By Josh on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 10:45 am: Edit

I have been looking around for a long time now!! I wanted to get the ARB but I have heard that its a piece of crap. The SG is a bit expensive for me, but please tell me your opinions and what is the best out there. Thanks a lot!!!

By BigJoeJack on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 11:31 am: Edit

Great question. I'm in the market for a new front bumber also. I've been leaning towards the ARB. I thought ARB made bulletproof stuff???

By Josh on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 11:42 am: Edit

Thats what I heard but I guess at Roverfest two guys had their Arb bumpers twist upward just from tapping it a little. I get really upset thinking about but there seems to be nothing heavy duty for DiscoIIs damn it!!!!!!!

By jay caragay (Jcaragay) on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 11:59 am: Edit

I saw the two bumpers at RoverFest, it was very unassuring to see the ARB's damaged in such a way. Especially on such benign trails.

The SGs are expensive and it seems that everyone complains about them because they always have fitment and Quality Control problems.

I recommend dropping John Bradley Smith at RoverTym Engineering an e-mail asking for D2 bumpers. I think he was working on one. But his bumpers are solid and can take a hit. I know, I hit my RTE bumper a few times this past weekend at the ROVERS trials - no problems, just solid bumpering!

RTE bumpers are in the middle ground between ARB and SG as far as pricing but the quality, workmanship and solid-ness stand above the others.

By Marc on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 12:06 pm: Edit

Guys,
I think the majority of those problems have been with the air-bag model ARB.
-Marc

By Ron on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 12:14 pm: Edit

Hey Jay,

Did Bill B show you the bump off tree turn technique?

Ron

By Bill Bettridge (Billb) on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 02:58 pm: Edit

I even used it several times on Saturday - it's much easier than turning the wheel!

Even found a new variation - bump the RTE slider outrigger against the tree to turn - pretty effective, but hard on trees.......

And yes, I think Jay did learn it because his bumper corners are all covered in sap and tree bark - good job

By Dinged tree on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 03:20 pm: Edit

The old bump and run trick,cool.

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 03:33 pm: Edit

on the air bag model ARB, i still think that if properly installed, it would have done better against the tree.

By Marc on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 03:41 pm: Edit

You think they should weld them, Ho? How bout a non air-bag? I got one coming and want it to be on there as tight as possible.

-Marc

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 03:45 pm: Edit

seems like lots of the airbag bumper owners decide not to use the vertical bolt. and that's what seem to be the problem.

in no way the air bag version will be stronger than the non airbag version because of the crush cans, but your chances of rotating and damaging the body would be less.

marc, as for your bumper... welding would be very solid indeed. hehehe, welding?
go with the force.

By mongo on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 04:28 pm: Edit

Hey Ho, I"m one of the guys from roversfest and I did install it properly. I replaced all the supplied bolts with stainless, and used the vertical bolt, and it gets lose and rotates. My first problem wasn't rotation, it was that the shear plate where the winch mounts, BENT. The second problem I had with it is it rotated into the right side fender. I've tightened the bolts several times, still it gets lose. I even put on nylock nuts and it still moves. I'm going to replace it with something...I'm leaning toward Trekoutfitters, Matt's bumper has much better approach angle than the ARB and John at RTE hasn't completed a bumper for a DII...

Frank

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 04:34 pm: Edit

ahhh!!!

so the crush cans ... crushed??

By mongo on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 04:51 pm: Edit

They didn't crush, they bent...big difference...


Frank

By BigJoeJack on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 05:17 pm: Edit

I just checked out the TREK OUTFITTERS bumper and it looks nice. It seems a bit pricey though. Do you need to beef up the front suspension when adding one of these bumpers? Trek bumper will definently be a top contender!

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 06:08 pm: Edit

damn, piece of shit cans.
crush and bend cans.

By RoverMan on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 06:15 pm: Edit

Is this Just a problem with the air bag model ARB? Would a Non Air Bag model ARB be ok for a DI? Also ....does anyone have any pics of modified ARB ....cut down for clearance or anything? Weighing out ROvertym or ARB(modified)?

By PhotoMan on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 06:28 pm: Edit

http://www.discoweb.org/morton/P5150118.jpg

By Seann on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 07:18 pm: Edit

No matter if properly installed or not, the vertical bolts help the bumper from sagging, but the thing rotates like no other. Hit a tree, and got my car back a month later, lesson to be learned, no more arb bull bars from me.Have a new one, but still looking for other options.

Seann

By Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 07:19 pm: Edit

Ho,

Did you have a bad can day?

By Josh on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 07:56 pm: Edit

Ok, so ARB is out of the question I guess. So RoverTym is good stuff, when is the bumper for DII gonna be completed?

By cartner on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 08:35 pm: Edit

Why not fabricate an extension for the sleeve that fits onto the can from the ARB? Wouldn't a welded sleeve extension A) prevent a bend, B) eliminate the crush cans from bending by extending the rotating force that bent them in the first place further back onto a thicker part of the chassis, and C) cost much less than an entirely new bumper while at the same time retaining the otherwise quality construction of the ARB? I'm not saying weld the bar on, but weld onto the bar an extended sleeve that fits over the crush cans and retain the original bolts, or, replace those bolts with a stronger set, or weld the bar, with the extended parts, onto the chassis....

By Moe on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 09:04 pm: Edit

The ARB is not completely crap. The original design has a different purpose to what is often expected from it here in the US. Properly installed even the air bag bumper can take solid hits to the front and side but is bit vulnerable to being leveraged up on itself—seems like more of a problem for the DII version. I would not buy an air bag version but believe the standard ARB works fine for most people.

I just completed refitting my ARB. I managed to bring it in two inches, raise the RE to a more sensible position, and added a small plate underneath supported by a frame to stop twisting. A little trimming, a little strengthening, and the ARB is bullet proof and has room for a serious winch.

By mongo on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 09:26 pm: Edit

Hey Guys,
If I wanted to rebuild a bumper ,I'd build my own. I'll admit I let price dictate the bumper I bought...won't let that happen again.Also, I've seen several ARB's on DI's and RR and there solid. I'll argue the properly installed...the thing moves even when you change the bolts to something with a tigher tolerence...things a piece of shit...watch out with winch mount...mine bent...


Frank

By LNDRVR99 on Wednesday, November 07, 2001 - 11:51 pm: Edit

Hey everyone. I'm the OTHER guy with Mongo that had an ARB bumper. Again, I have to reiterate that all the available bumpers do quiet well depending on each owner's particular experience and amount of abuse they choose to put it through. The DII ARB air bag version bumper did not fail much at the crush cans but more at the cut out "U" that is cut into the drivers side can to facilitate the placement of a winch allowing the spool to protrude into the cans frame rail on the inside edge. I'm going out to my garage and I am going to take a few pictures of the old damaged cans and find out how to post them in here or have HO or someone do it for me. See you on the trails. Oh, incidentally, TReK outfitters bumper look and seem to go very well as do the RTE bumpers. Form follows function. See you later.

Christian

By Drew on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 12:06 am: Edit

Go with the Rovertyme. Although it is not in production yet it will be worth the wait. From what I have seen with these bumpers they are very tough. They really can take a beating.

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 10:50 am: Edit

christian, if you can, send me some close up pics of the setup via email hochung@discoweb.org .
perhaps that can help lots of better understand this issue.

one thing for sure, ARB bumper alone is a gret product. just that the mounting is sucking big time as you describe in your experience.

By Moe on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 11:07 am: Edit

Ho, you beat me to it.

Frank, you can trot over to Matt and plonk down $1250 (on sale!) for his poor copy of the ARB. If you look at the pics, Trek outfitters still has the same week link: the bumper is bolted onto extended frame rails which can twist. His bumper will need to be 'reworked' if it gets used outside of gravel roads. And that fairlead and recovery points hanging out the front waiting to catch on every root and rock

Given that very Rovertym bumpers have hit the market and been tested over any length of time, I think it is too early to be claiming they are the best since sliced bread (white, that is).

I still think a reworked ARB can be a cheap and sturdy alternative compared to what is currently on the market.

By Ron on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 11:14 am: Edit

I think it is too early to be claiming they (RTE bumpers) are the best since sliced bread (white, that is).

In comparing them to the others available the difference is OBVIOUS when you see one.

Ron

By Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 11:17 am: Edit

I concur with Ron.... Examine one, then examine the others... even without the test of time yet, the superiority is apparent.

I just can't get the wife to sign off on one yet....


-L

By Moe on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 02:33 pm: Edit

Yes apparently even when the $G bumpers hit the market they were touted as the Rodeo Drive of bumpers, which is step above sliced bread. And now they have a reputation of shifting too.

We could elevate RTE bumpers up to precipice where they could take a nice tumble, or we coule let them speak for themselves--and that takes time.

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 02:43 pm: Edit

LOL G ... rodeo drive bumper!!

yes moe, designer bumper i have here.
that makes my day.

By Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 02:48 pm: Edit

Moe,

Have you seen ME? Have you seen RON?

Imagine either of us standing on the bumper 'leaping' up and down....

Of course, there is always the chance that some baffoon might use some wimpy hardware instead of the good stuff, and then they 'tighten' it up to where 'it didn't move anymore' but it really wasn't 'tight', and then they go out drunk at night and run up onto a tree and, well.... you get my point...

The bumper itself, nuh-uh, it won't be at fault....

-L

By Ron on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 02:49 pm: Edit

SG is still pretty good. Just the ends bend up when you wack them (its actually a challenge to make happen)

Compare SG to RTE and see what you see. No way RTE ends are moving unless you REALLY hit something.

By Ron on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 02:52 pm: Edit

Yes,

The RTE passed the Ron "leaping" test without any flexing/movement.

By Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 02:59 pm: Edit

And the Leslie "leaping" test, too....




-L

By Dean Brown (Deanbrown3d) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 03:08 pm: Edit

I gave four a wag-test at robesonia: (Well, 4 including mine)

Standard brush bar - flaps about in wind.
ARB: Moves 1/4 inch when pulled
TREK: Solid, but moves a few mm
RTE: Doesn't move a micron.

The box section of the latter does seem pretty amazing

Dean

By Ron on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 03:14 pm: Edit

I wonder if it would pass the Ron AND Leslie leaping test.

That would be a true test of end flex

Ron

By Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 03:30 pm: Edit

LOL!!!




-L

By Moe on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 06:16 pm: Edit

Leslie, I can imagine either of you leaping up and down, but the full Ron AND Leslie leap test? Please stay clear of my bumper

By mongo on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 07:54 pm: Edit

Moe,
I disagree that the Trek bumper is a cheap version of the ARB. The Trek bumper doesn't compare! Shorter depature angle, higher winch mount...I guess I'm tainted. I can't wait to see what John from RTE comes out with. I have his sliders on my rig and they are awesome...Do a search on this list about the arb and you'll find heaps of info from me about the POS ARB...Ho, I'll be in your necks of the woods in December, I'll be working but I'm game for a beer or two...

Frank

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 08:02 pm: Edit

frank... a beer or two...???
you do the drinking. i'll do the counting.

By Moe on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 08:13 pm: Edit

Ok Frank, so you understand that I'll defend ARB simply because it's on my rig Keep in mind the ARB and I have a similar birthplace. It's a bit like someone born in a trailerpark wanting to defend the $G line.

By mongo on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 08:21 pm: Edit

YO Moe...I spent 3 months in the land down under...but, i wasn't born in a trailer park...does this make any sense...i hope not...Ho, keep countin'....

Frank

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 12:07 am: Edit

so how can a bumper that was born in the trailerpark become rodeo drive status?
damn talk about american dream!!!

LOL

By jay caragay (Jcaragay) on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 11:46 am: Edit

While I agree that the RoverTym bumpers are still relatively new to the LR scene and that time has not passed enough for time's approval, there are still some compelling reasons to seriously review the RTE bumpers as the bumper of choice.

Much has already been said about RTE's solidness of construction. Thick steel and box construction make LR enthusiasts gawk in awe when comparing RTE construction to the construction of the others. Three thick solid bolt frame mounting points round out the rigidity of the RTE bumper.

One of the most compelling reasons to consider the RTE is its' approach clearance. Even the 4" tall bumper sits higher and further back than any other bumper, allowing it greater clearance and a better approach angle.

If you look at the RTE bumper with a winch mounted to it, you will notice that the winch sits INSIDE the front grill, allowing the bumper to sit closer to the body and giving a greater approach angle.

The ARB especially sticks very far out from the body of the Disco (in comparison to the RTE) that reduces the approach angle and clearance. This problem is one that exacerbated Frank and Christian's situation. Just driving through a rather small dip in the trail, the ARB was long enough to get caught up and bottom out on the dip, adding to the damage.

The RTE with it's low height and recessed bumper/winch, allows the vehicle to pass through the same dip without scraping or damage.

Beyond that, the RTE is simply SOLID. This past weekend at the ROVERS Trials in Robesonia, I ended up hitting at least three trees and two of them I hit rather strongly. Some smudged tree sap and a bit of bark were the only markings on the RTE bumper. And it didn't move a bit.

But I do admit that these were harmless trees, no larger than 12 inches in diameter. As time passes, I'm sure more of us will have the opportunity to use the RTE bumper and hit them on harder things than small trees and we can see how they will respond!

By cartner on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 11:57 am: Edit

I think TJM has a bumper for the D2 at 4x4 connection.....It looked pretty solid at the MAR a while ago.

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 05:39 pm: Edit

hey jay, is that a disco2 roof rack you have on the green disco?

By jay caragay (Jcaragay) on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 11:25 am: Edit

Ho-

Yes, that is a D2 Adventure Rack on my green D1.

I picked it up at the impromptu auction at RoverFest.

By Ho Chung (Ho) on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 11:37 am: Edit

cool.

good deal eh?