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  #3401  
Old 07-18-2017, 05:30 PM
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You can thank Trump for your gun rights.
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  #3402  
Old 07-18-2017, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by D Chapman View Post
Man, you're lost in 2010. HSA's and HDHP's were the new norm. No longer. They cost too much. If someone can't afford $12,000 a year for insurance with a low(er) deductible, what makes you think they can pay the $13,100 maximum out of pocket a year deductible on top of the HDHP premium? The HDHP plans were great for single, young people with no health issues. Now it's cheaper to buy a low(er) deductible plan. The difference is the more affordable lower deductible plans now under the ACA offers less coverage, and is for sale at a higher premium that what a HDHP plan cost just 3/4 years ago.

FSA's are the best bang for the buck now.
How is an FSA the best bang for your buck? If you don't spend it in the fiscal year, you lose it. HSA allows you to carry it over forever, and take it with you if you leave your company. FSA's are from 2000. Again, get your facts straight.

Hate to break this to you, but insurance costs average about $10K per plan (family). It doesn't matter if it's paid for by your company or 100% by you. Someone is paying for it.

Here, I put this up on this thread months ago. Please show me data that says differently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SGaynor View Post
It's called the cost of insurance/health care.

Most companies, their cost to insure a worker is in the range of $10-12K. And that is with a $3000 deductible (family, high deductible plan).

If anyone thinks that health insurance (should) only costs $2000/year and covers everything with a tiny co-pay, they are sadly mistaken.

Data on Health care costs:

U.S. health care spending grew 5.8 percent in 2015, reaching $3.2 trillion or $9,990 per person. As a share of the nation's Gross Domestic Product, health spending accounted for 17.8 percent.


And no amount of posturing by Democrats or Republicans is going to change that math. There isn't some magic plan that will suddenly reduce health care costs by 80% ($10k to $2k).
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Originally Posted by SGaynor View Post
Not sure what you are talking about. HSAs have been growing rapidly; FSAs have been around longer.

http://www.benefitspro.com/2016/07/1...-trends-in-hra

And from: http://www.benefitspro.com/2016/10/1...uable-employee

Among the 2,500 companies surveyed by benefits consultant Mercer in 2015, 59 percent said that they offer an HDHP, up from 48 percent in 2014. By 2018, it is projected that three-quarters of companies will offer HDHPs. According to the Kaiser Family Foundation, four percent of employees in 2006 were enrolled in employer-sponsored high-deductible plans; however, that number shot up to a quarter of employees in 2015. In addition, nearly 50 percent of millennials are jumping on the bandwagon, opting for lower-cost health plans with deductibles. Despite some initial negative perceptions of high deductible plans, when paired with an HSA, these plans offer employees arguably the most valuable benefit for health care (and retirement) savings. The reduced premiums, flexibility, and long-term savings benefits are definitely an upside to HDHPs.

For employers, HDHPs translate to real savings. Last year?s Mercer National Survey of Employer-Sponsored Health Plans showed that the medical cost per employee enrolled in a HDHP associated with an HSA averages $9,228, compared to $11,248 for HMOs and $11,212 for PPOs. That equals a substantial savings of about 18 percent. Importantly, if the employee sets aside $2,000 into an HSA, they are prepared for the potential of needing to cover deductible out-of-pocket costs. And, if they are healthy and don?t need this money for health care right away, these savings will accumulate for future health care costs.


Sounds like lots of growth in the HDHP/HSA space. And see the highlight. I'd say that's "nearly all."

Not a decline.
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  #3403  
Old 07-18-2017, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by D Chapman View Post
You can thank Trump for your gun rights.
Yeah..... that's who's keeping our gun rights safe.....What fake news did you get that little nugget of bull shit from?
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  #3404  
Old 07-18-2017, 06:00 PM
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HSA's have been growing since 2005. And average premiums are ~$1000/mo

https://www.ahip.org/wp-content/uplo...ft_2.14.17.pdf

They aren't dying.

Oh, and by the way, the latest GOP plan that just died? It had provisions to allow for an increase (doubling?) in annual contributions to HSAs.
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  #3405  
Old 07-18-2017, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkytoe69 View Post
You can add the mgreenspan twist to that too...

Should he not receive any care at all cause he got hurt voluntarily using one of the most unsafe forms of transportation in existence?
That's not my twist. Like I said, that should fall under a completely different program but not insurance. The "insurance" market got messed up by the Affordable Care Act. It was designed to fail. It is not affordable. The only problem is that Donald Trump won and Republicans maintained power. Nobody can suggest single payer as the solution to the failed ACA.

The car analogy does work. It's insurance. Yes it sucks that it's a human being. It's messed up that people don't prioritize. How many uninsured have cell phones and make payments on nice automobiles? I know not all do. There are some people without insurance who are actually trying. There are others that just don't prioritize because they don't think about it until they are actually sick.

Dealing with random accidents for uninsured should be something completely different. Dealing with random extreme health issues that a person can't afford should be dealt with the same. A different pot of money for unfortunate people. It is not and cannot be "insurance" if it's after the fact.

in?sur?ance
noun
noun: insurance; plural noun: insurances
1. a practice or arrangement by which a company or government agency provides a guarantee of compensation for specified loss, damage, illness, or death in return for payment of a premium.
2. a thing providing protection against a possible eventuality.

So what we are really arguing is what type of program should be in place of providing health coverage for people that can't afford it. In other words a handout that is not disguised as anything else. It is only provided to some and footed by everybody else. There is an obvious reason that this had to be disguised.
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  #3406  
Old 07-18-2017, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by D Chapman View Post
You can thank Trump for your gun rights.
What gun right do I have now?
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  #3407  
Old 07-18-2017, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by mgreenspan View Post
That's not my twist.
I was referring only to the end:

Also if you really want it to be considered a right then you better believe you should not be allowed to be fat, do drugs, drink alcohol, play sports, participate in hazardous activities, go to loud rock concerts, work near machinery without double hearing protection, ski, have unprotected sex, etc.
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  #3408  
Old 07-18-2017, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by ERover82 View Post
What gun right do I have now?
Well......there's the......you know....the thing he said about......you know....that pat where he.....you know promised he'd......you know....then you've got your.....you know.... that thing where....you know... you can..... fuck you! It's Obama's fault!
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  #3409  
Old 07-18-2017, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by SGaynor View Post
How is an FSA the best bang for your buck? If you don't spend it in the fiscal year, you lose it. HSA allows you to carry it over forever, and take it with you if you leave your company. FSA's are from 2000. Again, get your facts straight.

Hate to break this to you, but insurance costs average about $10K per plan (family). It doesn't matter if it's paid for by your company or 100% by you. Someone is paying for it.

Here, I put this up on this thread months ago. Please show me data that says differently.
The benefits of an FSA outweigh the HSA today. I had an HSA for many years. It worked really well for me. But then the prices of the HDHP's started to climb. The main benefit of having a HDHP was the price - it was much less than a low(er) deductible plan. That is no longer the case, at least not in Virginia. Perhaps your state has not caught up as insurance rates vary state-to-state. But it's coming if it has not already done so. Two years ago the HDHP climbed 30% in one year.

Secondary to that, funds sent to your FSA are pre-tax, like the HSA. I still get to lower my tax liability which is a great help come April 15th. You're correct, you use it or lose it. There are ways to carry over a few Hundred bucks, but yes, use it or lose it. Not a big deal. I contribute the max, which is something like $2,550 a year. Routine dental expenses for my wife and I eat up about $900 a year if we each get x-rays that year. Eye glasses cost about $400 and I seem to go though glasses about once every-other-year, as does she. So it does not take long at all to burn up $1,500 in any given year on basic medical related expenses. At the end of the year, you burn the rest of the money you can't carry over. The FSA store is a great place to stock up on random shit. Or, unlike an HSA, I can have non-elective or cosmetic procedures, all pre-tax. To some that may seem like a waste, but I rather have these items rather than the government taking my money. Not to mention BB&T no longer taking $7.00 a month from me for HSA maintenance fees.

Quote:
HSA's have been growing since 2005. And average premiums are ~$1000/mo

https://www.ahip.org/wp-content/uplo...ft_2.14.17.pdf

They aren't dying.
So which is it, $1,000 a month or $10,000 a year? Those are two different numbers. I'm currently on a Gold Plan with a $2,500 deductible. $1,200 a month for a family plan. I suspect that will go up, again, come re-enrollment time. The HDHP I was on was going to be about $35 a month less. It's a no-brainer which plan to go with. For years employers pushed the HDHP because they were cheaper. Now not so much. The trend is changing. I remember reading something that said HDHP were only up 3% last year or the year before. Years prior it was double digits. People are catching on.

If your HDHP if working for you, cool. Keep it. I just have a feeling you will not have it much longer due to the price to keep it.
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  #3410  
Old 07-18-2017, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by emmodg View Post
Yeah..... that's who's keeping our gun rights safe.....What fake news did you get that little nugget of bull shit from?
Here you go, JB. Read up.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distri...mbia_v._Heller

That was a 5-4 vote. In case you're not paying attention that's 1 vote shy of stripping your individual right to keep and bear arms for self-defense.

Who did Obama put up for the Scalia? Merrick Garland? What's Merrick Garland's view on guns? Want to take a guess? So what happens if Merrick Garland were seated as a Justice of the Supreme Court and the Heller case was recalled? Thankfully we'll never know.

But yeah, fake.
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  #3411  
Old 07-18-2017, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by ERover82 View Post
What gun right do I have now?
You're black. Black people should not have guns.
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  #3412  
Old 07-18-2017, 10:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D Chapman View Post
Here you go, JB. Read up.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distri...mbia_v._Heller

That was a 5-4 vote. In case you're not paying attention that's 1 vote shy of stripping your individual right to keep and bear arms for self-defense.

Who did Obama put up for the Scalia? Merrick Garland? What's Merrick Garland's view on guns? Want to take a guess? So what happens if Merrick Garland were seated as a Justice of the Supreme Court and the Heller case was recalled? Thankfully we'll never know.

But yeah, fake.
So that was decided when Obama was in office?? Thanks Obama!
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  #3413  
Old 07-18-2017, 10:16 PM
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You guys have prob. spent more time debating insurance plans than our House and Senate combined. Congrats. And you want these people designing your next plan that fails?

The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Ronald Reagan
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  #3414  
Old 07-18-2017, 10:28 PM
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So that was decided when Obama was in office?? Thanks Obama!
Please tell me you're joking.
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  #3415  
Old 07-18-2017, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by brian4d View Post
Please tell me you're joking.
Obama's 2006 inauguration was the biggest of all time. Read it online.
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Stu454: You'd have to be a barb-wire-shitting, full-fledged bad motherfucker to effectively use any handgun against a grizzly; especially in a defensive situation.

Save the last round for yourself. It'll be a blessed relief as the bear is wearing your guts as a hat.
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  #3416  
Old 07-18-2017, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by D Chapman View Post
You're black. Black people should not have guns.
Cute. What gun right did DT protect and when?
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  #3417  
Old 07-18-2017, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by D Chapman View Post
Here you go, JB. Read up.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distri...mbia_v._Heller

That was a 5-4 vote. In case you're not paying attention that's 1 vote shy of stripping your individual right to keep and bear arms for self-defense. Everywhere?

Who did Obama put up for the Scalia? Merrick Garland? What's Merrick Garland's view on guns? Want to take a guess? So what happens if Merrick Garland were seated as a Justice of the Supreme Court and the Heller case was recalled? Thankfully we'll never know.

But yeah, fake.
A what if? Come on Daniel. A what if? What has Trump done to protect our gun rights? Not a "What if?" Dude - you're stretching.

What s it about Trump you like? Why didn't you vote for him? Seriously - why didn't you vote for him? You didn't support him six months ago but you'll argue profusely FOR him now. What is it about him that makes him a goof leader for our country? I think you just like to argue. That's my theory. I think you like to choose the opposite side of almost anything to rub salt in a wound. You never did answer my question 5 or six posts ago - why do you like rubbing salt in the wounds of a man that think the country deserves more than Clinton or Trump?
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  #3418  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:05 PM
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Hey look! More bull shit from the lying clown king in the White House!

But today he said this....
https://youtu.be/zC7uPVkuGdY

Real leader here folks! The sack of shit can't live by his own words.
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  #3419  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:08 PM
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Oh yeah .... got to 1:46 for the clown's idea of leadership.
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  #3420  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ERover82 View Post
Cute. What gun right did DT protect and when?
I'd say future rights and his name is Neil Gorsuch.
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  #3421  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:13 PM
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Originally Posted by emmodg View Post
Oh yeah .... got to 1:46 for the clown's idea of leadership.
Something tells me if you were in the same room with Trump you'd start whimpering like a little puppy. That's not limited to you either. All of you big shots would.
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  #3422  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:18 PM
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Originally Posted by brian4d View Post
Something tells me if you were in the same room with Trump you'd start whimpering like a little puppy. That's not limited to you either. All of you big shots would.
Something tells me you're either under the age of 18, love infomercials, think we didn't land on the moon, and find girls "icky". Either way, your blabbering is getting predictable boring and sad.
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  #3423  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:26 PM
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I saw Trump when I was 17 in 1986 I guess... he was in DC. At the time I was aaaaall about him. I did a "biography" on him for an English class. Then I grew up. I used to believe in the tooth fairy at one time as well.... Trump is an idiot. Whimper? Please Brian grow up young man. Stop waking up every morning and coming up with ways to be a "bad ass". Choose your heros and people to admire on your own standards and not because "it's cool" or makes a statement. You obviously worry quite a bit about the tenure of Lord Vader Clown as your posts come off as defensive and nervous. Keep telling yourself you've picked a good president and leader though. Say it enough and you'll start to believe it. I still feel sorry for you man. Keep jabbing like a school boy at everyone and everything that makes you nervous but I'll still feel sorry for you.
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  #3424  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by emmodg View Post
Something tells me you're either under the age of 18, love infomercials, think we didn't land on the moon, and find girls "icky". Either way, your blabbering is getting predictable boring and sad.
Check out your posts here. They aren't exactly earth shattering. Me nervous? Nice try, I'm just a guy that likes our president and will defend him when I see silly fucking left wing regurgitated comments. He takes two scoops while everyone else takes one, right? My last post must have really tweaked a nerve with you. Get over it, block me or move on. Pretty simple.

Oh young man? That's a funny one.
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  #3425  
Old 07-18-2017, 11:45 PM
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Originally Posted by brian4d View Post
Check out your posts here. They aren't exactly earth shattering. Me nervous? Nice try, I'm just a guy that likes our president and will defend him when I see silly fucking left wing regurgitated comments. He takes two scoops while everyone else takes one, right? My last post must have really tweaked a nerve with you. Get over it, block me or move on. Pretty simple.

Oh young man? That's a funny one.
I was over you 20 or so posts ago young man. Left wing? Again, you speak without any knowledge. I won't block you - your funny to get all jacked up on an 18 year old kid rant! The world is much more interesting with dolts like you in it! Thanks Brian - for being you!
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