DII Steering inaccuracy, not wobbles, not shimmy

[robertofollia]

Hi all, just to make a long story short, my 99 DII v8 5 speeder wants to kill me after driving me crazy. At 50-60 Mph (or between 80-100 Kmph), whenever I step on the gas pedal or back off the throttle, the truck changes lane in less than 2 seconds (i floor the gas pedal, in 2 secs changes lane; i back off the pedal and in 2 seconds comes back to the lane) both in a straight line and in a highway bend. Have been living with this for 1 1/2 years and have performed the following repairs/upgrades to no avail, and lately things have worsened a little bit, as when coasting it seems as if the truck front end was drunk.

-All bushings and suspension components are 1 1/2 years old (even the rear watts linkage ones)
-Steering bars, drag links, track rod and its ends are 3 months old, and are nice and tight
-Tires are 1 1/2 years old, properly balanced
-Steering is balanced. Steering feedback is perfect, no wobbles, no shimmy, no shaking, better than new (when I changed drag links and TREs)
-I lifted the front axle and could not feel any play both in bearings and ball joints.

Please point me what to look at before I set fire to it. The only suspect parts might be the steering balljoints in axle and front bearings, and the worst new is I will have to take it to the stealership, as I 've taken a look at the Rave and balljoint renewal is quite a PITA and no local workshop wants to mess with D2s particular issues.

My D2 is now 75K miles old so far.

Thanks for your input and happy Sunday to you
Regards from the other side of the pond
Robert

 

[MUSKYMAN]

bad control arm bushings

 

[robertofollia]

Sorry, I forgot.
Last week I checked the control arm bushes with a pry bar adn they were nice and tight. Bolts were tight as well, and bushes were replaced 1 1/2 years ago together with the rest of the suspension bushes.

What I did not check was the control arm bracket. Being one of the earliest ones (build date 12/1998), hope it is not fractured...

Best regards from the other side of the pond
Robert

 

[mkebruiser]

steering shaft from the steering wheel to gear box?

 

[p m]

steering shaft from the steering wheel to gear box?

How is that affected by throttle application?

 

[KyleT]

what bushings did you replace them with? (rubber, poly OEM???)

adjust the steering box play?

Alignment?

 

[landrovergeek]

Hi all, just to make a long story short, my 99 DII v8 5 speeder wants to kill me after driving me crazy. At 50-60 Mph (or between 80-100 Kmph), whenever I step on the gas pedal or back off the throttle, the truck changes lane in less than 2 seconds (i floor the gas pedal, in 2 secs changes lane; i back off the pedal and in 2 seconds comes back to the lane) both in a straight line and in a highway bend. Have been living with this for 1 1/2 years and have performed the following repairs/upgrades to no avail, and lately things have worsened a little bit, as when coasting it seems as if the truck front end was drunk.

-All bushings and suspension components are 1 1/2 years old (even the rear watts linkage ones)
-Steering bars, drag links, track rod and its ends are 3 months old, and are nice and tight
-Tires are 1 1/2 years old, properly balanced
-Steering is balanced. Steering feedback is perfect, no wobbles, no shimmy, no shaking, better than new (when I changed drag links and TREs)
-I lifted the front axle and could not feel any play both in bearings and ball joints.

Please point me what to look at before I set fire to it. The only suspect parts might be the steering balljoints in axle and front bearings, and the worst new is I will have to take it to the stealership, as I 've taken a look at the Rave and balljoint renewal is quite a PITA and no local workshop wants to mess with D2s particular issues.

My D2 is now 75K miles old so far.

Thanks for your input and happy Sunday to you
Regards from the other side of the pond
Robert

What kind of tires? Lift if any?

I have a 99 D2 with 2 in Rovertym Lift. My Nitto Terra Grapplers were pulling all over the place with braking or acceleration. Checked the entire front end with no issues found.

Switched to BFG T/A KO's... no problems since.

Morale of the story, it may be the tires.

 

[mkebruiser]

How is that affected by throttle application?

check everything, assume nothing. only know . anything else?

 

[p m]

check everything, assume nothing. only know . anything else?

okay, I buy that.
OP - check if you have any stored error codes in ECU, that your lights work, and your vehicle registration is current.

 

[robertofollia]

Thanks all for your input
-Steering shaft is ok.
-All bushes were renewed with OEM ones, i had read many horror stories with polys allowing moisture to creep in and eating the steel.
-Stg box is perfect.
-Tires were the same as OEM, the 18"pirellis scorpion STs, and pressures are spot-on.
-At first everything was nice and smooth
. After the drag link and TREs renewal everything went as well as oiled spagghetti.
-15 days later a slight shimmy appeared. The TREs and drag link ends locknuts had loosened a bit. The workshop had not tightened them enough. I retightened and the problem went away.

After some offroading it appeared again, the auto-lane-change, darg links and TREs were nice and tight, and control arm as well.
After last weekend, the auto-lane worsened, it was less progressive and more brisk-abrupt, as if something had loosened, that's why I checked everything and left that post.

My leaf sprung series 88 in did something like that, and it was the front left bearing, which unladen and wheels lifted had virtually no play, once on the ground was difficult to notice, and on motion was terrible.
Today I will make a gorilla with toothache torque the control arm and will report the results.

P M
I personally replaced the bushings, all them, it was the tipical simptom of one of the front ones (the right one ) giving up the ghost, but the bushes are perfect. Will shine the best torch today to watch, but it's so odd. Off roading was very gentle, there was no hiper-mega-articulation to make one bush fail. Will report what I find.

Best regards and thanks again from the other side of the pond

Robert

 

[p m]

Well...
One thing I can think of is aftermarket bushings' steel inserts being of incorrect length (shorter by a little), not allowing the retaining nuts to compress the bushings.

 

[robertofollia]

Hi there,
just came from the workshop. Bolts checked for tightness- ok. The gorilla came in -with toothache- and tried to torque them. They were ok

All bushings checked- ok

Went for a spin around the workshop, the mechanic panicked when in 3rd gear we changed lane automatically in less than 50 meters. I guess it is the right lower ball joint (the crappy-sealed-for-life-pseudo-swivel-joint) which is a PITA to remove.

I forgot to tell you but this weekend, when doing gentle off roading, some times steering became a little bit stiffer, so I guess it will be the balljoints, but I will double check on wednesday.

I told my local workshop I don't wanna be cruel to them and comission them to renew my balljoints, which is almost a stealership job. He told me he has developed an extractor for jeep cherokees, whose layout is similar, by modifying an old mercedes balljoint puller. I promise to get some photos here as soon as I have them, if I succeed.

It was getting dark and they wanted to close (it's 8 pm here now) so on wednesday (tomorrow is national holiday) I will go back to check where the free play is (bearing or balljoint).

And of course will post any news so you can avoid the huge money pit I've experienced from march 2009 (all bushings, tires, drag links, ACE modulator packed up, diff seal blew, HG job, diff seal blew again, and afterwards the front one blew as well,..) all it with the wandering-all-over-the-place syndrome.

Another typical Rover thing. Am I a massochist or what.

Best regards from the other side of the pond
Robert

 

[robertofollia]

FOUND!!!!

The rear left radius arm to chassis bush had collapsed. After 15 months only... It was aftermarket, but the rest are ok.

At least I've saved the ball-joint-replacement-bill.

Had to use an elevator and 3 people who moved the wheel. The bush integrity could not be checked with a pry bar as the movement split were only to be seen from under the car and in the inner part of the frame rails. <from outside the bush is in perfect shape.

So thanks all for you input. I've booked the ramps for next Tuesday and we'll atack it.

At last my Disco will go in a straight line.

Best regards from the other side of the pond and happy Thursday to everyone
Robert

 

[robertofollia]

Some more update,
collapsed rear bushes changed (the originals were from the "blue box" and I asked the replacement weren't of the same origin, but... I think the seller just chnaged package... anyway, they seem better manufactured).
-HD steering bars and darg links with replaceable ball joints added
-But... still went that way, thing improved a little bit but on braking it still went to the right and on accelerating a little bit to the left.
-After that some of the blue box bushes (fitted to the front) were found collapsing, so replaced, and as I did not want to prolong an alleatory ride, I renewed steering ball joints.

I guess bushes will have to be renewed soon by some OEM from a known source, I don't want to fit any substandard rubber under my truck....

Thanks all for your inputs and advice.
Nowww. on the serach for some suitable alternative to RBX101730 raius arm to chassis bush which does-not-collapse-in-6-months (doing highway driving mainly)

Anybody tried Polybushes (original) new design? seems to be a one-piece as OEM but poly.

so far:
-Original: 10 years and 70k miles
-blue box: less than 1,5 years, and bad handling since month 6.
-Replacement (asked another source but.. i guess it's blue box as well) now on their way out again...

Best regards from Spain

Robert