RTE 2" Rear Lift - Shocks?

[LSUDenver]

I know, I know... Search! I have been through more threads about this over the past week than I wanted to read.

Somebody with experience step up... I am putting on a new 2" RTE lift (STOCK TRUCK) and have seen a few comments about the OME n108 shocks not being long enough for the RTE springs in the rear.

Does anyone have any experience with this setup? What other (more lengthier) shock would you recommend?

Thanks gents!

 

[leeawalden]

I have the ome's and wish I would have sprung for the bilsteins

 

[LSUDenver]

I have the ome's and wish I would have sprung for the bilsteins

Why is that Lee? Do they bottom out? Is it a flex issue for you?

 

[Roverfire]

I have a 2" RTE lift and I'm using the N108's in the rear with no problems. When I called RTE they said they would be fine with their 2" lift.

 

[leeawalden]

in the rear, they sit at 19.5 inches, and they only extend to like 23.5 or something of that nature. Also, I will probably go to a 3 inch one day and would like to have already had the shocks. I mean, my buddy runs a 3 inch ome with the same shocks. They ride great, but if you have the slightest bit of a thought of going to a 3 inch, then go bilsteins, and then never worry about bottoming out.

 

[scottjal]

I am going to disagree with about everyone here and say that the OME shocks are not appropriate for a RTE 2" lift. The only thing I can say for them is they come close and you won't have to change ABS and Brake hoses with them. I regard this as the cheap way out.

I did RTE 2" and their SLS lift which I adjusted level to the RTE front 2" springs and my OME N108's in the rear bottom out about everywhere, or is it top out? Anyway they don't extend far enough.

This is my research on the matter:
Stock shocks on a DII
Rear Compressed: 14"
Rear Extended: 22.5"
Stroke: 8.5"

OME N108, not a lot of improvement here.
Compressed: 14.5"
Extended: 23.0"
Stroke: 8.5"

After the lift sitting level I measure 21.75" center to center for those rear shocks, and that is on the normal ride height setting. Their median is 18.75" and I am well outside of that. OME shocks are designed for OME springs which don't net the same height gain as RTE springs do.

Myself I am getting hoses and ABS lines put in next week so I can put on some blistin 5125's.

extended length 29.7"
collapsed length 17.91"
stroke 11.94"
Median 23.88"

So I figure at 21.75" and maybe 22.5" on high ride height setting these things are sitting right in the center happy zone.

I think I might need to extend my bump stops though, I hear bottoming out blistins ruins them.

 

[scottjal]

Damn, my math sucks. I eyeballed those numbers and they looked good so I got those shocks. I went to put them on this weekend and they didn't look at all right, way too long. I made this little chart and I am thinking the 10" travel Bilsteins seem to be more appropriate, wish I did that first. Also very obvious what is wrong with the OME's and the RTE lift.

Any opinions before I spend more money?

 

[Roverfire]

Damn, my math sucks. I eyeballed those numbers and they looked good so I got those shocks. I went to put them on this weekend and they didn't look at all right, way too long. I made this little chart and I am thinking the 10" travel Bilsteins seem to be more appropriate, wish I did that first. Also very obvious what is wrong with the OME's and the RTE lift.

Any opinions before I spend more money?

Which shocks did you get and which ones should you have bought?

 

[scottjal]

Which shocks did you get and which ones should you have bought?

I have OME's, and they top out all the time.

I got the BE5-6249-H5 because the numbers looked close but I missed the collapsed length. With the truck jacked up to take the tire off the shock would almost be bottomed.

I think I should get the BE5-A464-H5. Actually, the BE5-6248-H5 has the firmer valving same lengths.

http://www.raceshock.com/Bilstein/bilstein5125.htm

 

[scottjal]

Better chart.

 

[Lucasd2002]

what spring seat do you have in the rear? D1, D2?

 

[LSUDenver]

Scott, Where are you setting your SLS ride height sensors? I am running mine at just about half way up the slide. That gives me 35" - 35.25" from the ground to the fender well (didn't get under and measure the actual length.)

My RTE front springs put me at 36" with the stock bumper, so I figured getting within an inch is sufficient for the rear.

I put on the OMEs (n108s) in the rear and even tried to bottom them out just on the street with speeding over bumps, etc. Couldn't do it.

It seems like to me with the SLS still in the rear and the shocks you are discussing that you are running a fine line between bottoming them out extended or compressed. I could see if you are running you ride height at max you would probably be up to 36.75" or close and that could cause the issue with the topping out, but what are you going to do when you get any articulation with the longer shocks? Your compressed side would bottom out before you are extended on the other side.

Seems like to me that a happy medium between ride height and shock travel should be the goal.

 

[scottjal]

I have RTE 2" springs in the front. I measured from the top of the fender well to the ground and then adjusted the rear end to have the same measurement. If you look at the truck on level ground it sits level so thats where I set the sensors. If you look at the slot it you could call it 1/3 to 1/2 of the way up.

That is all at the stock ride height setting, the higher setting goes beyond that and you can see the truck sitting higher in the rear.

On my numbers in the chart:
I figure everything is accurate or within a half inch. The bilsteins numbers for center to center collapsed and extended seem to check out when measured but their number on the chart for travel is not right but close, my chart is the calculated (real) number. I measured the center to center for normal ride height but I guesstimated the extended height, I figure the shock sees another 1.25" when you push the button but it might be less. I think I will measure that for real tonight as thats where the real problem is.

I put on the OMEs (n108s) in the rear and even tried to bottom them out just on the street with speeding over bumps, etc. Couldn't do it.

I am assuming you mean topping out the shocks, full extension? Thats what I am dealing with. I can do it going off a big speed bump too fast or easily stepping off a medium curb. Off roading you just hear thud thud thud all the time back there and the bigger ones you really feel the body being brought down quickly.

but what are you going to do when you get any articulation with the longer shocks? Your compressed side would bottom out before you are extended on the other side.

Seems like to me that a happy medium between ride height and shock travel should be the goal.

Exactly sir! Looking at my chart the 10" travel Bilstein seems to fit the truck much better than the 12" that I have.

 

[ausdisco]

the RTE pans out to be 2-1/4" apparently? so.. when you consider the OMEs are for their so called 2" lift (that is actually 1.5" or there abouts) and hear all the top-out stories,and there are a few,i wouldn't do it,i think the OMEs arent much longer than stock if i remember correctly.

 

[KyleT]

Scott,
What about relocating the top shock mount 3-4" higher increase the travel, without needing to add super long bump stops or the threat of over exending the rear bags to get 12" of travel from the rear? I cannot tell if there is enough room because the body would be fairly close to the factory upper mount, but this is the same concept applied on a D1, by Equipe
http://www.equipe4x4.com/inglese/ARTICOLO.php?MARCA=LAND&SEZ=SUSPENSION&PROD=O-SHAPE BRAKET
I have been researching no/low lift with as much travel as reasonably possible.

 

[rtiqulatendisco]

Damn, my math sucks. I eyeballed those numbers and they looked good so I got those shocks. I went to put them on this weekend and they didn't look at all right, way too long. I made this little chart and I am thinking the 10" travel Bilsteins seem to be more appropriate, wish I did that first. Also very obvious what is wrong with the OME's and the RTE lift.

Any opinions before I spend more money?

I'll be selling some used 10inch bilsteins soons. 6100's

 

[scottjal]

KyleT, I believe DI and DII are very different in this area. The upper mount on a DII is welded into the frame and you would have to cut all that off. I looked into it but thats why you don't see any of that stuff listed for a DII.

 

[KyleT]

KyleT, I believe DI and DII are very different in this area. The upper mount on a DII is welded into the frame and you would have to cut all that off. I looked into it but thats why you don't see any of that stuff listed for a DII.

Yeah, I think that would be the only way to acomplish that, cut/grind off the old mount and make a new mount that located the shock further up on the frame as far as it would go without hitting the body/floorpan. I will have to crawl under there again today and take a look at it. I justdont htink 10" travel shocks would be any better with 2" of lift, it is only 1.5" more travel than stock, which is already extremely limited...

another option might be moving the shock mount towards the front of the vehical in the same process, but that would no doubt affect the dampening capabilities of the shock (the angle would affect the leverage ect...).

I have heard that Equipe will be making a new upper rear shock mount for D2's, but that is all I know.

 

[scottjal]

A little update on my shock dilemma.

For the rear I installed a Bilstein BE5-6248-H5.

Valving, Ext Length, Col Length
255/70, 25.93, 15.91

This is about the perfect length and travel for this 2" RTE lift situation. The past weekend I did the BSROA Fall Heritage and I could see the rear flexing much more as it should, seemed to be a big help. Unfortunately the valving is simply WAY too soft and the truck actually bounces, especially at the right speed on highway expansion joints. What really torques me off is Bilstein on their website has a generic chart and on there for full size truck/SUV with two solid axles these shocks are listed as a "soft" ride. They got that right, way too damn soft though.

So now you know why no one here uses 5125's or 5150's, they aren't available in a firmer damping appropriate for our truck.

I broke down and had a nice discussion with Steve at RTE yesterday about my problem and these are the results. As far as the damping goes, his recommendations for the Bilstein 7100 series shocks:

99 = custom 400/100 - Consider for firm or heavy load. Bad news is these are a custom order and not in stock anywhere.
06 = 360/80 ? Steve says nice ride, similar to OME N107/N108. Many out there seem happy with these. If so I will agree, the OME's seem just right damping wise.
04 = 255/70 ? Way too soft, the vehicle WILL bounce. 5125?s aren?t available in higher damping. I can confirm this, I did some 5125?s last weekend.


As far as the shocks themselves this is what he worked out for me:

Rear = AK7110S-06 - 10" travel, schrader valve, no ext tank.
Ext Length, Col Length
26.06, 16.03

Front = AK7110SB-06 - 10" travel, short body shock, external tank.
Ext Length, Col Length
24.29, 14.06

The rears are a completely different shock than they typically go with for a 3" lift, for that they usually do a short body 12" travel unit which isn't really appropriate for me. On the up side I won't have to deal with an external tank on the rear.

For the front this is the same shock they go with for the 3" RTE lift. The trick here is instead of going with RTE's loop style DII lower front shock adapter which adds 1.25" inches I will go with the Bilstein cross pin adapter (just like factory style and what OME uses on the N107 lower part) to keep the shocks from extending too far and dislocating the 2" lift spring. This will also keep them from bottoming and damaging them with my shorter lift.

I will report back when I get these on. We also decided that I want to do the front cross member extension to clear the drive shaft after the longer travel fronts, just to be on the safe side. I am skipping the watts linkage though, I think with the shorter shocks I can just grind a little on the place where it hits and get by with that. I did confirm that at full axle drop driver side it hits a little, but only needs a tiny little more movement to fully extend the shock on that side. Obviously with the 12" travel rear shocks it is a must to do the RTE watts linkage.

 

[benlittle]

Unfortunately the valving is simply WAY too soft and the truck actually bounces, especially at the right speed on highway expansion joints.

I'm glad you mentioned this. All this talk of shock length and not of valving was kind of giving me a tummy ache.
The reason why most choose the OME's besides price is because they are valved for these trucks. You can find loop to loop shocks all day long but not in the correct valving.

I'm sorry I didn't catch you before you bought these Bilsteins... I researched the hell out of valving in all Bilstein applications and have spent a lot of time on the phone with Bilstein going through just about every stock application and valving trying to come close to a 360\80 or 400\100 and it just doesn't exist.

That being said I ended up going with the 7100's with 360\80 all the way around. Next time I would do 400\100 in the rear.