me Nathan... I am all too well familliar with ignorance. In most cases its thinking your truck can do more then it actually can....I have seen them all in action and I know what is good at what. Its pretty damn obvious really..

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 10:54 am: Edit

Bill , I just have something against a vehicle that laughs at you when you are trying to start it. its always a bad sign... :)


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 10:56 am: Edit

And God damn Nathan , isnt it you who switched over to a disco when you needed to do some real shit? Isnt it you that paid someone else to do the work on it? LOL , ask yourself who has the most bliss here....LOL

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 10:57 am: Edit

Hey Nathan,

Didn't you sell the 90 and get a disco?

Ron

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By C. Ross on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 11:47 am: Edit

Those pic's were nice. It looks like the Disco wasn't even modified(Except for BFG AT's). That Gcherokee on the other hand looks a little more than stock. Also, that POS stock brushbar cost about half what the ARB does and most everyone that wheels very often upgrades it. The stock brush bar is more useful for pushing shopping carts out of the way. More than that and the results aren't pretty.

So a stock "Landy" went places that only a modified Gcherokee went...hmmmmm

I'd like to have the on road power of that J**P V8 though.

Ross
94 short bus
97 Disco

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By George Stavros (Txwj) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 12:04 pm: Edit

Yes but he was locked and I wasn't.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 12:11 pm: Edit

Kyle,

Yes, you're correct I sold my 90 and bought a Disco, which is a big reason why I know what in the hell I'm talking about.

The reason I sold the 90 had nothing to do with off-road capabilities, it had to do with a change of focus. For rock crawling, a 90 is far more capable than a Disco:

1. you can fit bigger tires with less mods (I had 35 12.50 Swampers with 2.5" of lift and no trimmming.

2. Much better approach, departure and breakover angles

3. Better ground clearance... sure the bottom of the frame sits at about the same level, but the bodywork isn't as exposed.

4. Lighter weight than a Disco

5. Better visibility than in a Disco, esp. with the top off.

Don't get me wrong, they're both VERY capable rigs, but I know I'll never be able to take the Disco on some of the trails that I took the 90 on.

As to why I sold the 90, I realized that expeditions were more for me than rock crawling. A soft top vehicle has zero vehicle security which isn't a good thing while traveling through 3rd world countries with thousands of dollars worth of gear.

Also, my Rovers have always been daily drivers, and soft tops are cold as hell: not a good thing when you live in a state that can get snow any time of the year (I froze my *ss off when I got caught in a snow storm on the way home from Santa Fe the last weekend of May.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 12:17 pm: Edit

Um , Nathan , what you just described was a toy. Fun for going out playing but not really a worker in this world..
As far as those "trails" you talk about. Just because you may not be able to take your sand glow disco there doesnt mean someone else cant. Or are you so infected with "defender head" that you cant see that? As far as I am concerned it doesnt really get interesting until you have come to the part of the trail that is freaking impossible.. Maybe you need to break down what "Capable" means to you... I think thats the problem most times.

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 12:27 pm: Edit

That little stock disco was locked up? What kinda locker?/

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 01:02 pm: Edit

I'll grant you that a 90 soft top could never be the expedition workhorse that a 110 SW could be, but that doesn't mean all 90s are "toys." Even still your previous comment was:

"Yes , the full on defender is a force to be reckoned with. The short bus is just a toy."

That has the connotation that a 90 is a poseur rig, which is not the case. A 90 SW actually a fairly nice compromise.

As to my definition of capable: The more capable a vehicle is, the better it's ability to get from point A to point B under it's own power (not including winching) and with the least amount of damage.

By that definition, a 90 will usually be more capable on hard core trails because of the above mentioned reasons.

But this isn't about 90s vs. Discos vs. 110s as much as it's about the fact that you so quickly dismiss things as crap (usually by usage of a condescening little nickname): ie SW Huskys (poodles), ARB lockers etc.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 01:30 pm: Edit

Nathan , LOL , man. So you are one of the winchless wonders eh? So , in the real shit it doesnt come down to a choice about winching or not. You either winch and keep going or not winch and stay right where you are. LOL. Your type cracks me up. You have a Superwinch worm gear winch? I have one right here that I have taken apart brand new right out of the box. Would you even know what the hell you were looking at if I showed you the parts? ARBs ? On the trip to Canada this week end one guys lockers failed. What kind were they? Can you guess? We werent on some trail 2 miles long . We were in the middle of BFE and that is more then a mild inconvenience.Since the guy had a nice big winch it wasnt so bad , but , you dont think that is "capable". It got him and all his shit out but I suppose that dont count.You think I speak without having some knowledge about what I am saying? Maybe since you do it you feel that others do as well.. Interesting.....
For the record I say again. My idea of "Capable" is being able to go where ever the hell you like when ever the hell you like at the drop of a hat , and , drag all the shit that makes that possible along with you.. Not a trail 2 miles from home but rather one that starts at home on asphault runs through the worst shit you can get yourself into and then back out of thousands of miles from home and then ends back at your front door. Not just once or twice but every freaking time you get the urge...
Allot of things togehter form this ability. Allot of those things just dont fit in that little 90" truck. Hell , a big set of speakers fill it. Fatigue , you get more road fatigue driving that short wheel base monster then you do with the Disco or the long bus. The list gos on and on. There are people that do those things in the 90s and my hat is off to them. You obviously didnt think your 90 was that capable yourself. You are now driving a Disco.. You mentioned pouser.. You getting much use out of those sand ladders ?

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 01:59 pm: Edit

How about you wanna tow some decent sized shit nathan?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 02:00 pm: Edit

How about that short range Nathan? How many offroad MPGs you think you are getting with that Pea sized tank?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:00 pm: Edit

Hey Nathan , how many lockers have you installed?


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:16 pm: Edit

Nate? Gone home? Ah well,,, I thought you wanted to pick a fight.... :)


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:28 pm: Edit

Kyle,

I'm not saying that I won't use a winch (hell I used my winch 4 or 5 time on my last outing by Steamboat, I'm just saying that a vehicle is more capable if it can make it over an obstacle under it's own power. My general rule of thumb is that if you can't make an obstacle without breaking something, then you call out the winch (or a tow strap).

As to the ARB lockers, I'd guess the failure that you were talking about up in Canada had to do with the air lines. If you're properly prepared on the trail (I carry a spare length of air hose "just incase") That isn't to say that you weren't prepared, just that it likely wasn't a catastrophic failure.

ARBs aren't without their faults, but they're the best locker for the type of wheeling that I do out in Colorado. Try taking a Detroit on a nice snowcovered off camber trail. That "corkscrew effect" sure isn't something I'd like to have to deal with if there's a 300 foot drop-off.

Then again, Detroits have a nasty tendency break when you snap a rear axle.

My point is that you tend to be a bit close minded about things sometimes. You appear to take a black and white view on a world of grays. What works great in your area up north doesn't neccessarily work well out West, and vice versa.


Nathan

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:33 pm: Edit

> How about you wanna tow some decent sized shit?

No, not really. The largest thing I'd likely tow with my (former) 90 or Disco would be a skankey (sp) trailer or maybe a catamaran. Anything bigger than that is just a pain in the ass at altitude.

> How about that short range Nathan? How many
> offroad MPGs you think you are getting with
>that Pea sized tank?

Well, everythings a compromise. And yes, that 200 mile cruising range does get old sometimes. On the other hand, if LR had given us Tdis instead of the thirsty V8s, 90s would have a nice cruising range of about 400 miles.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:36 pm: Edit

We arent talking about buts and ifs. We are talking about my statements and what you had to say about them...

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:38 pm: Edit

> how many lockers have you installed?

I don't really see how that's relevant, sorry.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:44 pm: Edit

"Working" is the key. You may have to adapt but the detroit will always work. If you have set the truck up right you wont be breaking axles either. If you thrash the thing I am sure you will but that gos back to the winch. Things are mostly black and white man. people just dont wanna hear that anymore. They want to coast it out in that gray area. The gray area also makes more cash.
Nope , wasnt a line. And if you have to carry a line that makes it reliable in your mind? I dont carry any kind of spare shit for a detroit , or a true trac. The ARB isnt reliable and no one can argue that. Its silly to say , "Sure its reliable , just take spares if it breaks". As for snow driving , well , you have to constantly adjust no matter whats in there. I myself would rather have something thats working. You didnt answer about the poodle.. or the lockers. I think I stand in a better position to make a statement about these things then you..You think maybe its you that speaks out of turn?

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:46 pm: Edit

> We arent talking about buts and ifs. We are
> talking about my statements and what you had to
> say about them...

In that case, yes it's an inconvenience to only have a 15 gall tank, and a piss poor design on the part of LR, but that doesn't mean you should condemn the whole vehicle.

Bring along a jerry can and you've 20 gals. of fuel. About the same cruising range as a Disco.

Nathan

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:49 pm: Edit

"I don't really see how that's relevant, sorry."

That says allot , what that says is you probably dont know much more then the average joe.You dont know much more about your ride aside from how it looks and you pay someone to do that as well. Now who has the bliss ? I mean really? If you knew more about these things that you are busting my chops for making statements about then you might stand on better ground. As it stands you are cork screwing down that snowy off camber slope..

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:50 pm: Edit

You also havnt answered about those real perdy sand ladders...

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 03:54 pm: Edit

Maybe if I say "Versatility" it will clear some cob webbs out. That surely is a majior factor in capability,,,, dont you think?


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:00 pm: Edit

I dont condemn the whole vehicle at all. To tell you the truth its allot of the owners attitudes that I condemn. But the facts are the facts. The little defender is ,,,well , ,,,,its just little. It has uses but capable as we know it means more then making one obstacle somwhere near a road. We all have time constraints and we all have a long drive to get to anything thats real. I am not saying anything that hasnt been said about little trucks a hundred times before.

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:05 pm: Edit

> Things are mostly
> black and white man. people just dont wanna hear
> that anymore. They want to coast it out in that
> gray area.

If that's what you want to believe, then more power to you, but that's a bit closeminded in my opinion. You just seem to think that if it ain't on your truck... then it's shit, and that's not the case

>As for snow driving , well , you have to
>constantly adjust no matter whats in there.

I'll be sure to mention that while I'm winching your ass out of a gulch when your Detroit walks you off the trail.

> You didnt answer about the poodle.. or the lockers.

Poodle: Yes I have a Husky 10K, but it's sitting in my garage right now since I'm waiting on a Mantec bull bar to mount it on. Right now I'm running a POS Warn winch, which I can't wait to get rid of.

As to the lockers: I don't think it's all that relevant, but...3 and I'll do 2 more this winter (money permitting).

Rather than addressing the issue, why do you feel the need to keep attacking my credibility???

You want to know a bit about me? Here goes, I bought my first car, a classic mustang when I was 15, I spent about 3 years doing a ground up restoration on it with my dad. We did EVERYTHING on it, including the paint, body work and rebuilding the engine. Since then I've had a hand in 2 other restorations and rebuilds.

In the 3 years that I owned my 90, I did all of the mods to it myself with the exception of some of the tranny work. No, I didn't do the majority of the work on my Disco, a fact that bothers me, but I had 4 weeks to get it in order for an expedition, while I was working 60+ hours a week at work and working on my 90 at the same time.

Don't worry though, I'll be doing all the rest of the work on it.

Nathan - aka the Devil's Advocate

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:10 pm: Edit

> You also havnt answered about those real perdy
>sand ladders...

LOL, sorry I visions of dualing banjos.

No, I haven't had a chance to use them yet, but I've only had the truck for 2 months. As the saying goes, it's not how much you use something, it's how badly you need it when you do use it."

Sure there's a bit of poseur factor to it in CO, but they sure as hell might come in handy this weekend out in the DESERTS of southern Utah.But when I go someplace where I don't think I'll be using them, I take them off

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:13 pm: Edit

> I say "Versatility" it will clear some cob
> webbs out. That surely is a majior factor in
> capability,,,, dont you think?

Sure it's a factor. But isn't that the big advantage of the ARBs which you so despise....versatility????

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:25 pm: Edit

Nathan , I go after your credibility because you leave it wide open. My truck suits me , but then again , I like Wolfes 110. And I like John Lees 90. Trucks that I had no part in setting up. Wolfe also has ARBs and realizes that they arent reliable. Note when I thrash something and say its worthless and when I say something is just not as good as something else. I ussually also back that up with why. I have said the huskys are better then the planetary options out there but they arent built as well as the ramsey. I have had most winch makes apart and its plain to see what is decent and what isnt. I have also seen them pull. The husky pulls nice but still isnt built as well as the ramsey. Do you actually follow anything I say or just pick out the parts you dont like? I have no problem saying I think something is a hunk of shit , it shouldnt be very hard for you to seperate those statements from the others.If you want to pick at my statements bail in when something comes up and give it a shot. My skin isnt thin. And dont say any more about pouser while you are sporting those ladders that are admitedly there for looks..

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:27 pm: Edit

lol , yes , the ARB is very versatile. But , the unpredictability makes that moot. You cant argue that man , you carry extra hose...Go ahead man , step up to the plate and be the second ARB owner I know to tell the plain truth and say that the ARB just plain isnt as reliable as the detroit.

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:33 pm: Edit

Your saying I have not addressed the issue.
Hmmm , ok , then break down for me all the things the little defender is good at. We will handle it like that.

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By please on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 04:55 pm: Edit

I can feel the average IQ around here dropping like a stone balloon while reading you two guys' posts. give it a rest.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Nathan Hindman (Nathanh) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 05:10 pm: Edit

Well, "please" has called a cease fire, so i'll call it quits, but I will grant you this one last concession: Sure the ARB isn't as reliable as a Detroit. But I'm still going to run an ARB because it suits my needs better.

You know, one of those shades of grey things...;-)

Nathan

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Andrew Vick (Afv) on Wednesday, August 29, 2001 - 05:27 pm: Edit

Kyle, why don't you, once and for all, give YOUR definition of what is "capable". Your posts are very respected, by me as others, but your definition wanders......You hammer people as a last defense on "capability", but lack a definition yourself.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By michel on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 07:05 am: Edit

The definition of capable is quite clear cut from the post above. Basicaly, leave home, drive long distance to get lost in some god forsaken trail, get through whatever the terrain trows at you, carry everything you need for food/sleeping/recovery/fixing, drive back home. Pretty simple.

Michel

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 07:36 am: Edit

Yes , very simple untill important things dont perform as they should or , you couldnt bring something that you should have.. I will try to clear it up when I have a bit more time....

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron L on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 09:02 am: Edit

Kyle has a point that all of you need to hear instead of being offended by it. The point is that in LR Aftermarket no matter what the sense or product is, everybody mentions how weak the stock items are and therefore it is necessary to purchase their product no matter what it is. Then you buy their crap and pay an arm and a leg for it because the market is so limited and because you need it since they will swear up and down that without it your going to break on the trail, crawl, expedition or supermarket parking lot. Kyle speaks from experience, and has every right to be pissed and biased because I am willing to bet that if you guys spent so many $$$ on certain parts and found yourself stuck as a result of failure you would be pissed too, if not right then and there than definitely when you got home and called the manufacturer and they told you there is nothing they can do about it.

My experience? A relative’s rig that spent several days and several thousands in southern California to get what is arguably the "best" suspension kit available on the market. Professionally installed by the people who make the stuff. Had no problems on the highway until it got into, way into, the northern Oregon forest area. It’s not what failed, its how it failed, when it failed and the fact that it failed under very minor duty, it’s the fact that it failed BRAND NEW. The fact that now we are stuck out in the middle of nowhere and I cannot exactly call and ask them to ship me the part. Let alone assume they will replace the BRAND NEW component for free.

Would you expect me to come to this site and continuously support the product, because thousands of dollars were invested into it and I am too ashamed to admit its SH*T.

I'll keep listening to Kyle's pig headed, selfish, biased remarks. The man speaks from experience and has the proof to back it up, he has every right to be pissed after the thousands he has thrown out the "window".

Kyle's "Capable" is his own experience, what works for him. Even if he gave you a definition of "capable" its still his definition.

The last thing I would ever want to do is lose a winch when I really need it, especially when the safety of myself and the rig are compromised, change a rear end on the trail, or have to figure out a way to build a welder out of a jerry can and a pack of gum.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Andrew Vick (Afv) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 11:50 am: Edit

Well said, well spoken, and emphasizes the fact that "capability" is very individually based. I (I'm sure I'm not alone) have very high regard for Kyle's opinions, trials, and tribulations. I sure haven't gone to the level of expense and experience he has, but am interested in his definition.

Kyle: are you having to work today, and that is what's keeping you:)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 12:06 pm: Edit

Yeah , but I will reply here shortly from home...


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 12:14 pm: Edit

Kyle,
You should have let me know you were headed up to my old stomping grounds, could have told you some fun rover/non-rover stuff to do in niagara falls. Did you see Paul Safari?

Cheers
Ron

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chucky on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 02:28 pm: Edit

Guys,

I am not going to BS about this crap, I'd rather have a chance to show that a 90 can deal with the crap that a disco can't in some tough terrain. I have a challenge for you Kyle...bring your disco to the "Undertaker" or "M" trail and put it up against a "setup" 90 and see who comes out w/ the least damage (especially body). You up to following a D90 into that terrain? Then, let's make it even more interesting...

Loser pays for the other person's admittance fee and gas, sound fair?

Then, put this crap about what's better off-road to bed.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 02:53 pm: Edit

dear chucky, chucky, bo-bucky,

you are a fool, have you not read the posts.

now please shut up


-rd

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 03:17 pm: Edit

Paul Safari? Nope...

As far as capable goes I have said it a few times already but maybe I was unclear to the guys that have never really seen what the truck they are driving is capable of if equiped right . I think that is the problem really. They dont trust what they are driving and the stuff they have added. or their ability or something like that. Ability surely comes into play but the truck you are driving started off pretty damn good right out of the box.
The first and most important thing in my book is reliability/durability of the truck itself. If it aint running or is imobilized for some reason then you obviously are going no where. As I said previously you have a damn good head start with the thing right out of the box.
When you start to build this thing up you are creating a system of sorts. This system should be designed for a task. This task is broad and the system components should not conflict with each other nor should any one of them degrade any good quality the thing had out of the box. Infact, your upgrades should just compliment what was there before without complicating it further. The more you complicate things, the higher your odds of failure become. The K.I.S.S principle is a beautiful thing

Capable in my book means that you can go anywhere and do anything with your truck and equipment. Not just rocks, not just mud, not just snow or water but everything. As I have said before. I think of my truck as a “Jack of all trades, master of none”
I say that and people think that is not a good thing to say. Like I am saying its good for nothing. What I am saying is that in order to do it all I have sacrificed doing a few things to perfection.
Capable also has much to do with the environment you are in. The environment I am speaking of is everywhere and everything and that isn’t two miles from my house, or yours. To get to that environment you will have to burn some road miles. It’s just the way things are. It’s also a fact of life that we all have jobs and time constraints. We have to have a plan and it has to be carried out damn near flawlessly for us to be able to fit it in. Breakdowns and poking along on the highway don’t help you out much as far as plans are concerned and can ruin things in a hurry.
Capability is also versatility at all times. What if I get a boat? What if I want to take an off road trailer? What if I need to haul a shit load of people? Things like that are every day life and have nothing to do with a trail but says something about how capable your vehicle is. How your truck performs everything you can possible think of is how I rate its capability. How many times it can do it is how I rate its capability.

I guess my line of sight comes from the Cheesy Land Rover Mystique. When a guy at the 7-11 says, “Damn man, that’s one of them Land Rovers isn’t it? Those things can go anywhere” I like to be able to smile and say. “Yep,,,it sure can”

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chucky bo bucky on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 03:31 pm: Edit

Rob, here's the dealy:

The tone that Kyle represents anytime a subject w/ anything to do with a 90 he comes up with comments like the following:

"let me know when your short bus needs a lesson about how capable a disco is...

Kyle "

I'm sick of hearing this tone of crap...shut up and do something. I've brought a challenge to the table...well?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Andrew Vick (Afv) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 03:36 pm: Edit

Excellent response. After I wrote in last night, I was somewhat concerned that my post may be construed as somewhat inflammatory (may have been the vodka courtesy of United Airlines talking):) Anyway, your post rings true: I run a stock '95 Disco that I bought new, offroad 8-10 times per year, and appreciate what it does versus the Cheep Grand and Troopship that I had before. Moving from Colorado to Georgia back to Colorado has allowed me to run all vehicles on varying terrain and stock works for me, although I don't push it. The "not just rocks, not just snow" comment is very apropos, as you never know what you'll have to deal with. The instance that most comes to mind is: "do you have any jumper cables?", "Why yes, I certainly do, and they're on the third shelf at the rear of my garage!"

Thanks for the commentary, and please let "Chucky Cow Pucky" know what to expect! (Pokerob got me started), (or ignore Schucky and maybe he'll go away)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 03:38 pm: Edit

LOL , Chuck , you are challenging me to a contest in a controlled adventure Park.. LOL thats like a ramp or forklift contest. Lets get out in some real shit shall we? Or is that the real shit to you? Obstacle seeker? Fucking obstacles are just in the way of me going where I need to go..

Kyle
I will go to Paragon in October so Heather can run the trails in her truck..lol , perhaps you can compete with her...

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 03:43 pm: Edit

Chuck , how about we leave the same spot in MD. Run the trail in Northern Ontario that I just ran and return home. ALONE. It will be timed ofcourse.
Thats more my style...

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 03:45 pm: Edit

kyle , can i come? i want to see how i do too.

heather probably will out drive me again, but i dont mind.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Schucky? on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:03 pm: Edit

That's funny man, a controlled adventure park...you condoned such use of land a while ago instead of illegal trail rides in our area...and above you even note that you are going there in October (but yet you try to knock it here)! WTF?

So obstacles are just in the way of you going where you need to go...so if you get to an obstacle in the "real shit" that you cannot conquer in your disco, you pack it up and go home, eh? Maybe you should stick to some firetrails or dirt paths.

There are two trails I offered in a "controlled" environment that are perfectly legal to attempt and have been conquered by "setup" vehicles.

You choose to retreat from my offer by your typical smoke and mirror crap. Just admit your disco cannot do it and I'll leave you alone. :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:09 pm: Edit

Chuck , You still dont get it do you? LOL , I myself wont pay to get into paragon to run. But , there is a ladies run there and Heather wants to do it. So , there ya go..
An obstacle gets in the way and I get over,under, around it how ever I need to to get done what needs getting done.
Your offer is just,,,well , its crap , its no more then a ramping contest in one enviroment.
My offer is dead serious you just let me know when you wanna leave..
Leave me alone?? LOL maybe you mistake me for someone who gives a shit... Lets go big boy. You up for a little run? Or you wanna continue running the parks?

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:12 pm: Edit

I can see the land Rover add now "Land Rover , master off all off road parks"

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By chrisvonc on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:16 pm: Edit

Umm.. Discos already have run those trails just as well as any D90 or jeep with simiular setups. If you start bashing your shit up, its not the truck.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:18 pm: Edit

Cmon Chuck , no camp ground , no shot gun riders , no support. Just you and what you can get in your truck.. Man , thats the shit that Land Rovers live for.....

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:21 pm: Edit

Chris there is nothing at stake there... You just winch or not and you get through. You been there and seen so you know... My proposition has a little more at stake.


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chuck on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:22 pm: Edit

Perhaps you easily forget that I've done the x-country thing, a number of times...nothin big amigo. Perhaps you also missed the point of the loser pays for gas and the fee to Paragon? I've listed the obstacle for you to get over,under, around it how ever you need to to get done what needs getting done. So are you stating that you don't think your rig could handle the "obstacle course"?

Sorry guy, your counter-offer is crap...should we test your 0-60 time as well? I'm sure you got me there...how 'bout 1/4 mile?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:28 pm: Edit

is chucky gone? he probably had to go to bed...

chuck's mom:
"dear you've got school in the morning,, it's time for bed"

chucky:
"but mom, kyle's been schoolin' me all night long"


rd

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By marty amedeo (Marty) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:29 pm: Edit

Why don't you guys come to the Hope Expedition Center in Maine this October and "duke it out". Let's see which vehicle is the most capable and settle this once and for all.

We have plenty of exteme mud and boulder stream beds that will challenge the most capable of 4 wheel vehicles. The course is open to all vehicles.

Visit us at www.delrc.com and check out the Work Ride and the Holloween Extreme in the video section.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Eric N (Grnrvr) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:31 pm: Edit

Well if you guys go this week look me up on the way out. I'll be at Shawmere in Lyndhurst, ON on Red Horse Lake from this Saturday night till the following Saturday morning. We can have a couple beers by the fire and you can tell me how the trail ride went. Shouldn't be too hard to find me. I'll be the only one there with a Disco. Incase by some chance there are two just look for the green one with the Discoweb stickers on it. :) I'm ussually back at the cabin from fishing all day at around 6:30pm-7:00pm for dinner.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:35 pm: Edit

Hmm , chuck , my offer is everything "Land Rover". My offer also says how much faith you have in yourself and your truck. I will run the trails you are talking about when I am up there with Heather and still look back and laugh. If you wanna be there for the powder puff run hell , I will have her drive em for ya..
I cant belive you are saying that my offer is crap when my offer means that you have to have every faith in your truck and equipment to complete. The road aint that long if you have done X country and the trail is only 30KM long. If you and the defender is more capable then it should be no biggie for you..
I promise you that this trail is no fire road. Some of your 35" tired defender brothers turned around without finishing it once...You want me to allow you a shot gun rider for a handicap? :)

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chuck on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:52 pm: Edit

Kyle,

While your offer is intriguing, I'm curious who the 90 boys are that turned back from this trail?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:52 pm: Edit

Chuck? Gone to bed now?

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 04:56 pm: Edit

lol , cmon , its not just intriguing.. You know I am right.. What turned you around? Was it the shotgun rider? :) I believe one of them was a yellow Bee like yours... :)

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chucky on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:03 pm: Edit

Kyle, I love the LR journeys and the trips...but do you know who it was in the 90s (names)? I'd love to know who of similar 90 setup would of passed on a trail challenge that your otherwise stock suspension disco tore up. :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chucky on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:05 pm: Edit

OK, I'll check back tomorrow after the game...Rob, your mommy is calling me to bed...
:)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:06 pm: Edit

I know the names and I know its fact. Others know this as well. "Tore up" lol , I dont look to tear anything up , I look to make it,,, . We did that....

kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:08 pm: Edit

Ouch,,,damn ROb,,,,lol

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chucky on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:08 pm: Edit

OK, fine..."made it", whatever. I wasn't implying what you are trying to elude to. C'mon, you know what I meant man. Who were they?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:13 pm: Edit

Maybe someone will tell the story.... :) The unknown just makes it better man.... :)


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:15 pm: Edit

ISnt Robs mom calling you?? :) (You dont know Rob , he is truley sick) lol

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:24 pm: Edit

mommy? damn... thats what your daddy called kyle last night.

kyle , you got bitch tit's ?

rd

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:34 pm: Edit

LOL , how did I get in the middle of that,,,,lol and keep it down Rob , there are allot of females reading the boards..... You might get "Bitch slapped"


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 05:39 pm: Edit

hey man,, i'm just quoting from "fight club"

but from your reaction i must have hit the nail on the head.

-rd

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By al h. on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 06:16 pm: Edit

Marty, nice invitation but i gotta ask. Why do they call it the Down East Landrover Club? I mean, sheesh Maine??? How about the Artic Circle Rover's group or the Eskimo car club?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron L on Thursday, August 30, 2001 - 09:37 pm: Edit

Kyle,

Sorry I am late to the fight, had to work! I just put 4200 miles on my rig in less than 6 weeks, as I have mentioned to others I like to get to Oregon as often as possible. I am willing to take this guy in the D-90 on right now, put your money where your mouth is.

My brother in law has a both 95 d-90 and disco. HE WILL ADMIT THAT he does not hold a candle to his wife’s STOCK disco let alone my DISCO 2, which is stock as well. He will even tell you about our excursions out where yes he may have been able to climb some rocks because he has more ground clearance and because he will openly admit that I had to CARRY ALL of his recovery gear and his personal items so that he could brave the trail.

He even tried his "defender head" syndrome and challenged me to deep wade where he past through with some problems and took on a lot of water. My STOCK disco II waded in water that was up to its hood and kept HIS clothes, HIS two kids and my fiancée dry doing it.

I know my limitations with my rig, MY TIRES! That’s IT nothing else. You name it I have done it, and that’s far better than bragging about how much ground clearance and rock crawling you can do.

I would rather have a little of everything than allot of one thing. So if crawling rocks are your deal, stick to it and mind your business. If creating your own trail is your thing, THAN YOU HAVE THE WRONG RIG TO DO IT IN.

Pull your head out of your ass Chucky, you belong in a JEEP not a D-90.

Kyle.... you ever make it out to the west coast...Look me up, I would enjoy a couple days of wheeling with you. I prefer wheeling with guys who wheel, not guys who sit in their rover at the gate and talk about what they did last time they were there with other JEEP owners.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By chrisvonc@gotmud.org on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 02:06 am: Edit

As an owner of both a modified disco and modified D90, I can say that with both my trucks being fairly close in setup, that neither truck has any kind of hand over the other for completing trail runs safely and with as little damage as possible. Now if you go out an look for something like a rock ledge that by nature is more suited to the shorter wheel base, there are plenty of them out there just as there are things more geared to the longer wheel base however none of them have denied the other from getting over them.
The age old fight that a D90 is a better trail truck than a Disco and that you have to have 35"+ tires to run the trails is complete horse shit and it has been proven time and time again by not only Rover owners, but jeepers, hummers, and Toys owners. Its all in the drivers mind. If YOU feel best and are able to get a better groove going driving a D90 than in a Disco, then for YOU, the D90 is the better truck. But to date, out of all the web site photo gallerys, I have yet to see a single trail that could not be done by either truck, with the exception of the full blown rock buggy trails.
This challange is not a new one. It rises every so often but yet it seems that the people who have the hardest time accepting the facts when the challange is met and overcome, are those who still spout that you HAVE to run the huge tires and need to trailer your truck to the trails. If someone like to run that way (big tires and so on) for whatever reason, I am cool with that. Personal perferance drives many mods people perform on their trucks, but dont sit there and tell me that a truck cant run trails without them because someone somewhere out there has already run that trail without them.

Chris

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By chrisvonc on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 02:16 am: Edit

Gang, its a good thread going here but lets try not to sink the level down and ruin it by telling each other that they dont belong in a Rover, to get ones head up or out of asses, or degrade each others mothers (especial since I just had both of yours last night and they were really good.. hehe).

Chris

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 03:33 am: Edit

Kyle,

Paul Safari is right across the bridge in canada in queenston. AWDC ex-pat guy, mainly series but coilers too. If you ever should need a part or a garage when you are up there look him up. If nothing else it is really fun to see all his trucks.

Cheers
Ron

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 04:22 am: Edit

I will have to keep that in mind next time Ron , although it seems my next trip might be a little hurried.. :)

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By donkey boy on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 04:43 am: Edit

Gee guys, bashing each other? Defender against Disos? You guys are not for real! At the Jeep board, we try to promote some understanding between differend brands and here, you don't even get along within the same brand?

I'm just happy that me as a Series and Defender guy preferred becoming a Jeeper and bought a WJ (Grand Cherokee) rather than getting a Disco.

Some people ...

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 04:48 am: Edit

Well , it aint like that Donkey. I have no ill will towards Chuck here. Its all part of the same sport and no matter what we do we will have a blast doing it. Maybe I get smoked , maybe he gets smoked.. maybe we both break down in the middle of BFE and have no choice but to laugh about it.. Dont look at debates like death matches... I dont...


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Discosaurus (Discosaurus) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 06:26 am: Edit

Kyle, I think 'ol Chuck (who you obviously know) doesn't see the line between trail/park run and expedition. That's obvious every time he challenges you to some trail or another.

I think it's true D90's are better rigs for extreme trail runs then Disco's. Hey, just in the fact they're smaller makes that happen. But, if I wanted a rig to hack up with monster tires and big lifts so I could roll it down some hill, end over end, I'd probably get a CJ or a FJ40 - hell of a lot cheaper. But, you put trails like the worst of Moab or the Rubicon in the MIDDLE of a 6000 mile journey and you want to be self sufficent, you're toast in a D90. I've followed ennough of them on long trips to know that's not where I want to be. Chuck just don't get it !

Now, a D110 or D130, THAT'S what I'm talkin' about !

keith
discosaurus

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ron on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 07:58 am: Edit

110,

the full size bus, now available with a pop top:

http://www.eastcoastrover.com/Sipe.html

Ron

He took my idea, at least I have dormy seats too.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 08:41 am: Edit

I've spent a lot of time drooling over the projects on that board, this one is my favorite:

http://www.eastcoastrover.com/110Wagon.html

someday.......

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Discosaurus (Discosaurus) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 08:42 am: Edit

That thing is very nice !

I sure hope the guy who owns it actually gets out in the bush once in a while - would be a shame to have it parked in the corporate carpark all the time.

Yep, full size bus - as capable as a 90, plus space to put your stuff. If they were NAS available in 1996, I wouldn't be driving my Disco...

keith
discosaurus

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Discosaurus (Discosaurus) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 08:47 am: Edit

Actually, for some reason, I like these a lot...

highcap

...don't know why. Must be 'cuz I live in the cunn-tree...

keith
discosaurus

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 09:03 am: Edit

Those are sweet rides, too. Keeping with the original "Land Rover as work truck" theme. There is a beautiful white hi-cap in Strawberry, Arizona. I'm headed up there in about an hour for the long weekend. I see him drive by the cabin all the time, and he waves at me, but I'm determined to get him to stop and talk this time...

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 03:59 pm: Edit

Chuck??? The game is over isnt it? Ravens lose? :)


Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 04:14 pm: Edit

ok CHuck , I am tired and Have to put a head on a 7 series Volvo in the AM. I will check in on ya from time to time.. Probably raining in Canada now,,,damn that makes a mess :)

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By AL on Friday, August 31, 2001 - 04:23 pm: Edit

WOW, That is a sweet ECR rig GIL
How much you think that setup costs?
I lost my 2001 corvette convt last night due to flood.
That looks like a good replacment.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chuck on Saturday, September 01, 2001 - 04:55 am: Edit

Kyle,

Sorry couldn't respond yesterday...post-game festivities prevailed. :) (Sorry to all the NY Giants fans here...looks like your guys couldn't come through yet again...)

The place you are talkin' about looks to be a big mud hole (unless I'm missing something). I'm sure if that's what you're after we could surely find that type of slop around here...

Perhaps when I get some time again in the future we could trek out west to AZ, NM, UT, and/or CO and see what's what since the "park" trails aren't good enough for you. I'm sure the top-heavy disco will do great on the trails we could go check out... :) Heck, why don't we just go to Tellico and do Slickrock, Lower 2, or something of that like...and if you want, I'm sure we can find some slop to play in too.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chuck on Saturday, September 01, 2001 - 04:56 am: Edit

BTW, I didn't see any 90s in any of the pics...still no names, eh?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Saturday, September 01, 2001 - 05:33 am: Edit

Still not getting the point Chuck. Finding it around here isnt what we are looking for. Being able to travel a long distance with some bullshit in the middle is what I am talking about. Its not just all mud holes there. Some is just like Moab with trees.. There are rocks everywhere.. You have to be able to completely rely on your abilities and your trucks abilities to take that challenge... It aint no walk in a park.. :)

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Ho Chung (Ho) on Saturday, September 01, 2001 - 06:10 am: Edit

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Saturday, September 01, 2001 - 06:23 am: Edit

Chuck your avoidance in this challenge is because you know you will have lost before you get out of the state. You will be in the middle of the trail when I am crossing back into the US.
You also know very well that your defender is more prone to breaking something while on the trail because of the giant meats its wearing.You break it there and you are pretty screwed. It aint like Paragon or tellico with people running everywhere that can help you out if you have an issue.Running remote areas alone tests you , your truck and your faith in both.
You also validated a point I made earlier in your last post. You said you dont have time. Well , isnt that what I was talking about earlier and how time has to fit into what we see as capable? A three day weekend is more then enough time for me to make that run up and back if nothing catastrophic happens. But it aint for you is it? You have to stop for gas more , you have to run slower and fatigue will get you long before it gets me.
You keep going back the the big rocks in certain areas. Yes , you can climb a big rock with more ease. It doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure that out with the meats you are running. But your ability to do that has made you suffer in other arenas. You know that as well.

Kyle

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By kyle on Tuesday, September 04, 2001 - 04:15 am: Edit

Chuck???

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Tuesday, September 04, 2001 - 07:11 am: Edit

my sisters boyfriends' brothers -best friend heard last night from some guy at 31 flavors that chuck's d-90 broke down on the way to the dealer to get an oil change,,, so he wont be making it into work,, and thats why he cant post today.

-rd

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Chuck on Tuesday, September 04, 2001 - 12:12 pm: Edit

Nah, no need to respond...I know what I can do and have the balls to prove it. I come to your domain and put down an offer. You counter offer w/ some trek to test one's distance handling...been there, done that (and would gladly do it again...just can't anytime soon w/ a kid on the way, need the vaca time). Perhaps you'd like to join us on a trek we're planning to Alaska in 2002? I should have the extra fuel cell by then so I shouldn't be holding you up...

You've already said what I needed to hear. The 90 is a better vehicle in the rocks and extreme trails...btw, still no answer on who in a 90 turned around, eh? :)

BTW Rob, the chocolate chip cookie dough double-dip was good.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Blue Gill (Bluegill) on Tuesday, September 04, 2001 - 12:20 pm: Edit

Alaska 2002? I'm trying to head that way summer 2002..............

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Tuesday, September 04, 2001 - 02:51 pm: Edit

LOL , here we go again , "Extreme" trails. That shit cracks me up. THe hardest part about these "extreme" trails is finding where we are gonna set up the grill. I also didnt say the 90 was better there. I said having the big tires was. Fuel cell? LOL As far as time is concerned. We leave here on a Friday night and we are back again on Sunday. You might not be back cause I have a good idea you will either be broke or stuck up to your ass in BFE nowhere..But thats on you. I am allowing you a shotgun , do you want me to allow you a trailer as well?
As far as the no risk rocks are concerned , as I said before. Heather will run em and you can come compete then if you like. That is , if you can take a day of watching chicks run these "extreme" trails of yours..As far as Alaska is concerned...lol...I have a feeling we got ya beat there as well. to the tune of 6-700 off road miles.. How many jerry cans is that for you? LOL
Your hounding me about the names isnt working,,lol , quite a few know about it , you just dont..

Kyle
P.s It dont take any balls at all to run Paragon. The minute I accept that dumb shit I am just as lame. Its like I am agreeing that its the shit.It takes balls to go it alone. But you wouldnt know that would you? Actually , it takes more balls on your part to rely on the Jeeped up defender... :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By Kyle Van Tassel (Kyle) on Tuesday, September 04, 2001 - 02:56 pm: Edit

I am also offering you an "Extreme" trail right in the middle of this trek. There have been mogs rendered useless there as well as old and new defenders..It takes more then a big set of tires to get you through. When you have finished it says something about the vehicle you were driving and how capable it was. Not just the god damned tire size..

Kyle


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