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Old 07-11-2007, 12:13 AM
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Hey guys, I am planning a transfer case swap of my old BW for an LT230 from my 1996 Disco. The reason for the swap, besides offroad attributes, is that the viscous coupling is toast so I figure it may as well be now. So, anyone do the swap before? Looking for tips and tricks to make this thing go smoother. Thanks
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Old 07-11-2007, 12:35 AM
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Search, I have done it as have many others. You will need the driveshaft, as well as the e-brake assembly and the frame mount for the 230. It is not a crazy swap, but time consuming and easier with a transmission lift.
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Old 07-11-2007, 12:40 AM
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As in transmission jack?
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Old 07-11-2007, 12:44 AM
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yeppers. I swapped mine alone in the garage here, the 230 is a bitch to lift otherwise.
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Old 07-11-2007, 12:50 AM
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http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=320418
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Old 07-11-2007, 02:26 AM
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IMHO trans jack is a must unless you are truly masochistic.

It is a pain to lift the TC and even more painful to hold and position.
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Old 07-12-2007, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambo
Hey guys, I am planning a transfer case swap of my old BW for an LT230 from my 1996 Disco. The reason for the swap, besides offroad attributes, is that the viscous coupling is toast so I figure it may as well be now. So, anyone do the swap before? Looking for tips and tricks to make this thing go smoother. Thanks
If you have access to a hoist you can use a shop engine crane to push the thing up into place - watch out for an annoying 1" lip on the floor that catches the case - best to drop all transmission mounts but first thing is remove the viscous fan or it'll bit the radiator. Cheers Dom
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:39 PM
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On my 95 RRC I removed the fan shroud but didn't remove the fan and I had plenty of clearance when we lowered the trans and tc down - YMMV. It was really helpful having 3 people at this stage as I was able to make sure nothing got pinched or bent, etc. in the engine bay as the other two guys manned the jacks on the Trans and TC and got everything lowered slowly and securely.

I had an adaptor plate (made per RAVE instructions) to fit to the bottom of the LT230 to use with a normal floor jack but the pin was too long and wouldn't fit my jack. If you have 2 people and a good floor jack you can balance it on there and get it up; the hard part is getting the angles right. Just take your time and work carefully.

Leave the CDL engaged so you can rotate the input gears from either output to get the input gears to line up with the trans output shaft (spud).

Definitley have a longer splined spud shaft on hand as you will most likely not have the right one on the RR.

Get both of the spud seals - the one for the Trans out and the one for the TC input. I would also recommend replacing the TC output seals before you do the swap - it's so much easier to replace these when it's off the truck (ask me how I know ) and while you're doing those you can check the condition of the TCase output bearings. Check out the tech section for an article on how to replace the bearings and seals: http://www.discoweb.org/tcasebearing/index.htm

I removed the Neutral lock out solenoid and switch (the switch won't work properly for the RR since it's the reverse of what the RR expects) - I plugged the switch with a bolt, washer and RTV. I had the top-hat-on-a-plate looking lockout solenoid (my LT was also from a 96 D1 so yours should be the same style). I pulled the solenoid out, and if you rotate the cover 90 degrees, then the cutouts for the solenoid wires no longer line up and you still end up with about 2mm of overlapping metal at both spots so no opening to leak/have to plug. Add some RTV and you'll be good to go. Or just fab up a cover from some aluminum.

Since this is a Disco LT going into a RR you will need to splice the 2 wires that would normaly plug into the TC neutral warning switch - I just cut the harness off of the switch from my BW box, soldered and taped those and plugged that to the connector on the wiring harness. I tried and found the relay that turns off the buzzer but there is another relay involved which you can hear clicking if you pull the relay buzzer so I chose to just splice the wires.

You may need some extra bolts - I had one less stud on my donor LT and wasn't able to pull it from the BW - I need to check what size they were - M8 or m10 maybe? I also ended up needing a 4th bolt for the shifter linkage as my BW only used 3 and the LT has 4 - let me go home and go through my left overs and I'll post sizes tomorrow.

There is a tube/rod that connects the TC and Trans on the passenger side - I ended up having to rebend/reshape it after I got the LT on as it was interfering with my GBR DC front drive shaft.

I found the 2 wires for the CDL indicator switch in my wiring harness, plugged them into the CDL indicator switch but no go on the dash light which seems pretty typical for the 95 RRCs.

I also got some advice to apply a bead of RTV around the face of the trans to where it meets the TC, which I did and got some negative feeedback for doing this on Pirate. If you repalce both tf the seals you shouldn't have any leaks. I can't see that the extra seal made by the RTV is a bad thing though.

Last edited by hayzeus; 07-18-2007 at 04:36 PM.
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Old 07-12-2007, 11:09 PM
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OK - so I plugged the Neutral Switch opening with an M-14 bolt and washer (had to cut it down since that big a bolt doesn't come ina short size), sorry but I have no note of the thread count for this monster. I have an extra bolt and washer if you want them.

I also used M8X25 bolts to replace the 2 studs - I used 2" lengths, though it seems like different spots can use longer or shorter so you may want a few sizes on hand.
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Old 07-13-2007, 03:35 AM
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Thanks for all the info. Very helpful. The spud shaft I need will that be on the 96 Disco auto tranny? Can I just take that one out and put it in my RRC? Since you did the swap on a 95 also did you need the longer spud shaft? Thanks
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Old 07-13-2007, 10:07 AM
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If you pull the PTO cover, you can remove the input gear. The makes installation much easier.

A gentleman I worked with last November puts the transfer case on his shoulder and armstrongs it into position. He did the same with the tranny!

I have a tranny jack and the plates as described in the FSM-well worth the time to make one IMO.
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Old 07-13-2007, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambo
Thanks for all the info. Very helpful. The spud shaft I need will that be on the 96 Disco auto tranny? Can I just take that one out and put it in my RRC? Since you did the swap on a 95 also did you need the longer spud shaft? Thanks
Yeah you can use that shaft off the D1.

If your're swapping in a 94-95 D1 Lt230, you dont need the longer splined shaft. But you will need it on the 96 and higher Lt230's (thats when LR started using the improved input gear).
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Old 07-13-2007, 03:53 PM
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Jose, nice details
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Old 07-13-2007, 08:54 PM
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So with the spud shaft can you just pull it out and put the new one it? No tricks to it? Also, I was wondering as I undo the mounts for the tranny and transfer case, I will have jacks in place, these items will just gradually lower themselves? Then I will have access to the upper bolts? Still sounds like a squeeze but nobody mentions that part. Thanks again to everyone who's chimed in here. Except Benlittle
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Old 07-14-2007, 06:28 PM
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X2 on what Sven said.

The spud shaft is easy to pull and swap - there's a philips head in the face of the shaft (the part that faces into the TC) just remove that and the spud slides out. Check that you don't lose the rub oring that goes inside the spud shaft - it keeps the trans oil from seeping through the screw threads.

When we did mine, we removed all of the trans-TC bolts and nuts, and then loosened the trans and TC mounts at the frame, leaving the mounts attached to the TC and Trans. Then we set the jacks, finished removing the screws, and lowered the jacks slowly. You need to lower the engine/trans/tc down until the back of the TC will clear the floor of the body. I actually wasn't on the jacks - I was watching the engine and making sure everything cleared - on a 95 RRC you don't have a lot to worry about - not like a DII with it's ingnition pck at the back of the engine next to the firewall.

The jack on the trans is the one that will set the height and hold the egine and trans while you remove and replace the TC with the second jack.

Once you get the BW off, remove the spud, remove the trans output seal and replace with the new one, and attach the new spud.

Check that the studs on the trans and the LT won't interfere with each other if so remove as appropriate. You're now set to reverse the entire procedure!
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Old 07-14-2007, 06:31 PM
hayzeus
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Originally Posted by Cambo
Also, I was wondering as I undo the mounts for the tranny and transfer case, I will have jacks in place, these items will just gradually lower themselves?
It's a squeeze but you can access all 4 bolts per mount and will need them all off to lower the TC. You will want to control the jacks and to have them touching the TC and Trans and locked before you remove the bolts.

I highly recommend at least one helper - if only for safety. The TC is really tippy. You're also lifting and sliding forward so it helps to have one person holding/balancing the TC while the other mans the jack and moves it up/down and forward/back

Last edited by hayzeus; 07-14-2007 at 06:35 PM.
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Old 07-14-2007, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by benlittle
Jose, nice details
I was planning on doing a write up and posting it but haven't had the time; this may have to be it for now...

Cambo, I'm assuming you're already planning on dropping the Y pipe, and taking the interior apart? Let me know if you have any questions on the interior - there's not much detail in the RAVE for the 95, but it's pretty straighforward.

Have you thought about what you're going to do with the dash (wood piece)? You will have to cut the wood trim around the TC shifter to access the CDL.

One optioon is to get the D1 rubber dash top; it fits right in but you lose the wood look of the RRC.

I got a D1 TC shifter boot from Will and trimmed off the plastic tabs and lip so it could sit flush on top of the wood like the stock boot. I used the same metal clips as the original boot to hold the new one, but I found I had to deepen the slots in the wood where the tabs clipped as the D1 boot was thicker. I also made a new slot for the side I cut out.

I think it was about 1 7/8" that I cut out towards the DS. I trimmed out some towards the front too but you may not have too depending on how your shifter adjusts. In my case I had to lengthen the shifter and it was hitting the front of the opening. I relocated and trimmed the metal spring tab that keeps the wood in place - I cut it in half (the part that sits flush to the wood is pretty long). I also moved the tab over about 2" to the DS and trimmed the wood right up to the edge of the shortened tab.

Remeber to cut the dash with the finished side down so that you don't splinter the finished edge. I used a fine wood blade on my scroll saw set to fine cut and worked really slowly.

Last edited by hayzeus; 07-18-2007 at 02:05 PM.
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Old 07-15-2007, 02:08 AM
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So far I plan to use the DI center console. So hopefully a little easier. The wood look I am not too worried about. I removed most of the trim before on another DI but if it didn't budge I just broke it off. This time I want to save the pieces and the two things I remember having a hard time with were the Ebrake handle and how to get the tranny selector thing off without breaking it. I am sure I will have questions too when I run across those wires to splice into the LT230. Thanks a lot so far it is great info and I have all the seals and think I am gonna take my time and get this thing done right!
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Old 07-15-2007, 04:32 PM
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I know that you want to avoid DII 2001-2003, no CDL nipple. I think there is a quiet version due to the cut of the gears, no idea when that came in though.
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Old 07-18-2007, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Cambo
I remember having a hard time with were the Ebrake handle and how to get the tranny selector thing off without breaking it.
For the Ebrake - pull the skirt up over the handle. There is a clip holding a pin through the handle - slide the clip off, push the pin out and the Ebrake cable will be released from the handle. Be careful about lifting the handle all the way up - if it's at the top and the button is pushed in it will bend the release rod. This might happen as you're pulling the console over the handle.

The TC shifter knob just unscrews off.

The Trans shifter is easy once you know what to do - I couldn't find doc on this so here's what I eventually figured out: pop the cover plate off (thin screwdriver), and use a socket to remove the retaining nut - I used a thin wall deep socket which just barely fit - I think it's a 3/4" socket. Then you rotate the clip 90 degrees towards the open side with needle nose pliers. Once you get the clip rotated, it will slide off and you can then pull the handle off. Be careful about losing the pieces inside - there's the doohicky the clip was holding on, and the shift button and its spring and maybe another piece too.

After you get the console and sound and heat proofing stuff off, use a 3/16" bit to drill out the rivets that hold the shifter to the body (no need to unscrew the shifter upper part from the lower part), disconnect the shifter at the trans (it's a simple pin and clip) and there's a guide block for the shift cable that you will also need to detatch - then you can pull the entire shifter and cable out as one piece, and you won't screw up your trans shifter linkage points or anything like that.

It helps a lot to have the Trans shifter out to adjust the TC linkage. I connected the Trans shifter cable and positioned the shifter in place but didn't connect the guide block so that I could pull it out as I needed to adjust the TC shifter linkage yet still be able to drive around, etc. while I adjusted the TC linkage.

Last edited by hayzeus; 07-18-2007 at 04:32 PM.
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Old 07-18-2007, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnK
I may be doing this conversion in the future and I have a few questions:

Which donor vehicles are the most suitable for transferring a LT230 to a 95 RRC?
What should one look for and/or check when buying a used LT230?
Do some whine more than others? If so, is it from wear, bad bearings or the cut of the gears?
I've read about a cross-drilled input shaft - what is the benefit of it?
I've read that the DI Auto LT230s have 1.2 high and 3.321 low ratios - what are the ratios of the Borg-Warners in the RRCs?

Thanks.
Get a D1 TC 96 and up - it's the simplest fit for the sensors, plugs etc. The D2 TCs don't have the vehicle speed sensor that the 95 RRC needs.

The cross drilled input shaft lubes and cools the input gears better so less wear and tear there.

Last edited by hayzeus; 07-18-2007 at 03:24 PM.
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Old 07-18-2007, 04:20 PM
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IMHO you should look for a Q box. Mid 97 D-90, somewhere in 1998 disco I. Also, a DII front driveshaft (rebuild with greasable U-joints) and T-case flange is nice to add at the same time.
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Old 07-18-2007, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hayzeus
It helps a lot to have the Trans shifter out to adjust the TC linkage. I connected the Trans shifter cable and positioned the shifter in place but didn't connect the guide block so that I could pull it out as I needed to adjust the TC shifter linkage yet still be able to drive around, etc. while I adjusted the TC linkage.
What are you kidding? You didn't just make an access panel like I did?

Access panel was created out of frustration with linkage.

Here's my first write-up.

Here's the second part of the install...dealing with the linkage.

Part three...here's where I begin to be frustrated. Even has pics of said access panel.

There is a bit of Thermarest tech in that thread too.
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Last edited by Michael Slade; 07-18-2007 at 07:57 PM.
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Old 07-18-2007, 08:42 PM
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Mike - that panel is genius! Though I did prefer my method over yours Did you end up building a new console over it or did you leave it visible?

Cambo - Mike's threads were awesome help - great pics to go along with the descriptions of where the different sensors are located, etc. Though he does have the likage mounted on backwards in that mock up pic (sorry Mike couldn't resist ).

Mike has the CDL and the Neutral lockout sensors replaced with bolts in his pics. The sensor behind the CDL shifter is the CDL indicator, the one on the DS back left is the temp sensor, the one on the back by the rear output is the speed sensor - in Mike's case it's for a gear drive speedo, for the 95 RC you'll want a VSS sensor plugged in there; your donor LT will already have that Cambo.

I find it interesting how the Neutral lock out solenoid and indicator switch changes in type and position on the LTs - in Mike's pictures he has the top-hat-style I talked about earlier. Someone else's LT thread here on DWeb recently featured a totally different type and it mounted somewhat differently

Last edited by hayzeus; 07-18-2007 at 08:51 PM.
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Old 07-18-2007, 11:01 PM
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All of the insulation/carpet/etc...went right back into place and I can't even tell the panel is there when it's all buttoned up.

I'm tempted though to take the whole thing back out, re-mock-up the t-case with the linkage in the correct orientation and post those photos again.

I'll be remembered for that, and that only, long after I'm gone.
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