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Ross Thoma (Rossthoma)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 11:16 am: | 
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OK I have a 03 Disco and I will be getting a bumper to mount my warn 9000i onto.
The Discussion/Debate is:
Who makes the Best winch bumper? And defend your reasoning now, take all into account, price, stability, build quality, approach angle, strength of attachments and flex and all other arguments.
I want opinions from people who know and use thies products and/or have seen them triumph or fail... Company boasts and retoric asside I don't want to re-invent the wheel here. There will be a skid plate and I dont want cost to be a limiting factor.
And remember this will be a Kick Ass refference for future inquiries about this topic so let it all fly.
P.S. I have to be able to buy this product so unfortunatly unless you are able to produce your custome built bumper for others, sorry. It may be a great product but it is not "obtainable"
Ross Thoma |
Paul T. Schram (Paulschram)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:00 pm: |
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Ross:
I have an ARB bumper... It makes a great bulldozer. The approach angle is terrible. it does seem to be pretty strong. The price and build quality were both great.
Paul |
RJ Clayton (Tozovr)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:20 pm: |
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I'd imagine the aproach angle is still about 20 times better than stock right? Crappy when compared to SG though!! |
Paul D. Morgan (V22guy)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:25 pm: |
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Ross,
I bent the bottom of my ARB while plowing Rocks at Killington. Nothing major, I just have to learn that I am not driving a grader.
You have to look at what you really want the bumper and how it is supposed to perform. I bought the ARB based on cost. However, I wish I spent the money on something different.
Paul
'00 pig |
niall forbes (Forbesn)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:33 pm: |
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A lot of people bitch about ARB but there are a ton of them out there and they actually work well. They may have poor clearance compared to others but they are a proven product.
I like the look of the RoverTym products a lot. He really seems to think things out and make quality gear. If I ever had the money, that's probably where I'd go. I don't though, so I'm going to make my own.
SafariGard is cool but I only like them when they have three lights in the middle. Otherwise I find that huge centre hoop looks kinda gay. Not really a functional problem of course, but whatever.
I only have first hand experience with the ARB, and that only on friend's trucks, so I'm probably full of crap.
Asthetically (and really, that's what it's all about, isn't it ;-) I like the RT blade thing. That's sweet. I plan to base my home made hack job on that. |
Eric N (Grnrvr)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:37 pm: |
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I would say Rovertym.. Bumper has a good aproach angle, built very strong, mounted very strong, can take various types of winches, and priced pretty cheap for what you get. He also has top notch customer serivce. |
Rob Vreeland (Cruzths)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:58 pm: |
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Ross - While the Safari Gard bumper is expensive, it is a very nice looking bumper and very functional for off-roading. Search around and you will find a ton of pictures of them.
Here are a couple shots of my new SG bumper that I just had installed 2 weeks ago on my 2002 Disco (complete with warn XD9000 winch)
http://homepage.mac.com/robv/PhotoAlbum4.html
Also check out http://www.gotmud.org for some nice photos. |
Carter Simcoe (Carter)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 01:13 pm: |
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So the old DII bumpers will fit on the new 2003 Disco??
Be sure to post pics of this when it is done I really want to see a de-yuppified version of the truck. What else do you plan on doing to it in the near future??? |
Carter Simcoe (Carter)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 01:15 pm: |
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Oh and I have a non airbag ARB, I am not unhappy with it at all it performs well and does everything I ask it to with no real problems, but if I had to do it over again I would probablly save up some extra cash and get one from Rovertym. |
Ross Thoma (Rossthoma)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 01:58 pm: |
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Hey you guys, thanks for all the feedback so far, Keep it up!!
Carter. I ordered my $G sliders 2wks before the truck arrived and after $g sent me the rivnut tool they were on. (3 days after I drove it home)
In addition to the bumper and Skid plt I will be doing the OME thing and I am leaning towards the 235 85's but am still entertaining the 245 75's
RT |
Dave
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 02:00 pm: |
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Got no CDL. Your hosed. |
Ross Thoma (Rossthoma)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 02:24 pm: |
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Dave
This ain't no CDL thread, and I have never needed a CDL and I don't even have lockers on my ranger and I have never needed them I carry an Ax a sweed saw and I have my winch and if it would be too much of a pain or if I had to beat my truck to get past an obsticle, I just go around it or winch over it. There is more than one way to do anything.
But a CDL would have been nice.
rt |
David Gage (Davidg)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 02:44 pm: |
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Nobody has mentioned the TJM Bumper.. |
Brian Dickens (Bri)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 03:01 pm: |
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I considered Rockware, SG and ARB. I chose Rockware because they seem to make very strong pieces, stronger than ARB. They seem as strong as SG as well as approach/departure better than ARB and as good as SG (I beleive, but SG *might* be slightly better, hard to tell) A big plus was that they are somewhat local for me. They can take any winch that is foot down I believe. Parts and installation was better than SG price. I am very pleased so far. There are pictures in my gallery. |
Clif Ashley (Cta586)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 04:41 pm: |
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I dont have the TJM, but have seen/used it on a friends truck. Very strong, and very well built. Easiest way to get it is through EE, which is automatic great customer service. I would say it is more in the category of an ARB, (SG, RW, RTE being better) but I like the looks of the TJM so much more than the ARB. Just some thoughts... |
Dave_Lucas (Dave_Lucas)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 05:35 pm: |
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RJ,
"I'd imagine the aproach angle is still about 20 times better than stock right?"
I would guess that the 2003 with the new bumper would be close to the ARB or better, anyone want to measure a stock 2003 and an ARB and post the diffrence? |
Brian Dickens (Bri)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 06:01 pm: |
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Whats the best way to measure approach and departure angles?
And another question... what does it mean to have a non-airbag bumper? |
muskyman
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 06:19 pm: |
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a 4 x 8 sheet of plywood and an angle finder will show you aprox. approach angle.
slide the long side of the plywood under the tires till it stops lift the plywood till it hits the bumper...measure the angle
non-airbag means that your vehicle no longer transfers energy at the same rate as it did before to the inertia sencsors of the air-bag |
Brian Dickens (Bri)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 06:40 pm: |
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So does this mean that likely your airbags will be prematurely activated? Any way to disable the airbags? |
RJ Clayton (Tozovr)
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 07:26 pm: |
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I will measure the diff in angle with an ARB and stock on Georges '00 this Sat or sun when we instal his new ARB.
I'll take pics as well.
RJ |
Kai Dussling (Kai)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 05:26 pm: |
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 |
Clif Ashley (Cta586)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 05:29 pm: |
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Is that the TO or BP? |
Kai Dussling (Kai)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 05:33 pm: |
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That's my Trek Outfitters with 9000i.
About $950 pre - shipping.
I have a better approach photo i will post later.
Kai |
Kai Dussling (Kai)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 05:35 pm: |
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Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 05:43 pm: |
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Ross, from my experience here's my take...
Rockware - From what I've seen they make nice stuff but I don't think they make much for the 1999-2003 Discovery II
SafariGard - Looks nice but WAY too expensive for something you'll need to pound and grind to fit your vehicle. Very poor tolerances when building them. I've helped install one and have seen them on D2's used on trails. My 2 cents is there is much better out there and at 1/2 the cost. Don't bother with them unless you like the looks of it and don't mind spending the money (read: functional, expensive poseur bumper). No offense to D2's out there that have them. They were one of the first to offer a bumper for the D2.
ARB - solid bumper but the crush cans are a real weak point. Plus as others have already said the aproach angle is as bad as stock.... okay just a little better than stock. The winch mount point is too low and you'll often have to dig out the winch cable just to use it. I have this bumper but picked it up when they were the only game for D2's. The non-airbag ARB's for the D1 were okay but you have a D2 so it's a different story.
Rovertym - I haven't seen the D2 bumper from Rovertym in action yet but from what I've seen of their products it should be one to consider. Once I get a few other things done to my Disco I plan on replacing the ARB with a Rovertym. |
Marc M (Mosi)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 05:47 pm: |
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I will post pics of another alternative once I get it mounted tonight. |
Clif Ashley (Cta586)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 05:48 pm: |
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What might that be...? |
Ross Thoma (Rossthoma)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 06:05 pm: |
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Al Oliveira
That is the kinda feed back that I am looking for. Thanks to everyone who replied and to those who have read and not replied, pipe up, you might point out something that we haven't thought of.
rt |
Myktoolbox (Myktoolbox)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 06:35 pm: |
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"What might that be...?"
OOOH, I know, I Know!! But I don't want to poop on Mosi's parade.
MH |
Marc M (Mosi)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 06:56 pm: |
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Okay... here it is!! Nice and mounted... on the garage floor! =) http://www.pnwx.net/disco_pics/120-2099_IMG.JPG
The 2nd RTE (besides the proto) DSII bumper. It's the blade with brush bar. I feel like a 5 year old at Christmas time! More pics later!
Mosi |
Clif Ashley (Cta586)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 07:26 pm: |
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Wow, thats really nice. Is that tab in the middle for a skid? Love to see some mounted pics when you get around to it. If you dont mind... what did you cost you? |
Chris
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 09:03 pm: |
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I've got an ARB on my 02 and I like it a lot. I've got an 8000lb Warn winch and the set up works fine. The approach angle is'nt that big of a deal for me becuase I've got an OME lift with 267/75 tires. One thing that I did not see mentioned here though is the fact that you are not supposed to use a Hi lift jack with the ARB due to the crush cans. I don't know if that's important to you but I was dissapointed when I found out I could'nt use a jack on it. Even though ARB sells a hi lift adaptor it does not work on a DII or your 03. Just FYI. |
Al Oliveira (Offroaddisco)
| | Posted on Friday, September 20, 2002 - 09:08 pm: |
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Chris... I have the OME setup up and 265/75's and an X9 winch too. There are better choices out there that will give you better angles.
As for the Hi-Lift, I've used it plenty of times on the front bumper. Just be sure you have everything tight. If I get around to it I may weld a plate onto the crush cans to keep them from moving but the hi-lift doesn't seem to affect it much. And think about it. Your vehicle weighs about 5,000lbs... 6,000 with lots of gear. If your ARB bumper can't deal with that how will it hold up to a 8,000 - 12,000 lb winch? |
Marc M (Mosi)
| | Posted on Saturday, September 21, 2002 - 12:34 am: |
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M'kay! Here they are! I even did the install all by my lonesome... gimmee BEER NOW!
I still have to hard mount the winch control box and get the fairlead on.
http://www.pnwx.net/disco_pics/120-2100_IMG.JPG
http://www.pnwx.net/disco_pics/121-2101_IMG.JPG
http://www.pnwx.net/disco_pics/121-2102_IMG.JPG
http://www.pnwx.net/disco_pics/121-2103_IMG.JPG
Here are the aproach angle numbers:
Stock is 31
With my old ARB airbag bumper and 265/75s, 2" lift and yadda yadda yadda: 29.5
Same tires and lift and new RTE bumper: 44! SWEET!
Mosi |
Roger Fastring
| | Posted on Saturday, September 21, 2002 - 09:30 am: |
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How much did that new RTE cost? Looks great. What about a weight estimate of ARB vs RTE? This bumpers not on RTEs website yet correct? |
Myktoolbox (Myktoolbox)
| | Posted on Saturday, September 21, 2002 - 09:50 am: |
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thats the cleanest garage i've ever seen 
nice bumper mosi. take some more pics ASAP (on the trail) and post them up. i want to see that bad boy doing its thing.
mike holmes |
Marc M (Mosi)
| | Posted on Saturday, September 21, 2002 - 11:01 am: |
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The cost is the same as the DI bumpers... I paid $750. I picked up both bumper while they were on the ground and I am estimating that the RTE weighs about 30lbs more. The nice thing is that since the weight sits closer to the body with the winch, it doesn't seems to sag the front end of the truck as bad as it did with the ARB set up.
Mike,
You know I will get some tasty pics going next week when I am in Moab
Mosi |
Chris C.
| | Posted on Saturday, September 21, 2002 - 03:18 pm: |
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Al -
I have thought about it. I've also talked to ARB. The answer is simple. The bumper is designed to be able to handle the 8000Lb + stress of being pulled, not lifted. There is a big difference in the two forces.
You can lift your vehicle by the bumper if you want to, you can also nail your balls to a burning board. It's just not recommended.
And yes - there are better set ups out there but in my opinion answering Ross' original question the ARB / ome / 265 bla bla combo works very well. It compliments an already outstanding vehicle that can outperform most drivers. |
Ross Thoma (Rossthoma)
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 02:09 pm: |
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Thanks for all the input.
Just finished ordering a RTE front bumper and skid plate. Woo Hoo
It should arrive in 4-6 wks. Just when the excitement of ordering dies down I will have the happyness of installing it.
Stock market may be crap but as you can see LIFE IS GOOD!!!!
 |
Ross Thoma (Rossthoma)
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 02:10 pm: |
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Thanks for all the input.
Just finished ordering a RTE front bumper and skid plate. Woo Hoo
It should arrive in 4-6 wks. Just when the excitement of ordering dies down I will have the happyness of installing it.
Stock market may be crap but as you can see LIFE IS GOOD!!!!
|
Devin Walton
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 24, 2002 - 05:42 pm: |
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Mosi,
I'm lookin' at ordering the same bumper and I'm wondering what method you used for relocating the washer fluid tank. I think I see it stuffed back in there in the hood open shot, but I'm curious on details.
Thanks,
Devin |
Marc M (Mosi)
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 11:20 am: |
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Devin,
I used a radiator overflow bottle like Greg Davis did. He has a better pic in his folder on the DSII Yahoo group (if you are a member). Just drilled new holes in the bottle and popped the motors in using the stock grommets. You will need to add some rubber tubing and splice some wiring in for the added length. I haven't gotten around to securing it with a permanent solution yet, but it's held in place with a few well placed zip ties. |
Devin Walton
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 11:32 am: |
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Thanks for the info. Greg just e-mailed a pic of his set-up, too. |
Kevin Ta (Smalls)
| | Posted on Friday, September 27, 2002 - 01:03 am: |
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What do you guys think of the rte bumper with the A bar instead of the full brush bar, i dunno how much the popping out A bar interferes with some obstacles so was just wondering what y'all think. |
Ross Thoma (Rossthoma)
| | Posted on Friday, September 27, 2002 - 01:24 am: |
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That is the one I ordered the, A bar that is. I like the look of it better, not so blocky, but you don't get the protection from the brush on the tight trails.
It's a trade off but my ford seemed to have held up fine for the last 7 years in the Alberta back trails and I think the turning radius is not so good as to knock the A-Bar since it juts out from the bumper only a few inches or so.
my 2 cents.
RT |
Joshua Weinstein (Untrakd)
| | Posted on Friday, September 27, 2002 - 01:37 am: |
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ah, how bout this one?
 |
Carter Simcoe (Carter)
| | Posted on Friday, September 27, 2002 - 01:38 am: |
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Ross, your dealership is going to think you are insane when you bring it in for its first scheduled maintenance opointment |
Jroc (Jroc)
| | Posted on Friday, September 27, 2002 - 09:27 am: |
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Nice Joshua, who makes that one? |
Carter Simcoe (Carter)
| | Posted on Saturday, September 28, 2002 - 12:03 am: |
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Looks like a rovertym with the top part of an ARB welded on top. Am I right??? |
Dave_Lucas (Dave_Lucas)
| | Posted on Saturday, September 28, 2002 - 12:09 am: |
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Josh,
Did you get the mount that you bent on behind the rocks fixed yet? |
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