Long term ownership 04D2 (insurance)

msggunny

msggunny

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2007
2,978
3
Holly Ridge, NC
So Im considering keeping my 04 for another decade, or longer. The only major issue I have is how to insure it in order to prevent it from getting totaled out for a fender bender.

Does anyone have an insurance company that uses an agreed upon value? If so what are the pros and cons for it.

The cost of repairing one after an accident, even a slight one, seems like it would be more than what the insurance company would pay out for totaling it out.

Just looking at options.

Thanks,
 
SGaynor

SGaynor

Well-known member
Dec 6, 2006
7,148
162
52
Bristol, TN
Are you looking to have collision coverage for it? or just liability?

I would just say if it gets in an accident and gets "totaled" buy it back as a salvage. That's probably the easiest, most cost effective????
 
KngTgr

KngTgr

Well-known member
May 20, 2005
1,323
14
Fairfax, VA
https://www.lelandwest.com/stated-value-vs-agreed-value-classic-car-insurance.cfm


"Agreed Value vs. Stated Value
If you have an exotic, modified or classic car, and you are nervous about any potential insurance settlement, chances are you have good reason to be concerned. If a classic car is totalled by the insurance company, will you receive a fair value for it? Is there a way to lock in an answer of "Yes"? Fortunately there is.

There are three different bases that an insurance company can use to value an insured auto. Lets first look at the one that almost everyone has on a typical insurance policy:

Actual Cash Value (ACV)
ACV translated means "What its worth in cash, today (just before you crashed it)." After your accident, an insurance company adjustor will go out to the tow yard and look over your vehicle. After that, using sources of their choosing, they will look up what the typical value should be for your car, and this will be their settlement offer. They may adjust this offer if you object and have some evidence to back up your claim. Or they may not. If the disagreement is strong enough you may need to hire either a lawyer or a mediator. Needless to say this is not an ideal position to be in. You buy insurance so you can be taken care of when suffering through a difficult situation. You don't need to be researching classic car values, making angry phone calls, firing off letters and certainly not hiring - and paying for - attornies.

Agreed Value
If ACV is the problem, Agreed Value is the solution. If you have a classic insurance policy - from a dedicated company that only issues this sort of policy - this should be the kind of coverage you have. Instead of the above scenario with ACV, what happens instead is you and the insurance company agree on the vehicle value when you sign up - before the policy is issued and any money changes hands. In the event of a disaster, the insurance company guarantees to pay the value that the two of you agree upon before shaking hands. No ifs, ands or buts.

We said this "should" be the kind of coverage you have. You might not. To find out for sure, look in the physical damage section of your policy. Somewhere in there it will say what is going to happen if your classic car is a total loss. The exact statement should be very close to this:


You might see the term 'Guaranteed Value' in your insurance travels. What is that? 'Guaranteed Value' is just a marketing-savvy way of saying 'Agreed Value'. The two are the same.

However, its the actual language in the policy contract that spells out what and how you get paid; not an ad headline.

So have your agent show you where in the policy language your value is either Agreed upon or Guaranteed.

If they can't... it isn't.

In the event of theft or a total loss we will pay the Agreed Value.
Thats it. Short and sweet. No wiggle room. No more words. Agreed Value is a simple idea and if the coverage is what it claims to be it should be written up simply in the policy.

So thats the good news. An Agreed Value guarantees you will get the protection you paid for. We're done, right? Sadly no. We have to cover one more valuation basis. This is the one that spells trouble for the consumer. It masquerades as Agreed Value but it most certainly is not.

Stated Value
Your typical Big Auto Insurance Company sells policies that pay out on an ACV basis. We covered that above. Those same Big Auto Insurance Companies have customers with collectible autos who want something better. Unfortunately, Big Auto Insurance Companies are typically not set up to handle this sort of thing properly (for reasons too complex to go into here). What winds up happening is consumers often get offered a Stated Value by the typical Big Auto Insurance Company.

Remember the short/sweet payout clause for an Agreed Value? This is what Stated Value says about a total loss:

"In the event of theft or a total loss we will pay the Stated Value
or the Actual Cash Value, whichever is less."
Yikes. Stated Value has an escape clause that lets the insurance company fall back to ACV... and its the default action, to boot. Chances are thats not what you had in mind when you paid extra for the Stated Value endorsement.

So is Stated Value designed to rip people off? No. It can be a good thing in some narrow circumstances... the kind that likely will never do you any good.

Stated Value exists to decide how much premium you pay. Not how much you get paid.
Stated Value lets you insure the car for less than what its really worth in exchange for a lower premium.
Clear as mud so far? Thats understandable. This is something that even professionals who do this for a living get wrong fairly often. Lets give an example that should explain how its supposed to work (for simplicity's sake we will ignore the concept of 'co-insurance' in this example):

You inherit a classic Ferrari from a relative, who bought it new many years ago and never really drove it. Its a masterpiece that is now worth 1 million dollars. It falls to you to insure this classic car, and you have a problem: The insurance for a $1,000,000 classic masterpiece is more than you are willing to pay. The price is livable down around $300,000. So you take out a Stated Value policy for $300,000 on the car. After all, you won't be out of pocket $1 million if the car is stolen, but you certainly want all the protection you can afford.

Now the Stated Value payout clause makes perfect sense. And its completely fair and reasonable. This is Stated Value done right, and its almost never going to be what you want or need. In fact, if you want to limit your recovery and manage your premiums, an Agreed Value policy for a lesser value will do the same thing, except the value you receive is guaranteed.

If you want to guarantee yourself the value you expect on your classic car, refuse to settle for anything less than an Agreed Value on a classic insurance policy."
 
squirt

squirt

Well-known member
Nov 13, 2008
824
13
Los Angeles
Is the concern that you'd want to make sure your car gets fixed, or that you'll get your perceived value out of the car?

If you have a special attachment to this car in particular, then the agreed value is the right path. Not sure how it would work out if someone else hit you and your insurance would have to fight against theirs wanting to total it.

If this isn't the case, I'd just carry liability and set aside money to buy another one if this one gets totaled. In my case, I've got more money in bumpers, armor, tires, lockers, etc than the truck is actually worth. If I ever roll it offroad or get into a serious accident, I'm just going to scrap it and transfer the important bits to the next one. They're practically disposable at this point.
 
Blueboy

Blueboy

Well-known member
Apr 20, 2004
3,212
462
Back in the USA; Rockwood, PA
And the policies usually stipulate:

-Your antique or classic car must be used on a very limited basis, such as exhibitions, club activities, and parades or similar events.

Same as getting an Antique or Classic plate at least here in PA.

While I don't drive the Rangie too often, I drive it on camping trips, etc.

I'm looking as well.
 
Roverlady

Roverlady

Well-known member
Apr 20, 2004
7,825
0
45
Shenandoah valley
We just carry liability on the older trucks. They are worth so little based on property tax, etc. If it gets wrecked I'll buy it with the cash I save not paying full coverage every month to fix, depending on the severity.

I've had my DI for 15.5 years and we've had the RRC for 13. :)

EDIT: neither are daily drivers anymore
 
msggunny

msggunny

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2007
2,978
3
Holly Ridge, NC
squirt said:
Is the concern that you'd want to make sure your car gets fixed, or that you'll get your perceived value out of the car?.
Click to expand...

That it will get fixed. I think the hard question is "do i want to put more money into it that its worth"

Right now, yes. Even considering a LS conversion down the line if the 4.6 ever gives up the ghost.
 
squirt

squirt

Well-known member
Nov 13, 2008
824
13
Los Angeles
msggunny said:
That it will get fixed. I think the hard question is "do i want to put more money into it that its worth"

Right now, yes. Even considering a LS conversion down the line if the 4.6 ever gives up the ghost.
Click to expand...


I get it. I think that most of us on this board probably have spent more money on our trucks than they're worth.

In my case, though, I don't have any particular attachment to the truck itself. For me it's more of a carrier for the off-road bits that make it fun.
 
SGaynor

SGaynor

Well-known member
Dec 6, 2006
7,148
162
52
Bristol, TN
msggunny said:
That it will get fixed. I think the hard question is "do i want to put more money into it that its worth"

Right now, yes. Even considering a LS conversion down the line if the 4.6 ever gives up the ghost.
Click to expand...

I've thrown in the the towel on mine - rust ate a 3" hole in the drivers floor board by the door sill, and the rear frame is flaking badly. I told the daughter that she's driving it until it dies, but I'm not doing any more major work on it.

Next Rover will likely be a series, but it'll have to wait a few years till the kids get out of college and my cash flow situation improves.:(
 
Blueboy

Blueboy

Well-known member
Apr 20, 2004
3,212
462
Back in the USA; Rockwood, PA
So I contacted Grundy as they offer a mutiple vehicle deal however 1 vehicle has to be a "collector" vehicle.

Asked if a refurbished '94 LWB would qualify and the response was no.

Oh well.
 
kennith

kennith

Well-known member
Apr 22, 2004
10,891
172
North Carolina
msggunny said:
So Im considering keeping my 04 for another decade, or longer. The only major issue I have is how to insure it in order to prevent it from getting totaled out for a fender bender.

Does anyone have an insurance company that uses an agreed upon value? If so what are the pros and cons for it.

The cost of repairing one after an accident, even a slight one, seems like it would be more than what the insurance company would pay out for totaling it out.

Just looking at options.

Thanks,
Click to expand...

If that's your ZIP code up there under your avatar, I highly doubt anyone is going to provide this type of insurance. Most I've used in the past won't cover anything within a specified distance from salt water.

Might be different for active military, as companies know you don't always have a choice of location, but I never tried it when I was in.

Cheers,

Kennith
 
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