Discovery 1 - Help me build a no/minimal lift OEM+ spring/shock upgrade

[_ExpeditionMan]

All,

I want to source a high quality OEM+ spring/shock combination for a '96 D1 which sees offroad use, but requires extensive highway driving on trips. Think Camel Trophy truck ride height as a good approximation. The truck will carry a front ARB/winch combination (synthetic line), a rear steel bumper, and be loaded with between 100-600lbs of people/gear. I want a near stock-ish ride height with good ride control and the ability to run 245/75r16 or potentially 7.50r16 tires. Ideally, I want 0" to no more than 1" of lift to preserve the stock suspension geometries, access to my/public garages, and reduce the vehicle's center of gravity. My truck already has a camel cut in the rear.

I see some interesting offerings from the KING Springs in the Coil spring database but have no experience with their products. Also interested in opinions on matching dampening from the Shock database.

How would you build an OEM+ lift kit for your Discovery 1?

 

[robertf]

are you opposed to spacers? Its easy to lift the front with OEM springs, there is not a factory spring that will lift the rear the amount you want and maintain the ability to haul stuff.

I am running NRC4305s up front with an inner helper spring in the back. This is pretty close to the the setup that camel trophy discos used. They had a nrc2119 on one side. It leaned pretty bad with that setup, maybe a v8 thing. I replaced it with a 4305 and all is good.


You can read about the inner helper spring here:

Carmichael / Camel helper spring

Common sense would be to slap a set of OME springs in the back, but I want to give this a shot. Camel discos used an inner helper spring like a Defender 130. What I know so far is that Carmichael fire engine company supplied the spring that they used off their 6 wheel drive range rover...

discoweb.org

 

[_ExpeditionMan]

are you opposed to spacers? Its easy to lift the front with OEM springs, there is not a factory spring that will lift the rear the amount you want and maintain the ability to haul stuff.

I am running NRC4305s up front with an inner helper spring in the back. This is pretty close to the the setup that camel trophy discos used. They had a nrc2119 on one side. It leaned pretty bad with that setup, maybe a v8 thing. I replaced it with a 4305 and all is good.


You can read about the inner helper spring here:

Carmichael / Camel helper spring

Common sense would be to slap a set of OME springs in the back, but I want to give this a shot. Camel discos used an inner helper spring like a Defender 130. What I know so far is that Carmichael fire engine company supplied the spring that they used off their 6 wheel drive range rover...

discoweb.org

View attachment 65629

That's interesting, although what I really want to accomplish is as minimal a lift as possible while upping the spring rate to deal with the increased constant load. A spring spacer will lift the truck and mitigate the laden sag (which is why I think you suggested it), but will not increase the spring rate. In that scenario, I'm worried the truck will be lifted slightly and undersprung for the load.

I'll have to read more about the helper spring link you listed, thanks for sharing.

My immediate thought is the following OEM springs (mostly from D110, D110HD, D130) would work. But what I need to know is if the diameter of either the individual coil or overall spring will not work with the D1 axle carrier. The coil spring database suggests only the REAR D110 and D130 springs are a different overall diameter and therefore incompatible. The real question is can rear springs be used on the FRONT axle carrier. *edit* yes, rear to front works, referred to as a cheap bastard lift.

Front OEM+ Consideration (Part #, Vehicle(s), Axle, LengthRate):

Stock was 133 lbf/in and 16.44 in max length

NRC8044	D110	Front left	15.13	155/215^	9^
NRC8045	D110	Front right	14.49	155/215^	9^
NRC9448	D110 HD, D130	Front drivers side	15.31	225	8
NRC9449	D110 HD, D130	Front passenger side	14.8	225	8

Rear OEM+ Consideration (Part #, Vehicle(s), Axle, LengthRate):

Stock was 150 lbf/in (measured at 215 lbf/in) with length of 15.13"

NTC8572	Disco JA015479 - KA038877	Rear PS (LHD) Both (RHD)	16.34	200/330^^	9.5
NRC9462	D90 HD	Rear drivers side	15.25	210/240^	9.2
NRC9463	D90 HD	Rear passenger side	14.81	210/240^	9.2
NRC9448	D90	Rear	15.31	225	8

*Edit* someone measured the D90HD rear springs.

NRC9462/3

 

[special ed]

No need to re invent the wheel. Your not doing anything out of the norm. Most lifts start and end right where you are looking for going. OME springs and shocks, Probably medium duty will keep you around stockish height with that weight. HD will get you a good 1.5 to 2" lift. 265-75-16 tires fit beautifully and you will have the Go To setup with a good ride.

 

[_ExpeditionMan]

No need to re invent the wheel. Your not doing anything out of the norm. Most lifts start and end right where you are looking for going. OME springs and shocks, Probably medium duty will keep you around stockish height with that weight. HD will get you a good 1.5 to 2" lift. 265-75-16 tires fit beautifully and you will have the Go To setup with a good ride.

You think the medium duty OME rears will handle that weight when fully kitted?

Is there an alternate solution with a different brand of shocks which might perform better... or am I chasing such a slim performance improvement that it's irrelevant

 

[robertf]

it really sounds like you are after rear air bag helpers and stock springs

 

[Greg_M]

Airbags?

aftermarket airbag coil spring "helpers"

has anyone installed aftermarket air bags for towing in their coil sprung D2? if so, what brand and were you happy with the product?

discoweb.org

 

[kris812]

Just my 2 cents of input, I put on 2"TF medium springs.

Rover sagged to the passenger (right) a lot. RL spring was longer than RR on both old stock and new springs.

Ended up adding 1" spring spacer on the RR to get level. So it's probably closer to 3" lift now.

If I bought new springs, I'd make sure those rears are the same length! Maybe get HD springs and ditch the sway bars altogether.

 

[outono]

That's my Coil Spring Database (with the first chunk of data built by Red90)

I have King Springs. I love them and the ride height is 40mm. KRFR-03T in the FRONT, KRRR-04T in the REAR. I think it gives you a modest look with 235/85R16 tires.

The Kings are being phased out so its very difficult to find all the models. You can track down a few on Ebay still...

 

[ERover82]

Looks like NTC3285 and NRC8113 would do what you want in the rear.

 

[robertf]

this ones got 4305s up front and 8572 with a 1" spacer in the back. loaded with a weeks worth of stuff

 

[special ed]

Your not building anything extreme just an overland rig. Why not just go with whats proven and works for what you are doing. Your not loading or doing anything different than most setups run. You say you dont want a big lift, fine go with OME springs and either OME shocks and if you want better or upgrade go with Bilstein or Fox shocks. Remember there are things that need to be done even going with fox shocks that you will not account for like spring dislocation, longer shocks means possible longer brake lines and spring retainers... its an endless pit once you go out of what is proven to work. I set up an articulation track on my ranch to test different cars as we build and find flaws. For most a standard spring and shock kit work perfect but i like to build suspensions to move and articulate. Articulation = traction. Sorry this leads in a different direction but think about what performance you want on the back side.

You noted you didnt want a big lift but lift equals load resistance. You want a 1-2" lift then medium duty, you want a solid 2" lift then HD. there are options and intermixing you can do as well to get exactly what you are looking for and spacers can be used to correct and level. Many run HD rear and either a HD front with a 1" spacer or a medium duty rear spring on the front. You might find for your setup you will do it and something it not perfect you adjust from there and maybe try a different component but i would start with what works for most and go from there. One thing about Rovers is every ones build is a little different, personalized and unique.

 

[special ed]

This is an example of what a 2.5-3" OME spring lift can do. She can also tow a 5000lb trailer fully loaded over extremely rough terrain.

Robertf is correct with stockish springs and airbag installed in the rear springs to help with load. I would go with a medium duty setup and work from there.

 

[Blueboy]

This is a nice kit:

 

[_ExpeditionMan]

That's my Coil Spring Database (with the first chunk of data built by Red90)

I have King Springs. I love them and the ride height is 40mm. KRFR-03T in the FRONT, KRRR-04T in the REAR. I think it gives you a modest look with 235/85R16 tires.

The Kings are being phased out so its very difficult to find all the models. You can track down a few on Ebay still...

View attachment 65630

View attachment 65631

Oh I'm definitely aware of your work to compile this stuff and I've squirreled away a lot of it! Remind me which shock pairing you went with? What is the advantage of the tapered progressive over the progressive version? My initial take is the tapered progressive spring rate increases with compression in a linear fashion while the standard progressive is more of a step function. If this is true then I could see why tapered progressive would be advantageous for off-roading.

Right now I'm even considering KRFS-01 (front) and KRRS-04 (rear) for a no lift option. They are certainly proud of the springs ($$$).

 

[_ExpeditionMan]

Looks like NTC3285 and NRC8113 would do what you want in the rear.

For an OEM lift yes I suppose you are correct. Only problem is those springs are nearly 2 inches taller than the stock ones, suggesting they wouldn't truly meet the "no lift" portion of my suspension upgrade. Probably the best option for a OEM only lift though

 

[_ExpeditionMan]

this ones got 4305s up front and 8572 with a 1" spacer in the back. loaded with a weeks worth of stuffView attachment 65632

Do you have any additional pictures of this truck? What was the "total" lift you experienced? And what tire size is it running?

The overall lift looks lower than the standard 2" from OME or TF.

 

[_ExpeditionMan]

Your not building anything extreme just an overland rig. Why not just go with whats proven and works for what you are doing. Your not loading or doing anything different than most setups run. You say you dont want a big lift, fine go with OME springs and either OME shocks and if you want better or upgrade go with Bilstein or Fox shocks. Remember there are things that need to be done even going with fox shocks that you will not account for like spring dislocation, longer shocks means possible longer brake lines and spring retainers... its an endless pit once you go out of what is proven to work. I set up an articulation track on my ranch to test different cars as we build and find flaws. For most a standard spring and shock kit work perfect but i like to build suspensions to move and articulate. Articulation = traction. Sorry this leads in a different direction but think about what performance you want on the back side.

You noted you didnt want a big lift but lift equals load resistance. You want a 1-2" lift then medium duty, you want a solid 2" lift then HD. there are options and intermixing you can do as well to get exactly what you are looking for and spacers can be used to correct and level. Many run HD rear and either a HD front with a 1" spacer or a medium duty rear spring on the front. You might find for your setup you will do it and something it not perfect you adjust from there and maybe try a different component but i would start with what works for most and go from there. One thing about Rovers is every ones build is a little different, personalized and unique.

Thanks for your input here. I certainly recognize a OME lift is the easiest option. I suppose trying for a no lift spring rate increase lift is mostly an exercise in trying something new.

 

[_ExpeditionMan]

This is an example of what a 2.5-3" OME spring lift can do. She can also tow a 5000lb trailer fully loaded over extremely rough terrain.

Robertf is correct with stockish springs and airbag installed in the rear springs to help with load. I would go with a medium duty setup and work from there.


View attachment 65645

Do you know which springs you're running front and rear? The coil spring database has the codes for the many different OME options.

 

[robertf]

Do you have any additional pictures of thise truck? What was the "total" lift you experienced? And what tire size is it running?

The overall lift looks lower than the standard 2"

235 85 16

The rear spring rate is too low for big trips, it squats when loaded down. It will be getting the same helper spring setup as the blue one and losing the 1" spacer