| Author |
Message |
    
derek (Vortrex)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 12:56 pm: | 
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curious as to what people think is more capable for off-road, '95 D1 or '00 D2? both trucks would be bone stock. I'm sure there must be some techinical reasons for the answer? |
gp (Garrett)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 01:05 pm: |
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that is like asking which Olsen twin will be the hottest. i mean it all depends on how much money you are looking to put into it. but right off the lot i am guessing many will say the D1 with the better departure angle. but then again who really cares if you are dragging your ass. again it really comes down to the driver.
 |
PerroneFord
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 01:14 pm: |
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The ETC on the newer disco is pretty effective. The departure angle is worse though. I guess it really depends on the terrain you're covering. And as GP said, the driver plays a large role.
-P |
JB
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 01:20 pm: |
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I'll put a vote in for the D2. At least with ETC you won't have to worry too much about getting cross-axled... |
p m
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 01:26 pm: |
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ETC... LOL
all drivers in my family get giddy with excitement when ABS light comes on on the dash. That means nice and predictable brakes. don't even know if it's relevant...
peter |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 04:04 pm: |
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Here's my $0.02 worth. Question was stock but how many really remain stock :-)
Out with a Dealer sponsored run - D90's, Disco I's, DII's. One hill made up of broken down shale rock and gravel. Different drivers.
D90 w/o lockers - struggles but made it. Took a couple of tries.
D90 w lockers - no problem, right on up.
DI w/o lockers - same as D90 w/o lockers
DII with ETC - struggled first time. Backed down. Switched to 'Sport mode'. Stuggled again. Backed down. Finally carried enough speed and raw 'I'm gonna make come hell or high water' (foot in it and rocks flying) and made it up.
Observation - with lockers - no spin of wheels, just climb hill. ETC - wheel would spin 1/4 circle, kick out rock, ETC would take effect and send torque to other side, other wheel would spin 1/4 circle kick out rock, some forward progress but climb aborted. Repeat sequence until driver figures it out and carries enough speed. Speed is ok if you have the room and straight line, but ...
Mark |
Phillip Perkinson (R0ver4x4)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 04:11 pm: |
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nicely executed |
PerroneFord
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 04:17 pm: |
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You mean ETC isn't as effective as lockers? I'm glad it wasn't me who said this. I believe its sacrilige to say it. And do you mean to say the D90 with no lockers made it with similar effort to the Disco with ETC?
-P |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 06:30 pm: |
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Good catch Perrone - now we are into drivers and a whole realm of possibilities. Actually I think that ETC is better than open diffs but the difference can be made up with driver, line of attack and strategy. On the other hand, lockers do make a significant difference.
Mark
98' D1 w/o lockers but with skill :-) |
p m
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 07:06 pm: |
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Mark,
how about broken ETC and the owner scared shitless of voiding his warranty by installing the CDL (or having no such option whatsoever)?
peter |
JMcD
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 07:24 pm: |
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Am I the only one who is frightened by the concept of having to judge which Olsen twin is the hottest? You worry me Garrett. Alot. JMcD |
Anonymous
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 07:34 pm: |
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He hangs out on lilamber.com (as seen on MSNBC TV). Lets stick to the legal hobbies. |
Dave_Lucas (Dave_Lucas)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 07:43 pm: |
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With a stock 00 DII you could crawl under and engage the CDL, the CDL combined with the ETC should make the DII have more traction than the open Diff CDL DI right? |
p m
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 08:01 pm: |
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in theory
that's what i used to think
but experienced d2 owners said otherwise
peter |
Michael Noe (Noee)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 08:04 pm: |
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I just put the CDL kit in my rig (99 D2, got really tired of climbing underneath) and the ETC still gets confused in certain scenarios, like when climbing, losing momentum and getting one front and on rear off the ground. It doesn't seem natural to have to think about how to drive so as not to confuse the ETC. It's just not a black and white issue, there's a lot of gray and that is what I think Mark has said in half the space that I have just taken up. IMO, all D2 owners (who can) should install a CDL kit. |
PerroneFord
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 08:24 pm: |
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Is there a locker application for the NBS rangie/DII? That might be the solution.
-P |
Craig M. Highland (Shortbus)
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 08:35 pm: |
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Stock? the D2
Built? the D1
my .02
Craig |
SirRobin
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 06:59 am: |
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From my experience and some observation of others, the ETC requires less "driving". you simply pick a sensible line, apply light to moderate throttle, let the ETC click and pop away and blindly keep the light throttle while keeping the truck straight. much less finesse.
The approach to driving the locked trucks requires a deft and sensitive foot on the throttle, adding gas when one senses traction, backing off when slipping too much. |
gp (Garrett)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 08:26 am: |
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jmcd and anon. no need to worry about me, but i appreciate it. there are enough people i scare out there. i am just trying to think ahead that is all. and it is legal......i asked my attorney. |
Off Road Disco
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 09:33 am: |
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The single best mod I made to my 1999 Disco II was to install the CDL linkage (that way to need to crawl underneath and burn your arm). With the CDL and ETC it acts like a Disco I with a rear locker but with out the anoying tendency of having the locker "steer" your vehicle. I REALLY don't understand why Land Rover never included the CDL linkage. Now if I can only bobtail the rear. =) |
Mark & Bev Preston (Markp)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 09:47 am: |
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So it looks like ETC + CDL improves the DII but with some interesting behaviour and at the risk of your warranty. I don't own a DII but let's do a "what-if". Is it possible to add a switch to turn off ETC? Then as Perrone wondered - is there a locker for DII's? If there was a ARB locker you could turn off ETC and turn on ARB locker for those situations that needed it.
Just wondering.
Mark |
Kent Westbrook
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 10:31 am: |
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Actually, depending on how you've got the CDL linkage done on the DII, ETC can easily be disabled. On mine, for instance, if I have CDL locked then turn off the vehicle and turn it back on, ETC and ABS are disabled. I'm not sure how the introduction of an ARB or other locker into this situation would play, but I'm not sure if you'd need to disable ETC. It seems like a locking differential would just keep ETC from having to work as much, but there may be something I'm overlooking here. There are a couple of folks who've installed limited slips on their DIIs and these, in combination with CDL, supposedly keep ETC from having to work as much. Theoretically, I guess, that should be a pretty potent combination on a DII. |
p m
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 12:18 pm: |
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SirRobin,
what was it about keeping the truck straight?
there's a goofy photo here
couldn't resist
peter |
Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 12:37 pm: |
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I don't know why you would want to turn off the ETC with the CDL on. It's awesome with both CDL and ETC.
ARB does make a locker for the Disco II. I think it's the same as the one for the DS1 but I'm not sure... I just know they make one.
As for keep the truck steering straight. When you have something like an ARB locker in the rear there will be times when the force of the rear wheels will make the truck resistant to turning if the front wheels are not firmly planted. While this is minor in the rear it can happen when you climb a hill and try to turn a little. This doesn't happen with CDL and ETC only with CDL and rear locked. |
Joe Cole
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 01:13 pm: |
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So if you think installation of a CDL linkage from a DI is beyond your mechanical capability,what is the best way to get CDL on your DII? |
Kent Westbrook
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 01:45 pm: |
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Al,
I agree, with CDL and ETC the DII performs pretty well. I've never actually run CDL without ETC, just know it can be done, mostly because I forget to disengage CDL before I turn off the engine then, when I restart...no ETC or ABS.
I think you're right about the ARB being the same as that for the D1, but only repeating something I heard somewhere else, so can't vouch for reliability of info.
Kent |
JMcD
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 05:03 pm: |
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LOL, ok Garrett, I believe ya. Legal is really just a frame of mind anyway, right? JMcD |
Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 06:03 pm: |
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Joe, The CDL install is not that hard. If you have some basic tools and an afternoon you can do it yourself. If you don't want to do it then find a shop willing to do it if you don't want to take it to the dealer. If I remember the tools you need are...
Wrenches
Socket set
Screw drivers
rivit gun
dremel or tin snips
silicone glue |
Michael Noe (Noee)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 07:04 pm: |
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Joe:
You might consider one of the CDL kits, Adam Skerritt's on disco2.com or I believe there is an electric/solenoid model imported by GBR. I just put in the Skerritt (Topline) kit. Pretty easy, much easier than the D1 linkage, though you have a separate shift knob.
BTW, doesn't Tractech have a Detriot locker for the D2? |
chuson
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 08:03 pm: |
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Joe,
where do live? Maybe someone on this board can help you out with this.
chu |
Tricky
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 09:01 pm: |
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Has anyone (been game enough) pulled any of the plugs on top of the transfer case to see if the CDL will not disable the ABS/TC every time you restart the vehicle?? |
Curtis
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 03, 2002 - 12:57 am: |
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OK - original question was a 95 D1 or an 00 D2. This sounds like an "I've got a choice and one will end up in my driveway" question. I agree wholeheartedly with the responses alluding to how it will be driven.
If the purpose is offroad driving then it is a whole different ballgame than on-road. You can buy a D1 and modify the hell out of it for less than a stock used D2. Lift, lockers, protection flavor of the month...you name it.
If it is a mixed purpose vehicle and you had unlimited dollars, I would go D2 with lift, DT rear, TT front, 4.11 gears, and CDL, with good sliders, winch and bumper...and a much lighter wallet than with the D1 option.
Both would be great. Just buy what you can afford and be happy.
Curtis
D2 with options in stealth mode |
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