| Author |
Message |
    
Gregor
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 10:40 am: | 
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I have a Disco with 105,000 miles and the engine is very tired (noisy lifters and valves) and I am thinking of either replacing it or just getting rid of the truck altogether. I love the truck but I don't know if it's worth the work. I would like to install a larger engine (the 4.6) as I tow a trailer and the 4.0 can barely manage 75mph if floored (4000lb trailer). My questions then are:
1. Has anyone here done this?
2. Who did the work? I have used Dawson Sanner of Classix 4x4 for years but he hasn't returned my calls - maybe too busy or maybe not interested. ECR can't do it until the fall and I know my engine won't make it until then.
3. Would a used engine be a good option?
4. Any other options? |
Paul T. Schram (Paulschram)
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 01:31 pm: |
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I am very curious as to why your engine is worn out at 105K. My disco has 145K and seven previous owners. Going Strong!
If it's just noisy lifters and valves, just do a head job. Also, pulling the heads will give you a great view of the condition of the cylinder bores.
paul |
Ali
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 01:51 pm: |
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It's easy, just pull out your short block and replace it with a 4.6 and reuse all of the other ancelliaries. I'd rebuild the top end to make all this worth your while. New gaskets and stuff and you should be done. |
Dee Cantrell (Disco_Dad)
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 01:53 pm: |
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Gregor,
Talk to Chris Crane @ http://www.rpiv8.com he has a 4.0 to 4.6 complete kit. He is honest and his prices relate to the high quality parts he sells in other words you get your $$$ worth from him.
Paul, you missed his intent TOWING the 4.0 is pretty much gutless there...
Dee |
Gregor
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 04:01 pm: |
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I've talked to Chris about the 4.6 conversion and it would be in the neighborhood of $4-5000 for the engine for a "full" or "long" block. I don't have the space or time to do the swap and my normal mechanic doesn't even have the time to call me back. Do any of you know of a good (preferably non-dealer) mechanic on the east coast?
My next option is to cut my losses and sell the truck as is. Do you have any idea what it would be worth? Paint is very scratched (used off road), Emu heavy suspension, ARB bumper, Ramsey Winch, Adventure rack, clean interior... I love the truck but I'm not sure it's worth putting $6-7000 into it at this point. I'd hate to part it out but I don't know if there's an option. |
Dee
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 04:18 pm: |
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Another option is find a low mile used 4.6 and drop it in. As for RPI i was refering to his 4.6 upgrade kit and doing the Build up on this side off the pond. |
Bill Bettridge (Billb)
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 05:17 pm: |
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Gregor - not sure where you're located, but if you're serious about finding someone to do a motor swap, try Trevor Griffiths at Treasured Motorcars (Baltimore, MD) 410-833-2329.
Bill |
Craig M. Highland (Shortbus)
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 06:39 pm: |
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Quote:It's easy, just pull out your short block and replace it with a 4.6 and reuse all of the other ancelliaries.
You'll need a new oilpan, or some bfh mods to the 4.0 oilpan...
fwiw-
Craig |
Rich Lee
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 11:00 pm: |
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Gregor,
Don't chuck the truck until you.ve gone over the basics.
First, change the oil with 5 qts of Castrol Syntec 5W-50W and 1 quart of Lucas oil treatment (all at Pep Boys) and a good non-drainback filter that is the equvalent size/better quality to the Fram PH-8 (like Wix, Mobil-1 or K&N HP 3001).
This may be all you need to silence the lifters.
If the valves are sticky, there are "treatments" that can dissolve deposits around the valvestems, that are basically run through the intake of a running motor. Ask your dealer or a competent mechanic. Some on this list may also know about this.
Replace, leaky vacuum/emissions hoses and the "T-piece" and clean out your "stepper motor".
Check the sparkplugs (I found one loose on my truck) and/or replace them with simple Champion RN11YCC or equivalent "Truck Plug" (one of mine also had a cracked insulator after 15k mi.).
Also, replace your plug wires with a Magnecor 8mm set, ESPECIALLY if your Disco has a distributor. If it does, also replace the cap, rotor and consider replacing the coil if it is the original.
Be sure to check that the vacuum advance works and that its hose doesn't leak. Next, reset your timing to 6 to 9 degrees before TDC. And tighten your transmission "kickdown" cable so that there is 4mm tp 5mm gap between the cable stop and the housing.
Next, replace the fuel filter and run a full tank of Chevron Supreme with an extra bottle of Techron in the tank.
Lastly, install a K&N air filter (keep the original for really dusty trips).
Doing many of the above steps on my wife's 91 Rangie (at 78 k mi) and later on my 95 Disco (at 105 k mi.) really transformed the trucks from "old dogs" to respectable "like new" performance.
Depending on what you actually need to replace, the job will cost you 1 to 2 half days of driveway wrenching (depending upon time spent for parts/beer/girl chasing) and anywhere from $100 to $400 in parts/oil/gas.
Unless you can prove that the valves and lifters are shot, the above "tune-up" may really be all you need.
PS. If you are going up even the slightest hill or against the slightest headwind, you will probably need to "downshift" into 3rd to get even a stock-tired unlifted disco to pull a 4000lb trailer at 75 mph.
Good Luck,
Rich |
Rich Lee
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 11:21 am: |
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A few more things,
In most states, the speed limit for towing a trailer is 55 mph. Why the need for 20 over?
The very fact that you are pulling a trailer negates the premise of "speed" in any travel.
If you still want to haul ass when you haul stuff,
get a ford F350 powerstroke deisel 4x4 pickup with a Banks Kit on it (350+ Hp and 600+ ft-lbs).
For 2 years I hauled a horse and trailer around to many shows with a VW Rabbit pickup (GTI motor and a real good clutch). By comparison, the Disco is a rocket ship. |
Norm
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 12:59 pm: |
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I replaced the 3.9 in my '95 with an RPi 4.6 and it made a BIG difference in performance. If your heads are still in good shape, you can put in a 4.6 short block -- a brand new short block from Atlantic British is @ $3600 but I'm sure you could beat their prices somewhere, or get a good used one salvage. Check the Land Rover Exchange, there's a place called Roverland in FL selling rebuilt 4.6s fairly cheap. As far as installation, you might try East Coast Rovers in Maine -- they're an RPi affiliate and most of their business seems to be engine swaps.
If you do the swap, you'll also need to reprogram the fuel map so the 4.6 won't run lean and burn up. Since you have a 4.0 you have the GEMS ECU, so you can't just rechip it -- you'd have to send your ECU in to RPi to be reprogrammed, which I think cost @ $1500. Check the RPi website for details.
Whether or not it's worth the time and money is up to you and what shape the rest of your truck is in. I can tell you that it made all the difference in the world on my truck and was a hell of a lot easier than trying to adapt a Chevy 350 or what not.
---Norm |
Gregor
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 06:47 pm: |
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I really appreciate the information here. I've been wieghing the costs and I'm still not sure what to do. The truck seems to be getting pretty tired and I've got a lot of little electrical glitches that keep coming up. I've found a friend who is actually a Master Rover mechanic and he'll do the swap for about $500 (for those who are wondering why I can't do it I live in NYC and I can't rig up an engine hoist on the sidewalk and leave it overnight).
I'm guessing it'll run about $5-6000 once all the little things are taken care of but it could be more as I haven't heard from Chris yet about final cost with shipping. That still leaves me with a truck with a 105,000 on the body and drive train.
The truck went to Classic 4x4's in CT and they did a 30,000 mile service but neglected to even listen to the valves and it came back to me far worse. The noise has gotten steadily worse and now the truck is louder than a diesal. It's a bit beyond "motor honey" at this point. Unfortunetly Dawson just put $1800 in new brakes on it with out listening to the engine.
I'm seriously considering the Ford and that's my dillema right now. Do I spend $7000 to fix a truck that's worth $8-9000? How many miles will the rest of the truck give me? Should I cut my losses?
Do any of you have any idea of what the truck might be worth in it's present condition?
Thanks,
Gregor |
Dee
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 07:49 pm: |
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Not sure of your budget but ECR did a nice job on that DI$CO a while back, Kyle how about those flares?
I am too cheep to do that myself but 15K for a new rebuilt disco vrs 15 to 20 k for a used unknown might be worth it. I am sure a 4.0 to 4.6 upgrade might be cheeper than the TDI upgrade.
Or being your in NY you could sublet it as a studio... and apply the rent towards a new 2003 ranggie |
Norm
| | Posted on Friday, June 21, 2002 - 02:51 am: |
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Gregor --
How can you even consider a Ford for off-road if you already have a Rover???
Sounds like you have a decent off-road set-up...how is the rest of the drive train holding up? Dings and scratches from off-roading are a sign of character, why paint over them?
Don't worry about how much the Rover will be worth unless you intend to sell it in the near future, in which case, you might as well sell it as is or part it out and not bother with the motor swap. Personally, I would love to pick up a good RR or Defender with a bum motor for cheap and do this swap.
If your intention is to keep driving off-road, I'd go ahead and do the swap. I think you'll be pleased with the power gains. If you're still worried about the monetary value, adding a new 4.6 will only increase the value of your truck -- just see how much more 4.6 Range Rovers go for vs. 4.0s -- the whole will be greater than the sum of the parts. |
Norm
| | Posted on Friday, June 21, 2002 - 03:02 am: |
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A couple more things --
Before you do the swap (if you do it), make sure your oil pump is in good shape. If you use your old heads, check all the specs and be sure you've got the newer "carbon break" exhaust valves. For that matter, I'd get a factory OVERHAUL manual for the Rover V8 and read it for your own peace of mind -- and so you'll be sure you get the correct parts, including new head bolts. |
JEspelien (Superj)
| | Posted on Monday, June 24, 2002 - 04:44 pm: |
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55 MPH for trailer towing??? What little itty bitty excuse for a state are in you in? I just made a trip to Seattle from Minneapolis pulling a boat and let me tell you that would be one long damn drive at 55 mph! We ran my 4700 Sporttruck on the governor at 84 mph the entire way. We passed NOBODY in Montana not one single vehicle was traveling slower than us. I saw a white haired old guy who must have been 80 years old pulling a Uhaul trailer at least 90 MPH with his Roadmaster wagon on a space saver spare. |
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