By Eric N (Grnrvr) on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 03:36 pm: Edit

Looks like someone got the mud they wanted.. Damn, John, did you get 4 runner envy and had to make your rear window go down too?

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:04 pm: Edit

Permantly down....

By Kyle on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:05 pm: Edit

Whats up with the 35$$$$ Video ? Damn that hurts... They already finished a Video ???


Kyle

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:17 pm: Edit

Somebody make a video and selling it? There was a woman cruising around with one of them big cameras come to think about it.

By Kyle on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:21 pm: Edit

Looka t the Roav site... I am not understanding how its for sale when tehy havnt had time to make it..

Kyle

By Heather on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:23 pm: Edit

pretty cool pics,,, looked like a lot of fun!!

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:24 pm: Edit

yes john, they are selling videos.
i was waiting and waiting for the mar pics, and finally ron sent me some, then garrett,
then i thought, someone out there must have a shitload of pics somewhere.
so i go to roav.org, to see what they had.... no pics at all!!! ahh, but what they have instead? a VIDEO!

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:34 pm: Edit

Lol, a video thats not made yet at that? Maybe the $35 is the down pmt. lol...I will have some for you Ho when Greg H. gets back from Moab...he took a ton(20 rolls) and says they turned out really good.

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:38 pm: Edit

Heather, now that you are wheeling with the HoMoBile you can start making a few events.

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:41 pm: Edit

greg will probably hold them until the magazine is published....

but would be cool if he shared some pics with us here.

send them over when you get them.

thanks.

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:42 pm: Edit

hmm, who you calling a ho now?

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:43 pm: Edit

The white truck...whatever its name is...

By Kyle on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:45 pm: Edit

Hmmm , the Homobile is Yellow. and the Circus come to town but once a year , no need to go in search of it....


Kyle

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:45 pm: Edit

He says he is going to send me some good ones to post

By Kyle on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:46 pm: Edit

The white truck is "Slinky" just not as slinky as it used to be..... or as noisey....


Kyle

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:51 pm: Edit

With Heather driving it daily I guess you needed to take off the coilovers...

By Kyle on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:54 pm: Edit

There has to be some redesign there before they can stay . The freakin noise will drive a man (Or woman) insane...


Kyle

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 05:57 pm: Edit

Do the DOT S.S. brake lines have a teflon inner liner?
Lol, a question out of nowhere...
And DOT approved because of the spin test?

By Ron on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:03 pm: Edit

John,

What brand? PP or Earls? It depends. Also Earls suck finsih is poor.

Ron

By Kyle on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:03 pm: Edit

I know they have a sleeve in there but nothing about the spin shit.... You trying to get some made ?


Kyle

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:08 pm: Edit

Yes, damn people getting too pricey with lines,esp the series II lines9($50 to $60 each is what they are charging) I got a co. that made me samples and at a price that is more affordable to people

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:13 pm: Edit

Ron, I got a SG, RW,RA and earls line in my hand and cant see any difference in the lines at all.

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:14 pm: Edit

Lol...SG, RW, RA, Earls and RTE line....lol

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:18 pm: Edit

The spin test is where they catch both ends in an eccentric chuck and spin against each other for so many hours without failure.

By Ron on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:20 pm: Edit

The earls is crap.

Compare the end/threads of an Earls to a paragon performance one. At least with the ones I got the earls had rough finish on the end. The PP ones were completely smooth and the transition from the rounded cone at the top to the threads was smooth. One of the earls one I had was such a pos it had a burr on it that would casue the line to cross thread. POS line cost me 2 hours of my life.

FWIW

Ron

Ron

By John on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:27 pm: Edit

I will look at the vender samples for that, but thats screw machine work in which case they QC every 100 or so pcs then change/adjust tooling as needed, so you can find that randomly anywhere.

By Eric N (Grnrvr) on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 07:09 pm: Edit

Hey, hey, hey, don't be giving me bargin brake lines.. I don't mind paying extra if it means my truck will stop when I put my foot on the brake..

By Bill Bettridge (Billb) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 08:29 am: Edit

John - not sure about the DOT testing, but ALL the hoses have a .030-.040 teflon tube - SS braid is just there to withstand the pressure. There are actually not many manufacturers of the hose itself (can count 'em all on one hand), so my guess is that no matter who is selling the finished brake lines - components all come from the same place.

We make braided teflon hose assemblies every day, but liability is too high for me to want to do brake lines - I won't even make 'em for myself !

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 09:14 am: Edit

"so my guess is that no matter who is selling the finished brake lines - components all come from the same place."
Bill,Exactly my thoughts as I cut them all and all measure/look the same(RW,RA,SG,Earls, my sample), and you dont trust yourself over a stranger? lol
Eric, I want to offer the same product at a better price, now if you cant live with that, I can charge comparable prices for your ease of mind...lol

By Eric N (Grnrvr) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 09:30 am: Edit

John, notice the face at end of my post.. Was just messing with you... As long as they are as good or better then what I already have then I don't care what or how they are made. Only care that they work and will last.. Price, I'm always willing to pay a little extra for high quality.. If I can get it cheaper then great but, if it's higher quality and it cost more then so be it..

By Ron on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 09:33 am: Edit

if it's higher quality and it cost more then
so be it..

Especially with brake lines

Ron

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:04 am: Edit

What I am alluding to is all of the lines are the same quality(generally speaking Ron), its the pricing that varies so greatly from vender sources for similar product that I feel is unfair to you the buyer.I feel the same quality can be offered at a better price helping you the buyer.
Then again maybe I am looking at this wrong.

By Bill Bettridge (Billb) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:08 am: Edit

John - yeah, kinda silly, but thats the truth. I'll make 'em all day long for every nasty chemical known to man, but not for my own brakes Plus, size is AN -3 which is a pain to couple - very easy to make mistakes.

OTOH, if you want lines for anything else made, just ask!

By Kyle on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:12 am: Edit

John is absolutely right here.The grade of line that is used for that aplication is only made at a few places. The only differences being in where the ends came from , who made them and how well it ws all put together. You could actually make them yourself John. The machine is fairly cheap.


Kyle

By Kyle on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:15 am: Edit

The machine I ran had different dies that were put in for hose size Bill. I have done some down to 5/16 and it really wasnt any different then doing them for a 1" hose....
I with I could think of the name on that damn thing....

Kyle

By Ron on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:15 am: Edit

John,

I don't think that statement is entirely accurate.

all earls lines are the same quality (RW, SG, etc.) but the PP ones I have seen are better. Also PP makes two different grades of line so there has to be some difference in quality or construction there.

I am sure it will be fine just ordering RTE earls lines but there is an oppotunity here for a better product at a fair price. Have you talked with PP? Maybe they would let you be a distributor? I dunno.

my 2 cents

Ron

Oh course I could just be bitter at earls as I was pulling shards of steel out of my fingers and had chemical burns from the brake fluid for a couple weeks.

By Kyle on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:38 am: Edit

Weatherhead ? I think that may have been it...

Kyle

By Bill Bettridge (Billb) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:51 am: Edit

Kyle - Domestic TFE hose manufacturers are Dana-Everflex, Teleflex, Titeflex, Aeroquip, and Weatherhead ( Weatherhead - I think - but they might just purchase their TFE hose and resell it - not certain because it is the only line I don't distribute) The swaging presses are made by fewer manufacturers even and they are all rebadged with the hose OEM's name - there are two methods of coupling -swaging and crimping - swage is neater, crimp is easier and faster, but looks crappy. All use different dies for each diameter. And you're right - the presses are not particularly expensive.

As far as coupling goes - the smaller the size, the more a PIA it is - less so if you crimp vs. swage (have done thousands of the bastards )

OK - teflon hose coupling 101 is adjourned.....

BTW - most of the cost of the premade assy's is the DOT certification and 100% testing required on the finished products - the hose and fittings themselves cost very little in the sizes we're talking about here.

By Kyle on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 10:56 am: Edit

WEll there you have it . Why didnt you spit that out in the first place. I havnt done one since 1988 or so But I can remember that there wasnt much to it. Cant be too much to get them DOT or atleast his process , and its not like there is a great deal to that.


Kyle

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 11:09 am: Edit

"Have you talked with PP? Maybe they would let you be a distributor? I dunno."

They nevered answered e mails, faxs or responded to phone calls on the subject of me ordering in bulk from them. So, I dunno either..

By Ron on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 11:13 am: Edit

Well at least you tried John

I have faith in you. You will figure out a good solution.

Cheers
Ron

By Bill Bettridge (Billb) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 11:43 am: Edit

Ron - you piqued my interest in the PP brake hose si I had to check it out.

The hose is made by Teleflex (p/n 60-10997-03) and is DOT approved and is comprised of a TFE tube, 1-braid of Kevlar and 1-braid of 300 series SS - ID is .126" - 1750 psi wp - 7000 psi burst.

Now - just where to find the fittings - John, you got a good screw machine house - I can get you the hose and crimper!

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 11:59 am: Edit

Lol, I could never sell enough fittings to get the cheap screw machine prices, and I have inside use of one I bought for the last place I worked. Front and rear spindles with 7 axis machining, 3000 rpm, $300,000...lol...minimum 10 set up plus tooling cost...I dont think so.

By Heather on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 12:02 pm: Edit

John,,Busy as heck here but wanted to tell ya that I'm gonna try to make as many events as I can,,,

By Bill Bettridge (Billb) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 12:18 pm: Edit

John - LOL - I didn't mean buy one - I meant contract with a screw machine house to make the fittings for you

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 12:52 pm: Edit

Bill, I have that in to a screw machine, but I would have to make 1000's of parts to get pricing.

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 12:55 pm: Edit

LOL,Heather, then you could give Kyle first hand info and pics so he wouldnt have to search the web for ammo...

By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 12:55 pm: Edit

7 axis !!! damn...

rd

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 12:55 pm: Edit

RON, call me....JOHN

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 01:07 pm: Edit

Rob, turn, bore, face,ext. thds and int. thds,roll or machine cut, face cams, any milling work any axis, od cams, holes d&t any angle. Machine front on front spindle, transfer part and machine rear on rear spindle...program all opps on the machine or download from comp, conv feed for fin. parts...sweet, fast and there are 6 spindle machines with same features....but none have auto coffee maker.

By Ron on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 01:07 pm: Edit

John the info you wanted is in your email inbox

Ron

By Rob Davison (Pokerob) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 01:11 pm: Edit

john , thats what the secretary is for

rd

By Johns secretary on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 01:20 pm: Edit

Lol, I am my secretary, although Ron seems to do better than me...at sales as well I might add.

By Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 01:26 pm: Edit

Ron,

Career change!!!

Just like we talked about at MAR....




-L

By Heather on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 02:04 pm: Edit

John,, damn ,, I messed up,, what I meant was non-event cordinated off roading,,,, yes I plan to do as much as that as I can,, with my friends at our pace,,, I tried the event thing once and it wasn't really my thing. Everytime I go out its an event for me,, an adventure infact so pardon the misunderstanding of your question,,,

By John on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 02:19 pm: Edit

. "Everytime I go out its an event for me,,"

Lol, thats the way it should be...and still is for us all...Nothing like a woman who likes to get muddy with the guys.