MANTEC is no more

seventyfive

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2010
4,280
100
over there
Someone needs to call Mercedes and Jeep and let them know that investing the next decade in new boxy utilitarian models is a mistake.

Next-gen G-wagen next to old
Mercedes-G-00.jpg



Next-gen Jeep Wrangler
JP018_043WRfejenssl15sdifb1noir03rrpf-1-626x382.jpg

are you being sarcastic?

g-wagens are g-wagens, still made by puch in austria...which is to say they are still built for their intended purpose. mercedes has a vehicle to fill almost every class, which is to say they do not rely on the g-wagen sales.
not to mention a g-wagen is THE status symbol. when people stop spending $100k without a blink of the eye maybe they may think about a facelift....but that will never happen.

rover has how many models? 4? they need every model to sell.

keep in mind how many 'enthusiasts' will spend $50ish for a defender, unless it has at least power windows?

even my '81 g-wagen had power windows, was air tight, solid as a fucking rock, stupid dependable/reliable, recaro-esque sport seats, rear folding bench, climate control that worked, factory lockers, and i only needed a 3" lift to put 36's under it.
compare that to a 1997 defender.

companies selling more than 3 or 4 models, especially the volume other manufacturers sell, can afford to keep a dependable work truck in the line up.
 

jim-00-4.6

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2005
2,037
6
61
Genesee, CO USA
Jeep has done a great job of making changes along the way with their Wrangler/Rubicon, but keeping it the most capable platform in the US from the factory. It's far from low tech. They also do an excellent job of keeping themselves relevant in the community - participating and sponsoring off-road events around the county.
Another little Jeep item...
Instead of filing lawsuits against website owners for including their copyrighted name in the website name, Jeep doesn't seem to care.
Compare that to Land Rover.
 

jymmiejamz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2004
6,008
361
35
Los Angeles, Ca
Howski;1068410 I'd guess a small portion of this audience could care less if they ever have to use low range (of if their Rover is even fitted with it)[/QUOTE said:
If you bought a new Land Rover would you care if it had low range? I wouldn't. I only engage the low range in my wife's Range Rover whenever I do a service to prevent future issues.
 

Blue

Well-known member
Mar 26, 2004
10,043
856
AZ
Moreover, to Garrett's point: LR is making a killing with their current lineup, i.e. the best the company has ever done.

Enthusiasts aren't even a rounding error in their calculus.

This sums it up very nicely.
 

robertf

Well-known member
Jan 22, 2006
4,781
358
-
Another little Jeep item...
Instead of filing lawsuits against website owners for including their copyrighted name in the website name, Jeep doesn't seem to care.
Compare that to Land Rover.

False. Around 2002ish they had a very similar c&d campaign. Jeep club I was in at the time had to change names. Odd requirements like only using the singular form and not the plural in any material
 

SCSL

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2005
4,144
152
The demise of the Defender is unfortunate, but also somewhat inevitable.

Why inevitable for LR but not for Jeep? LR simply abandoned the US market and handed it over to Jeep when, with a few minor modifications, they could have competed well. Look at the prices of new jeeps and the enduring popularity of the Defender (not just amongst LR enthusiasts).
 

Blue

Well-known member
Mar 26, 2004
10,043
856
AZ
If the Defender had been sold in the US in Disco or RR numbers, I have a feeling that it's popularity wouldn't be nearly as enduring as it currently is. Rather, I think the spade would be called a spade and it would be recognized as an uncomfortable and impractical toy car.
 

1920SF

Well-known member
Jan 6, 2007
2,705
1
NoVA
Why inevitable for LR but not for Jeep? LR simply abandoned the US market and handed it over to Jeep when, with a few minor modifications, they could have competed well. Look at the prices of new jeeps and the enduring popularity of the Defender (not just amongst LR enthusiasts).

Defender numbers never came close to Jeeps in terms of sales-couple that with a lack of desire to meet US safety standards (nevermind MPG standards) and the manufacturing method on the Defender line. That's why I used inevitable.
 

ERover82

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2011
3,899
450
Darien Gap
are you being sarcastic?

companies selling more than 3 or 4 models, especially the volume other manufacturers sell, can afford to keep a dependable work truck in the line up.

Yes

This is why I don't care if they sell barbie cars along with their heritage products.
 

ERover82

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2011
3,899
450
Darien Gap
Lack of investment capital through the dark BL days of the 80s and later ownership changes of the 90s prevented the Defender from being developed enough to compete in the US market. Today, LR is awash in capital to develop the Defender as a competitor to slot between the Jeep and Gwagen markets.
 
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jim-00-4.6

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2005
2,037
6
61
Genesee, CO USA
LR simply abandoned the US market and handed it over to Jeep...
LR abandoned the US market?
Yes, they absolutely did.
Handed it over to Jeep?
Not hardly. The US belonged to Jeep from the get-go.

That's like saying Ferrari handed over the US market to General Motors.

I remember back when i had my first RR, reading that Honda sold more of their minivans in December of some year than LR sold Range Rovers the entire year.
LR has always been a niche market item.

It's a "look at what I have" car, always has been.
Did I love my Rovers? Yes. Yes I did.
Luxury vehicle? Without a doubt.

I always thought it was the little things that made my Rover special;
the rear wiper being synchronized to the front
outside mirrors that tilted down when i put it in reverse
electro-chromic rear-view mirrow
matched-down-the-centerline woodgrain & hide

The reality is many as-offroad-capable SUVs have many of the LR features I thought were "special", and at a fraction of the price.

"But it's not a Land Rover".
You're right. But I'm not a trustafarian, and I didn't choose my grandparents as well as some of you apparently did.

Unfortunately for me, Land Rover is no longer a club where I can afford to be a member.
Maybe the Range Rovers were my mid-life crisis cars.

I need reliable transportation that isn't going to make me worry about which overly-complex system is going to shit the bed.
I assume the newer models are more reliable.
I fucking hope so, jesus.

They're priced out of my range.
Yes, I could afford a 15+ year old used LR.
But LR sucked 15 years ago. Just because I know what the problems are doesn't mean the problem don't exist.

I LOVE the way disco1 & disco2 looked. That's one of the things that drew me to the brand in the first place.
I just couldn't see out the windshield from the driver's seat because of the roof coming down into my line of sight.
My P38 & certainly the L322 had style.
Yeah, Yeah, I know. The P38 sucked compared to the Classic. I get it.
Classic RR. L322. Discos.
Shit, even the LR3 kinda grew on me a little.

Now LR makes products for rappers & NFL players.
I am neither, nor do I particularly care for either group.
They've always been the car of choice for BarbieWives. Still are.

They're Ford Fucking Explorers with a different badge.
Or maybe Chevy Goddamned Trailblazers.
Or Hyundai whateverthefucks.
Or Toyotas, or Hondas.

They're the same.
Rounded, effete, style-over-substance, appearance-not-reality, beta-male mobiles.
Which is perfect for the world today.
 

Blue

Well-known member
Mar 26, 2004
10,043
856
AZ
OK, Mantec raised air intake is installed but one problem remains....

What have people done with this piece of shit air intake hose that runs from the D2 fender inner wall to the airbox? It doesn't get replaced with the Mantec kit.

My air intake hose has completely disintegrated (which led to my water ingestion in the first place) - photo attached. I was thinking of getting a new intake hose in good condition and trying to get a sheet of that shrink wrap stuff and see if I can seal it up. Or just dip it in some of the plasti-dip that you use for tool handles.
 

nickb857

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2004
1,388
3
38
Las Vegas
Mine wasn't quite that bad but it was about to be, as a stop gap fix I got some high quality 3M self sealing electrical tape and wrapped it with a couple layers, then put it back on and added a hose clamp at the top and bottom for security.

Ideally I wanted an oval section of intercooler hose, but I haven't gotten around to finding it yet.
 

Blue

Well-known member
Mar 26, 2004
10,043
856
AZ
I would have to say it is ovoid. Like a rectangle but with rounded corners.
 

Blue

Well-known member
Mar 26, 2004
10,043
856
AZ
OK, I think I have pretty much rectified the shitty Land Rover disintegrating fabric air intake system. Got the salvaged intake hose from Will. It's in pretty good shape but the outside is still starting to crumble. No complaints as it is far better than what I was working with.

I bought some Plasti-Dip from the hardware store and was going to pour it/brush it on. Then I got to thinking of other options.

I found some 4" diameter heat-shrink tubing online and ordered a 10" long section. Listed on Amazon as "Insultab 30-VGA-4000B-P1 Vinylguard Shrink-To-Fit Covering, Polyvinyl Chloride, 4" Diameter, 1" X 12", Black." Not sure what the 1" refers to because it is indeed 4" diameter but my piece was only 10" and not 12". Fuckers. The shitty section of Land Rover air intake fabric tubing is exactly 12" circumference or 3.82" diameter.

I cut out a 6" long section of the heat-shrink tubing, slipped it over the shitty fabric section, and it worked like a champ. I first installed & silicone sealed on the upper portion that clamps to the engine bay inner fender wall. Then I overlapped the heat-shrink tubing over the connection. I heat-shrank it with my wife's hair dryer and it form-fit over the shitty fabric section. You can even see the weave through the heat-shrink. It's really thick stuff too, more plasticky than rubbery. Then I silicone sealed the remaining sections and I think I'm good to go. The only negative is the interior of the shitty fabric tubing will continue to deteriorate and get sucked into the airbox, but the filter will catch it. My old shitty fabric section had crumbled and hundreds of pieces of it were in the airbox.

I also convinced a hose manufacturer to send me a 12" sample of their extruded thru weave nitrile water discharge hose (the lay flat hoses you connect to trash pumps). Haven't received it yet but I'm curious to see it if would work. Would have to be liberal with silicone and then hose clamp it onto the plastic flanges. Some of that layflat hose is pretty flimsy so I'm worried that it would "suck in" and partially collapse.