Enough of the bullshit. Let's talk home theater speakers. I haven't had a system for a bit and am now in the process of putting something together again. I'd like the thoughts of some of the audio nerds here. Are there any decent in wall speakers, or am I better off using good book shelf style + a sub?
Make my home theater great again
- Thread starter bigred
- Start date
Bose. Or, if you hate the thought Klipsch for budget, Harmon kardon for big money. Mcintosh if you are feeling a big bonus is on the way.
I'd like to hear more about wireless stuff if anyone has tried it out. Hope that's okay with you red.
Buy some JL Audio subs so I can live vicariously through you. They are so expensive, but I bet they're almost worth it.
Oh, dear.
A very large part of what makes a speaker work is the enclosure.
Some in-wall speakers are just raw speakers you hang in a hole in the drywall; this is less than optimal.
If you're going with in-wall speakers, you'll be happier with the sound quality if there's an enclosure inside the wall.
Frankly, I don't know if such a thing exists, I don't do permanent install work.
A properly tuned enclosure can boost levels at certain frequencies, giving vocals (for example) a little extra punch.
This is primarily driven by budget.
You can get some inexpensive stuff that will sound OK.
You can spend a king's ransom and your TV room will be amazing.
You probably want to land between those two extremes; you can continue to throw money at it, and with meters and scopes and things, you can tell the difference, but at some point, you won't notice it.
If you're mounting speakers, make sure the mounts are solid as hell. No drywall anchors, none of those pop-out umbrella thru the drywall things. Hit the studs, and bolt it like it matters.
Be aware that, although a sub is "non-directional", putting a sub against the wall WILL result in less than optimal results. The sonic energy radiating from the back of the enclosure will bounce off the back wall (assuming it's a solid wall, like concrete) and (possibly) interfere with the energy from the front of the enclosure, which can, under certain circumstances, cancel out certain frequencies.
Acoustically, the perfect spot for a sub is the center of the space.
Here in real life, that's rarely possible.
There are techniques for shaping the sub pattern, most of which involve multiple cabinets, phase reversal, digital delay and very specific spacing between the matched cabinets.
Or, you could just put a sub over there out of sight, and it'll be just fine.
Budget? I haven't dialed it in yet. I have a Polk sub that I'd like to keep using. Hoping I can get the rest of the speakers for less than 2k. It will be mostly movies. Music will be almost everything but country. Source will be satellite, cd, and turntable. Medium sized family room that is open on one side to the kitchen. Also, Atmos - good or hype? And no Bose please.
Oh, dear.
A very large part of what makes a speaker work is the enclosure.
Some in-wall speakers are just raw speakers you hang in a hole in the drywall; this is less than optimal.
If you're going with in-wall speakers, you'll be happier with the sound quality if there's an enclosure inside the wall.
Frankly, I don't know if such a thing exists, I don't do permanent install work.
A properly tuned enclosure can boost levels at certain frequencies, giving vocals (for example) a little extra punch.
This is primarily driven by budget.
You can get some inexpensive stuff that will sound OK.
You can spend a king's ransom and your TV room will be amazing.
You probably want to land between those two extremes; you can continue to throw money at it, and with meters and scopes and things, you can tell the difference, but at some point, you won't notice it.
If you're mounting speakers, make sure the mounts are solid as hell. No drywall anchors, none of those pop-out umbrella thru the drywall things. Hit the studs, and bolt it like it matters.
Be aware that, although a sub is "non-directional", putting a sub against the wall WILL result in less than optimal results. The sonic energy radiating from the back of the enclosure will bounce off the back wall (assuming it's a solid wall, like concrete) and (possibly) interfere with the energy from the front of the enclosure, which can, under certain circumstances, cancel out certain frequencies.
Acoustically, the perfect spot for a sub is the center of the space.
Here in real life, that's rarely possible.
There are techniques for shaping the sub pattern, most of which involve multiple cabinets, phase reversal, digital delay and very specific spacing between the matched cabinets.
Or, you could just put a sub over there out of sight, and it'll be just fine.
So, are you saying not to mess with an in wall installation? Is it the variable air space (from the space in the wall) vs. the specific air space in a sealed enclosure that makes the difference?
If you can get in-wall speakers that have an enclosure behind them, get those.
Otherwise, you are moving air in the wall cavity.
I'm fairly certain I've never seen a speaker cabinet that was 7.5' tall, 4" deep, and 14" wide.
Yes, it is exactly the known air space in the cabinet vs. the unknown space in the wall.
On the other hand, unless you invite Kennith over, very few people would notice. :rofl:
I get that surface mount isn't as cool looking as flush mount.
If you put the wires inside the wall, it'll be prettier.
Speaking of wires, use the biggest damn cable you can find; 12ga works well.
Smaller wires means you're pissing away more of your amplifier power just getting the signal to the speaker.
Polarity is important.
And for the love of dog, if you're feeling inclined to buy Monster Cable, let me know.
I'll be happy to sell you some $4 cable for $63.
What will be displaying the visual content?
Projection, LCD/LED monitor, a 19" black & white console TV with rabbit ears?
As you have probably noticed, DirecTV compresses the ever-loving shit out of the video signal.
It stands to reason they compress the shit out of the audio signal, too.
I've SEEN the video compression, I haven't HEARD the audio compression. Me. Personally.
Kennith has probably measured it, and he ought to be popping into this thread any minute now.
<< IN MY OPINION >>
Bluray and 4K content makes it worth spending money on high-end gear, satellite TV does NOT make it worthwhile.
If all you're doing is watching satellite TV, spend about $200 at Costco on a "surround sound receiver" that comes with half a dozen little speakers and call it good.
If you can get in-wall speakers that have an enclosure behind them, get those.
Otherwise, you are moving air in the wall cavity.
I'm fairly certain I've never seen a speaker cabinet that was 7.5' tall, 4" deep, and 14" wide.
Yes, it is exactly the known air space in the cabinet vs. the unknown space in the wall.
On the other hand, unless you invite Kennith over, very few people would notice. :rofl:
I get that surface mount isn't as cool looking as flush mount.
If you put the wires inside the wall, it'll be prettier.
Speaking of wires, use the biggest damn cable you can find; 12ga works well.
Smaller wires means you're pissing away more of your amplifier power just getting the signal to the speaker.
Polarity is important.
And for the love of dog, if you're feeling inclined to buy Monster Cable, let me know.
I'll be happy to sell you some $4 cable for $63.
What will be displaying the visual content?
Projection, LCD/LED monitor, a 19" black & white console TV with rabbit ears?
As you have probably noticed, DirecTV compresses the ever-loving shit out of the video signal.
It stands to reason they compress the shit out of the audio signal, too.
I've SEEN the video compression, I haven't HEARD the audio compression. Me. Personally.
Kennith has probably measured it, and he ought to be popping into this thread any minute now.
<< IN MY OPINION >>
Bluray and 4K content makes it worth spending money on high-end gear, satellite TV does NOT make it worthwhile.
If all you're doing is watching satellite TV, spend about $200 at Costco on a "surround sound receiver" that comes with half a dozen little speakers and call it good.
Our TV is DirecTV, but most of the content that I'll care about, quality wise, will be Bluray. We currently have a LCD monitor that's a few years old but I feel like an upgrade is due. That will be a different thread. Yeah, where's Kenneth??
I've gotten my cables from Blue Jeans mostly.
What brand of speakers should I be looking at?
There's the classic brands with their traditional products that excel in fit and finish, and tend to have a signature sound, but are expensive. Then there's the new products by classic brands and new brands that both focus on value. I'll focus on the latter.
I don't have much time so here's two to check out:
R5Bi - Incredible value and sound, good looks.
https://rbhsound.com/r5bi.php
Big fan of SVS subs, and their Prime speaker line excels as well.
https://www.svsound.com/products/prime-bookshelf
Both options have matching centers. Like most things, there are diminishing returns as price scales.
I don't have much time so here's two to check out:
R5Bi - Incredible value and sound, good looks.
https://rbhsound.com/r5bi.php
Big fan of SVS subs, and their Prime speaker line excels as well.
https://www.svsound.com/products/prime-bookshelf
Both options have matching centers. Like most things, there are diminishing returns as price scales.
I meant Ultras, not Primes.
https://www.svsound.com/products/ultra-bookshelf
You might be surprised how well the RBH speakers compete sound-wise with much more expensive options. If you're looking for speakers with more furniture grade construction look at RBH's other product lines, and from KEF, Wharfedale, Paradigm, Klipsch, ELAC, Jamo, Dali, Jamo, Martin Logan, etc.
https://www.svsound.com/products/ultra-bookshelf
You might be surprised how well the RBH speakers compete sound-wise with much more expensive options. If you're looking for speakers with more furniture grade construction look at RBH's other product lines, and from KEF, Wharfedale, Paradigm, Klipsch, ELAC, Jamo, Dali, Jamo, Martin Logan, etc.
I'm still rocking my Sony STR DA4ES with Boston Acoustic 940's (2 front 2 rear) with matching 930 center channel and 9somethingorother side channel speakers. My sub is tired Acoustic Research. Not sure what BA is offering now but they may be worth a look. Since they are made to work with each other they are pretty balanced.
I work with "professional" stuff, so I don't have direct experience with reasonably priced gear.
Pretty much all of our stuff has cabinets made of birch plywood, minimum 9-ply, damn close to no voids.
Happily, I am not personally paying for any of this stuff.
I suppose I could, in the proper spirit of DWeb, suggest brands I know nothing about, talk about shit I heard some guy say his brother has, etc...
That's exactly what I'm looking for.
Or you could drop off some scratch n dent pro stuff at my house.
Ha!
I didn't have room for it, but we just got rid of
(4) EAW KF-300 bi-ampable tops
(2) EAW SB-330 18" driver subs
(2) EAW JF-100 (mid-size center fill cabinets)
(2) EAW JF-80 (nice monitors)
QSC tri-amp rack & processor, 14,000 watts total power
plus a handful of other amps, smallest was 500w/ch, biggest was 2.4Kw/ch
all the speakon cable to set it all up
All the speakers & amps were in road cases, too.
I was a sad boy.
To the good, all that was replaced with
(6) powered EV ELX115P cabinets (1000w each)
(2) EV ELX118P powered subs (700w each)
and for slightly larger spaces
(6) JBL VRX932 line array tops (1600w low, 150w high)
(2) JBL VRX918SP subs (1500w each)
The ElectroVoice products surprised me; they didn't used to make nice stuff.
And the JBL line array is just happy-making.
With the powered cabinets, all my outs can run up my digital snake (64x16 channels, on a single piece of CAT6 cable), instead of having to run NL-4 12ga all over the place.
I'm sure there's some audiophiles out there that will tell me how much JBL sucks.
What-the-fuck-ever.
getting 2 subs instead of 1 big one just doesn't work that way.
you won't notice it until you move through the space, but 2 subs placed (let's say) 10 feet apart create a comb interference pattern.
I read the engineering documents from Meyer Sound, I didn't read it on the internet, so I'm probably wrong.
