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  #51  
Old 05-14-2018, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by brian4d View Post
It's not a random price Scott. You're telling me Merck negotiates with Smith Pharmacy on Main street? You're in LA LA Land.

Here we go. Know what MSRP is? List Price?

What is the difference between pricing and reimbursement?
Pricing and reimbursement are entangled to some extent. Drugs may ultimately have several different prices, but the first one is the list price, which comes from the manufacturer. The list price is not necessarily the price that most people pay. In some cases, hardly anyone pays it. But the list price serves as the basis for many subsequent calculations.

So you're wrong yet again. There is a set list price for drugs.
No, there is not. Try reading. It's fundamental. Oh, and that link is from Express Scripts - the largest pharmacy middleman in America, so they know a thing or two about drug pricing.:
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Originally Posted by SGaynor View Post
What factors contribute to pharmacy retail medication prices?
Key factors contributing to the retail price of prescription medications include
pharmacies? business (overhead) costs, profit margins, and costs to obtain
prescription drugs from manufacturers or wholesalers.


What is the true cost of a medication to the pharmacy?
The actual acquisition cost for a drug can be difficult to pin down, since it may
depend on discounts granted on a quarterly basis only after the drug purchase
agreement takes place. The actual acquisition cost remains a closely guarded
secret. Only the person signing the purchasing contract for the pharmacy and
the seller of the medication are informed.
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  #52  
Old 05-14-2018, 03:35 PM
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Wow, ok Scott. Pharmacutical companies don’t set a list price for their drugs. FYI, they do!

Damn dude, research a bit more. And acquisition cost and list cost are two different things. My point list prices will be in commercials! You’re so right you’re wrong. Lol

Where do you think they get the list price? The first paragraph of what you just posted. Overhead, r and d and so on. Wow is all I can say. You just cannot be wrong.

How about Mr. Shkreli? Did he negotiate $750 per pill? Lol. It’s ok though we will go with pharma doesn’t set their prices for their own product.
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  #53  
Old 05-14-2018, 04:44 PM
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Your guide to the Trump drug price plan: who it affects and how

Pharma and biotech left mostly unscathed
The biggest way the “American Patients First” plan could affect drugmakers of all sizes is, of course, by lowering drug prices.

And yet, “we do not expect the items discussed to have a meaningful impact on pharma net prices if enacted,” said J.P. Morgan analyst Chris Schott, who even went so far as to say investors should revisit the sector because “pricing overhang” is mostly gone now.

Wall Street has the same consensus for biotech, with J.P. Morgan analyst Cory Kasimov predicting “pretty benign overall” results.

‘All clear’ for drug middlemen
If you listened to Trump speak about middlemen in the U.S. drug supply chain on Friday, you’d think they were all goners.

Yet despite those critical words, for now the outlook is “all clear” for these players, said RBC Capital Markets analyst George Hill, since “actual content was limited” in the Trump drug pricing plan.

Middlemen in the U.S. drug supply chain include pharmacy-benefit managers, which negotiate drug prices, distributors, which, as one might guess, distribute pharmaceuticals, and the pharmacies that sell medications to patients.

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  #54  
Old 05-14-2018, 04:50 PM
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Originally Posted by brian4d View Post
My point list prices will be in commercials!
Tell me how putting a dollar figure on an add is going to cause drug prices to come down? How does that work?

McDonalds has a Dollar Menu. Does that mean the price of a cheeseburger is going to be $0.75 six months from now?
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  #55  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by SGaynor View Post
Tell me how putting a dollar figure on an add is going to cause drug prices to come down? How does that work?

McDonalds has a Dollar Menu. Does that mean the price of a cheeseburger is going to be $0.75 six months from now?
You complain to hear yourself complain.
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  #56  
Old 05-15-2018, 01:27 PM
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LOL...I see SGaynor still has all the answers from his perch at his keyboard.
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  #57  
Old 05-15-2018, 01:42 PM
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Scott, Can you spot price gouging? Does it make you happy? Do you shop elsewhere? I’m with Dan and blue, you’re hopeless.
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  #58  
Old 05-15-2018, 04:26 PM
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LOL...I see SGaynor still has all the answers from his perch at his keyboard.
I'm not the one saying simply putting prices on ads will help lower drug prices. I haven't given an answer, simply asked for an answer to "How does that work?"

Considering all that has been responded is snark, I'll take that to mean A) it won't, and B) you don't have a clue as to what will, other than believing in the hope and change offered from Cheeto in Charge.
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  #59  
Old 05-15-2018, 04:51 PM
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I haven't bothered reading any content in this thread, or in this section of the forum. I just see that you are still a constant presence and you still always seem to be bitching...aka having all the answers.

Now, I did read your response here...and all I have to say is that I don't have any need or desire for "hope and change" or any of that bullshit. I just want my elected officials to go get some shit done. For once, getting shit done seems to actually be the result of voting for someone.
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  #60  
Old 05-15-2018, 05:50 PM
brian4d brian4d is offline
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Originally Posted by SGaynor View Post
I'm not the one saying simply putting prices on ads will help lower drug prices. I haven't given an answer, simply asked for an answer to "How does that work?"

Considering all that has been responded is snark, I'll take that to mean A) it won't, and B) you don't have a clue as to what will, other than believing in the hope and change offered from Cheeto in Charge.
It will be more effective than surgeon general warnings on cigs. I can't help you don't understand basic marketing positive / negative effects associated with branding, pricing, placement and competition. Go back to school. I'm breaking it down in the most simplest of simple terms. The American populace don't like to be gouged, but they love some Wal-Mart. They post that price in their ads it will actually have a negative impact on their branding. Should I go on about what happens next, or, getting the picture? Yes Scott, there is extremely heated competition between most medication. That's what all the ads on tv mean, get it? Sinking in? Your not in Marketing are you? Lol. The question everyone needs to be asking is, "Are they going to Stop the commercials, or, lower the price of the drug."
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Brian was right!

Last edited by brian4d; 05-15-2018 at 06:32 PM.
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  #61  
Old 05-15-2018, 05:55 PM
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I just want my elected officials to go get some shit done. For once, getting shit done seems to actually be the result of voting for someone.
Very well put. What are the donkeys running on?? Hating trump? Now that's just not going to work, not now, not with Romney, not ever. Funny leedle Democrats.
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  #62  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:29 PM
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It will be more effective than surgeon general warnings on cigs. I can't help you don't understand basic marketing positive / negative effects associated with branding, pricing, placement and competition. Go back to school. I'm breaking it down in the most simplest of simple terms. The American populace don't like to be gouged, but they love some Wal-Mart. They post that price in their ads it will actually have a negative impact on their branding. Should I go on about what happens next, or, getting the picture? Yes Scott, there is extremely heated competition between most medication. That's what all the ads on tv mean, get it? Sinking in? Your not in Marketing are you? Lol. The question everyone needs to be asking is, "Are they going to Stop the commercials, or, lower the price of the drug."
So that's why the Hep C drug costs $100k? Or the 60 year old drug in the 60 Minutes piece went from $40 to $40k? Or epi pens went from $50 to $600?

You're right...it was the lack of the four Ps.

You sound like the guys who are freshly minted from B-school talking all about the 4 Ps, market research , yada, yada yada...but who've never launched a product or had to break into new markets. A complete and utter lack of understanding how the real world works
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Dangerous time when our country is led by those who will lie about anything, backed by those who will believe anything, based on information from media sources that will say anything. Americans must break out of that bubble and seek truth.
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  #63  
Old 05-15-2018, 10:40 PM
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And you know what? I'm being a bitch for popping in and giving you shit. A thousand apologies!
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  #64  
Old 05-16-2018, 08:52 AM
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So that's why the Hep C drug costs $100k? Or the 60 year old drug in the 60 Minutes piece went from $40 to $40k? Or epi pens went from $50 to $600?

You're right...it was the lack of the four Ps.

You sound like the guys who are freshly minted from B-school talking all about the 4 Ps, market research , yada, yada yada...but who've never launched a product or had to break into new markets. A complete and utter lack of understanding how the real world works
You're outta your league Mr. Wizard.

Hopeless!

US NEWS, read the part on insulin prices. Who's raising the price Scott?

https://www.usnews.com/opinion/polic...ng-drug-prices


Consider insulin, critical to more than 6 million Americans with Type 1 diabetes. Between 2002 and 2013, drug makers Sanofi, Novo Nordisk and Eli Lilly (under Azar's leadership) raised prices in lockstep. Their insulin more than tripled in price to as much as $300 per patient, per month. Closed-door negotiations between drug makers, insurance companies and middlemen pharmacy benefit managers, which came to light earlier this year, contributed to these outsize price increases.

When list prices rise, many with health insurance still see their out-of-pocket costs go up. Increasingly high patient co-payments, which require them to pay a portion of their drug costs, are based on whether the drugs are generic, preferred branded, other branded or specialty. The result: costs of some commonly prescribed drugs have become unaffordable for many patients.


And what do you mean 'you guys'? Blue hasn't mentioned the first word about Marketing in this conversation. Admit it, you're just butt hurt because your wrong.
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Last edited by brian4d; 05-16-2018 at 09:29 AM.
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  #65  
Old 05-16-2018, 01:12 PM
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US NEWS, read the part on insulin prices. Who's raising the price Scott?

https://www.usnews.com/opinion/polic...ng-drug-prices
From the article:
Earlier this year, the federal government brought suit against Lilly, Sanofi and Novo Nordisk, alleging the insulin manufacturers conspired to raise prices, allegations the three deny.

Whether there is price-fixing or not, it is clear throughout the healthcare industry and to outside observers that drug makers are avoiding generic competition through a number of ways, introducing new drugs at unreasonable prices, and marking up existing drugs without apparent justification. The result for pharmaceutical companies: record profits. The result for the American people: risking more serious illness, complications and even death by forgoing treatment. Whether through legislation, regulation, or the courts ? and likely through a combination of all three ? this must change.


So the drug makers were illegally price fixing, or maybe not - see how US airlines move prices in lock step with each other and they are considered "legal."

So, I'm still not sure how how you get to putting up prices on ads will reduce drug prices.

That said...

It's almost comical though that you cite an article (supporting your position?) that says nothing about just posting prices, but offers this as one way to combat high prices:

A major problem is that ? unlike in most industrialized countries ? the U.S. government has no ability to negotiate drug prices with pharmaceutical companies. The FDA is tasked with approving medicines based on safety and efficacy, but cannot consider cost or value in its approval process. Medicare ? which insures Americans 65 and older, the group with the most prescription medications per individual ? was forbidden to negotiate prices starting in 2003 as part of government's compromise with the pharmaceutical industry to get the Medicare drug expansion plan passed. That essentially leaves consumers unprotected, giving big pharma patent monopolies on drugs critical to patients' lives and health, allowing them to charge whatever they want to Medicare.

That sounds vaguely familiar:
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Clearly, you have no idea how drug pricing works. There is no single price - it's always negotiated. How about letting the markets work - that would be a good start - as in letting Medicaid negotiate prices.

So the one thing pretty much everyone agrees with - Trump ignored.
Just post the prices.
And further, from your article, it highlights that the guy Trump put in charge of the Dept of Health and Human Services (Alex Azar) is the guy who was in charge of Eli Lilly when they appear to colluded to increase insulin prices.

DRAIN THE SWAMP! MAGA! SO MUCH WINNING!

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Consider insulin, critical to more than 6 million Americans with Type 1 diabetes. Between 2002 and 2013, drug makers Sanofi, Novo Nordisk and Eli Lilly (under Azar's leadership) raised prices in lockstep. Their insulin more than tripled in price to as much as $300 per patient, per month.
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  #66  
Old 05-16-2018, 01:25 PM
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So, I'm still not sure
You're a hoot. This says it all. You're a typical keyboard commando. Retaliate real world logic with news articles you find on the internet. You just can't help yourself. You think any of these writers have real what it takes to succeed in the real world? You must because you sure trust them a lot. You still can't admit there is an inflated list price that drug companies set long before negotiations begin with pharmacy's.

As for Azar, who better to have in that position than someone that knows first hand about rising drug prices? Why/what/when and where.
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  #67  
Old 05-16-2018, 01:37 PM
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You're a hoot. This says it all. You're a typical keyboard commando. Retaliate real world logic with news articles you find on the internet. You just can't help yourself. You think any of these writers have real what it takes to succeed in the real world? You must because you sure trust them a lot. You still can't admit there is an inflated list price that drug companies set long before negotiations begin with pharmacy's.

So the article I quoted from - which YOU CITED - is now not valid because...why? Maybe because you cited an article that said exactly the opposite of what you were trying to prove.

Really Brian - you need to try harder. Or at least read what you post before telling me I'm wrong when I quote the same position as an article that you post supporting your position. Well, maybe that's why you don't post many supporting facts - they all go against what you are saying.



Of course there is an "inflated list price" but that still affects overall drug prices.

You said so. In the article you cited. Or is that article bullshit now?

So, again, tell me how knowing what the inflated "list price," which still results in higher drug prices, is going to reduce prices?

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As for Azar, who better to have in that position than someone that knows first hand about rising drug prices? Why/what/when and where.
Maybe we should put El Chapo in charge of the DEA then?
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Dangerous time when our country is led by those who will lie about anything, backed by those who will believe anything, based on information from media sources that will say anything. Americans must break out of that bubble and seek truth.
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  #68  
Old 05-16-2018, 02:04 PM
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There is a single price Scott. Take insurance out of the picture. You have a prescription and go to the pharmacy and buy what you need. You pay full market price. There's your single price Scott. Jaw dropping as well I might add.
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Wrong. Because a) You don't buy drugs directly from the manufacturer, b) there may be different drugs (generics, name brands that treat the same disease) made by different manufacturers and c) CVS, Wal-mart, Walgreens, etc. each negotiate for their own prices as well.

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Of course there is an "inflated list price" but that still affects overall drug prices.
Hmmmm what have we here?

Yes it does depending on the pharmacy you purchase the drug. Mom and Pops Drug store on the corner pays the List Price Scott. Bingo was his Name-o? Can you even accept defeat when your own words are used against you?

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