Oil leaks

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Author Message   Retardriot Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 08:59 pm:    im in the market of buying a 95-98 Disco and im hearing a good amount about oil leaks and that all discos have this problem. this makes me kind of hesitant, is there any solution to these oil leaks?   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 09:06 pm:    if it's not leaking just make sure there's some in the sump.... bwahahahahahahaaaaa sorry guys, I had to! RJ   Retardriot Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 09:56 pm:    seriously, i need to know since im going to buy soon   Clif Ashley (Cta586) Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 10:04 pm:    It is common knowledge that a high percentage of British cars have oil leaks. There is always a solution. Sometimes it just comes down to deciding that it is a lot cheaper to clean the driveway and buy an extra quart of oil every once in awhile than it is to get a new...(ie. pan gasket)In my opinion there are a lot more important issues than oil leaks, and if it really concerns you then a Rover probably is not the best vehicular vehicle for you. Just my thoughts...   Ron Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 10:06 pm:    The solution is to fix the leaks. That stops them for a while. Ron   Leslie N. Bright (Leslie) Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 10:18 pm:    Ron's right. You fix the leaks. When they come back, you fix them again. Or, you keep an eye on fluid levels, just top it off regularly. That's life with most British vehicles. Sometimes, if you're lucky, you can find one that doesn't leak, or at least doesn't yet leak, but, I'll never forget being in the dealership looking at a beautiful D90 there on the showroom floor, with a puddle under it. -L   Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco) Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 11:50 pm:    My Disco leaks less than my neighbors Jeep Grand Cherokee.   Greg P Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 01:16 am:    Al, you should be ashamed of yourself letting your Disco get out-leaked by a Cherokee.   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 07:35 am:    Yeah Al, my Cherokee doesn't leak at all! LOL!   Retardriot Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:32 am:    i was thinking either a disco or a 97+ cherokee, so maybe ill go with something that leaks less?   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 11:23 am:    Whoa, man, I didn't wanna turn you away from a disco!!! LOL... My cousin just bought an '00 Disco, and i have to tell ya, what a sweet rig. Having only worked on Series Rovers and Jeeps, it will be cool to see how the disco reacts to mods in the woods. I love my '99 XJ but man, I drool on the disco's too...Kinda hard to compare my '99 to a stock disco now though... RJ   Retardriot Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 02:51 pm:    so, for a 17year old with $10k and who wants to go off road cherokee or disco   Retardriot Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 02:57 pm:    10k to spend on a vehicle that is   Mark & Bev Preston (Markp) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 02:59 pm:    My 98 Discovery has 68K miles on it, no leaks and I have run synthetics since around 15K miles. I believe Land Rover redesigned the gaskets from 97 and on. That was the BMW influence. Bev and I have some friends that both bought the late model Cherokee (classic?). Both have had to be towed. Bev drove one of them up to Denver and said it road rough, made noises and felt generally like a piece of junk. This for a vehicle with about 12K on it.   Robbie (Robbie) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 03:01 pm:    "so, for a 17year old with $10k and who wants to go off road cherokee or disco" early Toyota 4Runner (84-89) with some stuff   Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 03:04 pm:    Disco! The XJ's are nice too but either way you'll have to figure on extra cash to either fix stuff that's broke or fix stuff to wheel. I own a Disco but wheel alot with one of two other XJ's. I think a stock Disco is much more capable on the trail than an XJ.   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 03:05 pm:    Maybe we should start a new thread? You can email me backchannel for any of the pitfalls to Building/wheeling an XJ....   Paul T. Schram (Paulschram) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 03:17 pm:    Once you realize just how easy the Rovers are to work on, there won't be much of a difficulty for you to realize how wise your decision was to buy the Rover. I have put slightly more than 50K miles on mine in the past 17 months. After finally discovering the power steering leak, the only leak I currently have is a minor one from the valve covers and for those, I'm just waiting for the time to do the work. Some leak worse than others, but in my case, I have almost completely fixed them all. FWIW, my '83 Chevy flat-bed truck leaks so much •••••• fluid that you can tell where it has been parked from the dead grass and torn up asphalt! I just add a quart every time I drive it.   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 03:18 pm:    I like disco's A LOT. I like my XJ A lot. as far as stock for stock wheeling? I couldn't tell you. I know the things I did in my XJ while stock floored quite a few people...95% is driver off road. As far as reliability...My Jeep has yet to be at the dealer for anything (it's a '99 with 65k) and drives tight and straight, no rattles. As far as rover reliability? Uh......nevermind heh heh. One thing I will certainly say. A stock Disco rides SOOOOOO much better than a stock XJ. Now that I'm running all OME/Rubicon Express gear, my ride is Stellar, but still, stock sucked. rj   George Clayton (Offcamber) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 03:19 pm:    Just based on what I'm seeing in getting ready to mod my new (to me) '00, if you're 17 Y/O with ONLY $10k for an off-road rig, and are looking for something that is inexpensive to mod and fix......Cherokee. NOW that said....if you want a good $10K rig, and then have the cash to mod, are mechanically adept, looking for a bit more class than the average wheeler......well.....I no longer have my '93 Cherokee.... IMHO   Mark & Bev Preston (Markp) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 03:53 pm:    Ok, here's another angle. $10K will not get you a late model Disco I. Have no clue about XJ's. I have 17 and 21 year old sons. Both wheel and I'll tell you right now they will be a lot rougher on the vehicle than you. Then again, so was I at 17 :-) Both drive Scouts and I'm glad they do. For $10K you can get a lot of IH Scout that will out-4wheel a XJ and keep up with a Disco. And it will take the abuse of 17 yr olds. Plus $10K spent on a Scout will get you something that will appreciate in value. Heck, $5-6K will get you a lot of Scout. - Mark   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 04:09 pm:    so a stock XJ won't keep up with a Stock Disco? LOL... just messing with ya, but like I said, I know guys in stock Series II rovers that would make someone in a Built stage III Safari Gard Disco, look feeble. It's almost ALL driver. Yeah mods help but if you're an ass monkey, you'll get hurt five minutes after airing down. I wouldn't be here if I didn't love and respect rovers, and Rover/Jeep animosity aside, I'd have to call you on that first statement...heh heh. RJ   Ho Chung (Ho) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 04:42 pm:    LOL RJ, you asking for it. capable or not, XJ ain't got style. thats' the bottom line.   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 04:50 pm:    I have to say man, My cousin's Disco is prolly the sweetest looking rig in the Fam LOL! RJ   p m Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 04:57 pm:    a disco or XJ? chicks won't dig the little Cherokee. Ho, style or not, a stock XJ with street tires flew by my disco stuck in snow last winter. no matter the explanations peter   Ho Chung (Ho) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 04:58 pm:    but i bet you were stuck in style. LOL peter, face it, jeep ain't got the same style no matter where you are stuck.   p m Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 05:17 pm:    to answer the RetardRiot question, it is more of a pain - or more expensive - to upgrade the XJ 'til you start seeing some serious results. The front trailing arms are about a foot long, so 2" change in spring height results in some ugly handling problems. the rear is easy to lift. Another XJ's inherent problem is a dana 35 rear and 30-front - both axles aren't up to large tires, you can be sure you'd be breaking axleshafts in the rear and u-joints in the front with 33"+ tires. NP231 used in the XJ has the slip-joint in the rear, which leaks oil on the stock jeeps, and will turn butt ugly when 2-3" lift is in. Gearing is pretty tall, so you're looking into putting either lower gears into the t-case or axles (t-case is the better solution but it costs more). and the worst (IMO) is that the XJ's body flexes a lot - one wheel on the curb, and you can't open the tailgate. It has to be crack-prone, but i haven't been on the XJ list for the last 5 years or so, no feedback on that. peter   p m Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 05:20 pm:    yes, Ho, you're right on the money. THIS is being stuck in style! peter   Ho Chung (Ho) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 05:23 pm:    not quite, you need some big ass hellas, some nice brushbar, and a shitload of decals. LOL   p m Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 05:28 pm:    oh Ho, i have the decals all right. Discoweb - Qty 2, Detroit Truetrac - Qty 1, GBR - Qty 2, - what else - oh yeah, OME Qty 1. all of them - in the rear, so it's only the rear style. brushbar ain't likely to ever make it there, as are hellas. At least, I had a rusty hi-lift and a shovel as style supplements peter   Pete Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 05:50 pm:    Ho which has more style. Stock aluminum rims or LR steel rims in a 245/75/16. BTW what should I upgrade if I ran steel rims. Thanks   Ho Chung (Ho) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 05:52 pm:    stock LR alumium wheels.   Blue (Bluegill) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 05:54 pm:    definitely   Pete Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 06:01 pm:    But Ho how come you are using LR steel rims. I thought your truck looks cool.   chu son Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 06:03 pm:    Yeah, that's because Ho's the REAL DEAL. He don't go for style. chu   Ho Chung (Ho) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 06:05 pm:    what i run doesn't matter. i never get to see my own wheels anyways. chu,   Blue (Bluegill) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 06:17 pm:    there's only one reason I want to swap my disco aluminums for disco steelies (OK, two reasons...)   p m Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 06:38 pm:    it hurts to see my aluminum rims all scratched up... somehow, it doesn't produce any negative feeling to see a big dent on a steelie peter   Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 09:06 pm:    " it hurts to see my aluminum rims all scratched up..." Yeah but it's fun to see how much more lead weight you'll need when you balance the wheels.   p m Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 09:11 pm:    on the steel wheels wrapped with beat-up Futura Enforcers, it looks like the lead weights take up a third of the rim! nearly as much weight as on 15" wagon wheels with 35x12.5 BFG MTs. peter   Retardriot Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:19 pm:    would i have to regear if i put 31x10.50R15 BFG A/T or something near that size on a disco   Retardriot Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:22 pm:    also, OME or Rovertyme for a suspension lift to fit tires that size, or around that size   Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:28 pm:    Rovertym if you want a true 2" or 3" lift or OME if you want to stay closer to 1 1/2". Your call depending on your wants/needs. I run 265/75x16's (about 31"-32") with stock gearing. D90's ran that same size tire out of the show room with the same gearing as the D1 (I think) so you should be okay. But it's always nicer to have lower gears.   Sean Hanagan (Seanh) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:30 pm:    I got more lead weights on my scraped/chipped tornadoes than Bill Dance's tackle box at the bassmaster world championship.   Retardriot Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:36 pm:    so if i were to get 265/75R16s or 31x10.50R15s what would i have to do to the disco so they wouldnt rub goin off road and stuff   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:44 pm:    "it is more of a pain - or more expensive - to upgrade the XJ 'til you start seeing some serious results. The front trailing arms are about a foot long, so 2" change in spring height results in some ugly handling problems. the rear is easy to lift. Another XJ's inherent problem is a dana 35 rear and 30-front - both axles aren't up to large tires, you can be sure you'd be breaking axleshafts in the rear and u-joints in the front with 33"+ tires. NP231 used in the XJ has the slip-joint in the rear, which leaks oil on the stock jeeps, and will turn butt ugly when 2-3" lift is in. Gearing is pretty tall, so you're looking into putting either lower gears into the t-case or axles (t-case is the better solution but it costs more). and the worst (IMO) is that the XJ's body flexes a lot - one wheel on the curb, and you can't open the tailgate. It has to be crack-prone, but i haven't been on the XJ list for the last 5 years or so, no feedback on that. " 1. The Lower control arms don't tend to cause handling issues until over 4" of lift. I personally run Rubicon Express LCA's with a spherical Ball joint for more articulation with my 3" of lift. My truck aligns perfectly and rides like a dream (thanks to OME!!) 2. My differential gears are 3.55 (stock) and the T-case has a 2.72:1 Low ratio. That's pretty dan good for stock. I don't know what the stock disco ratios are. The 231 is bullettproof when fitted with a SYE kit ($300). 3. As far a body flex, the XJ does flex a bit, but the 97+ body style is MUCH stiffer and in this pic.... In this album (go to ramp) below, I got out and opened the rear hatch, closed it with no troubles there or with any of the doors. Ramp Photo Album 4. My XJ came from the factory with the 29spline 8.25 rear, not the dana 35 wich only appears with the ABS equipped bretheren...The 8.25 is a stout Axle. I only run 30's right now...33's are no problem. The Dana 30 High Pinion in the front offers plenty of clearance and is too capable of 33's with no Mods (already has the Spicer 297 Ujoint from the factory). Could both of these axles satnd an upgrade? Hell Yes!!! is it mandatory? No way. Like I stated before guys, I'mon this board because I love Rovers, always have, I've wheeled with plenty of them and respect them tons. I'm also here because my new business will benefit from what I learn from you folks. I'd never come here and post that the XJ was superior to the Disco. Ever. Just like I wouldn't expect you folks to come over to www.jeepsunlimited.com's forums and Decry the Jeep as a washout LOL! I certainly won't sit idly by though and let someone spread false-truths about EITHER truck. Go on JU (I'm a moderator on the XJ forum) and you find I am the biggest proponant of the LR's. RJ   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:51 pm:    Oh yeah!! LOL!! Peace Talk/SUMMIT!!!!   p m Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:39 pm:    RJ, i'd love to bitch with you about what's good and what's bad on an XJ - I had one for three years (and loved it), and my brother has one now. But - now a friend of mine bought one, and first thing on his mind (he's a youngster) was lift and bigger tires. three hours later, his Cherokee rolled outta my garage with 2" of lift and 31" tires. The power and torque weren't an issue, he has a 4.0. But the handling and overall road feel - give me a break. We've ruined an otherwise perfectly good vehicle. For its wheelbase, it doesn't like the lift a whole lot. The front tires (as small as 10.5" wide) will rub against lower control arms (in most cases), so you'd need to use ZJ control arms. The 231 is never bulletproof, although it is adequate for a mildly modded XJ. Of course, splined joint has to go - but then why not to regear it? Enter some $$. The Discos and Range Rovers have 3.27:1 low range ratio, and 1.22:1 high. On an XJ, I'd personally swap in a 208 out of a '80-83 SJ Cherokee, same bolt pattern, ratios, and outputs, but much stouter. I can't comment on the 97+ vs earlier bodies, mine was a 95, and it was no-no to pop the tailgate in anything but flat grounds. No such problems ever in any of the rovers, with two diagonal wheels in the air. the axles - yeah yeah. with fullsize Wagoneer axles being within 1/2" in width from XJ's (and having the right diff location from 80 to 91), it just seems a waste of time to upgrade the 30 and 35 (or 8.25). i'm not knocking the XJ, in fact, i said many times that i consider the XJ the best vehicle produced by the U.S. auto industry in the last 30 years. but, it is just wrong to compare XJ and a Disco - the rovers are closer to SJ series in many respects. peter   Dee Cantrell (Discodad) Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:51 pm:    PM fix that nice blue one up so you can tow me back after our next trip..   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:56 pm:    peter, all in good fun man!! LOL! to run 31's you do indeed need 3"+ (Pretty much law in the XJ world of narrow wheel wells) what type of lift did he instal? A friend recently did a Skyjacker 3" and it was terrible...I thought I was going to pee blood for a week after riding in it!! When you say 2" I'm assuming you just did a Budget Boost (AAL or shackles in the rear and a sapcer fror the front). Shocks? The control arms are usually best upgraded with aftermarket units. I ran a budget boost for almost a year with 30's and no rubbing until I installed the ARB and winch (got some sag...) I wasn't comparing them really just kinda representing the boys back home LOL. Have your friend email me and we'll get him fixed right up! My XJ rides like a dream (MUCH better than a stock XJ and most available kits out there...hell, XJ guys are impressed with the ride and the off-raod-ability of the rig...OME ROCKS!!!!!). Seriously, If he needs anything it's his, at cost, just so he's not bummed on a cruddy lift! RJ   George Clayton (Offcamber) Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 02:17 pm:    TOZ, and p m......ultimately, it comes down to this.....you get what you pay for in both cash and research, doesn't matter what you're modifying. A D1 with a CB lift, and 33's on it...stock shocks and other components...prolly ain't gonna be far out of the ballpark of an XJ with a 2" BB on a geeked springpak, and 31's on it. Do your research, spend the appropriate cash for the appropriate job, and you'll have a capable rig (Disco, RR, Landcruiser, or XJ). Try and short-sheet the bed on any of these, and you get what you "pay for".   Ken Dunnington Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 02:48 pm:    A ways up in the list Mark put in a vote for a Scout. I'll second that one. $10K will buy, build and maintain an awesome Scout. Rust is their main enemy. I have a STOCK '77 Scout II chassis under a '51 Willys wagon body(took care of rust). The Scout II is a real 4x4, like LRs. It has a fully boxed, ladder frame. 100" wheel base. Dana 44 axles front and rear with 3.54 gears. 345 gasser v8 that was designed for trucks with 25,000+ lb gross weight. The IH small v8(304/345/392) has high-nickel fully skirted block, forged crank, forged rods, forged pistons, gear driven cam, valve rotators, all stock. Four years now after re-ring, it still does not leak oil and I get 15 mpg. Dana 20 transfer(steel case and no chain, it's gear drive). T19 four speed(6~7:1 low) or Chrysler TF727 auto. Power steering, power brakes(disc fronts). Leaf springs at all four corners. Lockers/limited slip were optional from the factory. Removable top, a 17 year old will love this. It's not unusual to have IH engines go 300K miles before rebuild. Binders have their own following, as LRs do. Ken Dunnington   p m Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 03:24 pm:    George (Offcamber), i am not sure i understand the concept of "you get what you pay for" - for the stripper XJ, i paid 1/3 of what i paid for the disco (both were 2 year olds at the time of purchase). And not a single thing broke on the XJ in 30kmi of my ownership. The first 30kmi of my ownership of the disco were a constant hassle with electrics, leaks, rattles, etc. Not that it is all fixed, it leaks, rattles, and half of the electris doesn't work, i just figured i can live with it. my brother has an XJ with approx. the same mileage as my disco, and no problems. Ken Dunnington - you forgot the big jeeps in your list. I have two of those, one a street ride, another a dedicated off-roader. RJ - you're right on, the guy's a "starving student," and his lift is as cheap as they come - taller coils up front, and 2" blocks in the rear. The rear is fine, but his front is pretty much messed up; 31x10.5 tires rub quite a bit. But - it's a learning experience, and the guy's hooked; some day he will either build his XJ right, or get another rig. peter   Hltoppr Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 05:31 pm:    For a 17 yr old with 10K, the original purchase price is just one thing to consider. Speaking from my experience, even if I could have afforded a used disco in high school, the subsequent prices of parts/upkeep would have eaten me alive! The disco does have better styling than the cherokee, which are a dime-a-dozen, but for an all-around, easy to fix rig with cheap parts and tons of aftermarket support, I'd have to go with the Jeep. Use it as a learning experience, then move up to the disco.   p m Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 08:08 pm:    well.. with 10k, one could buy himself a nice 89-91 rangie, and have enuff left for up-keep to get through the college... peter   Mark & Bev Preston (Markp) Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 08:46 pm:    Look at what Ken wrote up. Look at what you get with a Scout for minimal cost. And its built like a tank. Clubs everywhere. Parts easy to get. Forums for info: http://atlas.binderbulletin.org/forums/ Classifieds: http://atlas.binderbulletin.org/classifieds/ Example vehicle: $8K http://atlas.binderbulletin.org/classifieds/index.php?ct=vfs&md=details&id=9368 Lot more vehicle than a XJ. Keep it nice and you'll be able to make money on it. - Mark   RJ Clayton (Tozovr) Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 10:39 pm:    Yeah there are about eleventy billion XJ's running around out there, but a well built one is just as rare as a well built (read NON yuppy-scum poseur rig) Landy. RJ