Quick question for those in the know.. When a sleeping bag is rated for 20 degrees, does that mean that I should be warm and toasty down to 20 degrees, or that I will probably freeze to death at 19 degrees?
Sleeping Bags
- Thread starter bigred
- Start date
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cmlmtn
Guest
It's very subjective, but usually for the high quality (Marmot, REI, TNF etc...) manufactures they list it as a "comfort" rating. I have spent 2 -35 nights in a 0 degree bag and still have 10 toes! I do a LOT of winter mountaineering and there are some tricks to staying warm in an underrated bag.
1. Eat some high energy food about an hour before you go to sleep (stokes the furnace).
2. Wear a hat in your bag yes even if it has a hood.
3. You can't get enough between your bag and the ground. I use a Therma-Rest pad AND a closed cell (foam) pad if I'm going to be sleeping on the snow.
1. Eat some high energy food about an hour before you go to sleep (stokes the furnace).
2. Wear a hat in your bag yes even if it has a hood.
3. You can't get enough between your bag and the ground. I use a Therma-Rest pad AND a closed cell (foam) pad if I'm going to be sleeping on the snow.
Is Kelty decent? I doubt that I will be doing a terrible amount of camping in the snow regardless! I am not that hard core!
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cmlmtn
Guest
Kelty is good. They don't do the extensive testing that the expedition type mfrs do, but their higher end bags are good. They offer some bags with a fill called "cloud loft", but they seem really cheap and nobody knows what "cloud loft" is. If you are going with Kelty, I'd stick with the tried and true insulations like their 650 fill down or Polarguard.
Another good brand that is at the same price point as Kelty, but offers higher quality and more detailed bags is Big Agnes http://www.bigagnes.com/
Another good brand that is at the same price point as Kelty, but offers higher quality and more detailed bags is Big Agnes http://www.bigagnes.com/
People can argue all day about down vs artificial insulation. Both are good for different things. I would certainly recommend Mountain Hardwear, we have a lot of their gear. My husband has the North Face Blue Kazoo and has had it for years and it's been great. Always warm, and it helps to add a fleece liner. I have a new MHW Universe SL that is rated 0 degrees....but I'm a cold camping sleeper....so I'm toasty in low 30s!
Kelty is Ok, though I've never heard great things about their sleeping bags. Good place to start though. I have one of their packs and I'm happy with it.
Check www.campmor.com and www.sierratradingpost.com for some great deals. You can get a discontinued model for half price!! Alot of times it's just a color change or slight style change. I bought my MHW from Travel Country Outdoors and they have good sales too.
Kelty is Ok, though I've never heard great things about their sleeping bags. Good place to start though. I have one of their packs and I'm happy with it.
Check www.campmor.com and www.sierratradingpost.com for some great deals. You can get a discontinued model for half price!! Alot of times it's just a color change or slight style change. I bought my MHW from Travel Country Outdoors and they have good sales too.
I just got a Big Agnes Mica with the REM pad for a little over $120.00 from www.killerdeals.com I?ve been a longtime camper/hiker and enjoy the outdoors but sleeping has always been a problem. The major reason I got the BA bag was because the pad slips into a sleeve on the bottom of the bag. By doing this you 1. cut down on weight as there is no "traditional" bottom of the bag, it's replaced with the 25 degree pad and 2. you can roll over inside of the bag and it stays in one place and doesn't come along for the ride. This is without a doubt the single best pad/bag combo I've ever had.
Here is a link: http://www.northernmountain.com/NMS...MicaHinmanCombo03&Dept=SB&Cat=SB1&SubCat=SB11
Michael
Here is a link: http://www.northernmountain.com/NMS...MicaHinmanCombo03&Dept=SB&Cat=SB1&SubCat=SB11
Michael
I second the comment about you can never have too much between you and the ground. I use two thick therma rest pads and cover those with a synchila or fleece blanket, then I usualy just lay a zipped open sleeping bag over me unless it is 30 or colder then I may climb inside the bag and zip it up. This system works in a wide range of temps and I always sleep great. It is nice laying right on the fleece when it is warm out because you dont get that clammy sweaty feeling you do when sleeping in a nylon sleeping bag. When It gets cold I add sweat pants and shirt and just lay an open bag over me like a comforter. My sleeping bag is a 5 degree North Face.
I have a Mountain Hardwear bag its synthetic. I have had it about 5 years and have spent alot of time in it in alot of places. I have spent some time in down bags, they are the best without a doubt untill they get wet!!!!!!!!!! The new HW down bags with the conduit fabric will be my next bag, I have a conduit coat for bike riden and it has held up well and still keeps me relatively dry and stops the wind. If the Conduit fabric can hold up to almost a year of my riding it can def last many moons on a sleeping bag
one other thing to add to the above info, MAKE SURE THE BAG FITS YOU!
you'll stay warmer in a shitty bag that fits you, than a high end bag that's to big...
most reputable shops will fit your bag to your body.
i'm a Mountain Hardware guy, but i've seen some cool Marmot shuff lately!
BUT, MAKE SURE IT FITS
you'll stay warmer in a shitty bag that fits you, than a high end bag that's to big...
most reputable shops will fit your bag to your body.
i'm a Mountain Hardware guy, but i've seen some cool Marmot shuff lately!
BUT, MAKE SURE IT FITS
Definitely agree about fit...I bought a short length bag b/c I'm only 5'5" and it makes all the difference not losing heat through unused space. On the other side, my bag is expandable so I still have room to move around and stretch. I hate feeling like my legs are bound in a mummy. We haven't backpacked for a while, so our most recent camping has been sleeping on an air mattress...but pads make a HUGE amount of difference. My bag is kind-of thin on the underside, but it's made to connect with the MHW pads....so check those out as well. Mine is down with the conduit outer shell and I love it...if I was going to use it without a tent, I'd buy the bivy sack too for protection.
Marmot also makes excellent down bags and they even have a hybrid one that is half down/half primaloft. Neat idea.
Just try some out and get the best combination rated for your activites.
Here's the one I have:
http://www.mountainhardwear.com/www/action/catalog/DisplayStyle?id=1120
http://www.travelcountry.com/shop/S...00de/Action/Vendor_Prod/CatId/384/ProdId/3591
http://www.usoutdoorstore.com/istar.asp?a=6&AID=10287732&PID=1313043&id=000278!371
Marmot also makes excellent down bags and they even have a hybrid one that is half down/half primaloft. Neat idea.
Just try some out and get the best combination rated for your activites.
Here's the one I have:
http://www.mountainhardwear.com/www/action/catalog/DisplayStyle?id=1120
http://www.travelcountry.com/shop/S...00de/Action/Vendor_Prod/CatId/384/ProdId/3591
http://www.usoutdoorstore.com/istar.asp?a=6&AID=10287732&PID=1313043&id=000278!371
Here are some great deals on older models
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=30682152&memberId=12500226
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=28956569&memberId=12500226
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=20946916&memberId=12500226
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=39166491&memberId=12500226
They also have long lengths for each bag. These are all down, but they have a good selection of Polarguard bags too and they are usually less expensive.
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=30682152&memberId=12500226
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=28956569&memberId=12500226
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=20946916&memberId=12500226
http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=39166491&memberId=12500226
They also have long lengths for each bag. These are all down, but they have a good selection of Polarguard bags too and they are usually less expensive.
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cmlmtn
Guest
Roverlady on your note about the conduit...I have been using a Marmot CWM (down) with gore dryloft for 3 years in the winter with no problems the dryloft (and conduit) breathe much more than traditional gortex as they arent totally waterproof but since cold air holds less moisture than warm air they are also ideal for winter and higher elevations. The only drawback I have noticed so far is that the laminated shells are much louder that a triditional shell.
For summer I use an exped wall creeper. Primaloft insulation, zip out arm holes, and drawstring opening at feet. Quiet, light weight, and I can stomp around camp in it.
For summer I use an exped wall creeper. Primaloft insulation, zip out arm holes, and drawstring opening at feet. Quiet, light weight, and I can stomp around camp in it.
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rivrmutt
Guest
Also....
Remeber that comfort zone and ratings are subjective to the person using them. In other words a 30 degree bag might be great for me when its 10 degrees out but others might need a 0 degrees bag.( and no I don't have a bunch of extra body Insulation) I spent many below freezing nights out in my 30 degree bag and have been very comfortable. And I know people that need 0 degree bags for 40 degree nights. Fit does matter!!
You will not go wrong with Mountain Hardwear, they build just about the best quality stuff around.
Remeber that comfort zone and ratings are subjective to the person using them. In other words a 30 degree bag might be great for me when its 10 degrees out but others might need a 0 degrees bag.( and no I don't have a bunch of extra body Insulation) I spent many below freezing nights out in my 30 degree bag and have been very comfortable. And I know people that need 0 degree bags for 40 degree nights. Fit does matter!!
You will not go wrong with Mountain Hardwear, they build just about the best quality stuff around.
Rivrmutt-
You are 100% right...like I said, I bought a 0 degree bag and I never camp in weather that cold (though I'd like to try!) I've been comfy in it to about 40 degrees so far, haven't had it out much since MAR. I had an old fiberfill 10 degree bag that was too big years ago, I had a fleece liner AND tons of clothes on and almost FROZE to death last year!
Chad, That 'creeper' sounds cool! I'l have to check those out. I like the zip out arm holes idea. Like pit zips for a sleeping bag!!
You are 100% right...like I said, I bought a 0 degree bag and I never camp in weather that cold (though I'd like to try!) I've been comfy in it to about 40 degrees so far, haven't had it out much since MAR. I had an old fiberfill 10 degree bag that was too big years ago, I had a fleece liner AND tons of clothes on and almost FROZE to death last year!
Chad, That 'creeper' sounds cool! I'l have to check those out. I like the zip out arm holes idea. Like pit zips for a sleeping bag!!
hardcore is all relative...whats hardcore to you may not be to me...for example you can experience "hardcore" weather in a car campground in yellowstone in the middle of summer...what i mean is that you could get 10 degree nights to most thats hardcore and they havent even left the car campground yet!
so what you really need to be thinking about is what you will be using the bag for. like someone wrote-backpacking, car camping, climbin, etc etc....also what type of places will you realisticly be using your bag and what type of weather...
If you can only afford one bag then make sure it covers all of your bases. (remember down will last forever, synthetic-after 4-5 yrs the material inside the back starts to break down and you will experience loss of the comfort rating..for example your bag is rated at 20 degrees when you buy it 5 yrs later its now most likely a 25 to 30 degree bag..there are many companies out there. if you dont need anything fancy just something to throw in the back of the rover for summer camping with no real cold weather then a "cheap" will do, but remember with bags you really do get what you pay for. a lot has to do with construction-materials, baffle construction is key ( some styles allow way to much movement of the down or synthetic material which leads to cold spots(your all warm on your left side and yoour right side by your torso is freezing), etc etc. an example of this-some bags may feel great in the store, but in fact are prone to cold spots-the filler material moves to one area so its not evenly disperssed through the baffle.
i swear by down unless spending lenghty time in very damp, humid weather. if you consider down check out western mountaineering-they are the best, hands down for down sleeping bags, a very close second is feathered friends (both all u.s. made). western m. deals only in down sleeping bags, so they are super specialized. feathered friends deals only in down sleeping bags and down clothing. to get an idea of how a well constructed bag should look check out there websites.
i have western mountaineering 0 degree 850+down bag , gore dryloft shell that has extra down in the footbox (my feet get cold and they offer this service to customers),
my second bag is a 25 degree w/m down bag, 800+down, gore dryloft shell bag that is super light and super small.
third bag is a -40 feathered friends down bag....but thats probably way beyond what you will use yours for....
anyway make a good and informed decision-i cant tell you how many times people thought they bought the right bag because it says the brand name or the salesman told them it was good only to be totally let down at the worst possible time.
so what you really need to be thinking about is what you will be using the bag for. like someone wrote-backpacking, car camping, climbin, etc etc....also what type of places will you realisticly be using your bag and what type of weather...
If you can only afford one bag then make sure it covers all of your bases. (remember down will last forever, synthetic-after 4-5 yrs the material inside the back starts to break down and you will experience loss of the comfort rating..for example your bag is rated at 20 degrees when you buy it 5 yrs later its now most likely a 25 to 30 degree bag..there are many companies out there. if you dont need anything fancy just something to throw in the back of the rover for summer camping with no real cold weather then a "cheap" will do, but remember with bags you really do get what you pay for. a lot has to do with construction-materials, baffle construction is key ( some styles allow way to much movement of the down or synthetic material which leads to cold spots(your all warm on your left side and yoour right side by your torso is freezing), etc etc. an example of this-some bags may feel great in the store, but in fact are prone to cold spots-the filler material moves to one area so its not evenly disperssed through the baffle.
i swear by down unless spending lenghty time in very damp, humid weather. if you consider down check out western mountaineering-they are the best, hands down for down sleeping bags, a very close second is feathered friends (both all u.s. made). western m. deals only in down sleeping bags, so they are super specialized. feathered friends deals only in down sleeping bags and down clothing. to get an idea of how a well constructed bag should look check out there websites.
i have western mountaineering 0 degree 850+down bag , gore dryloft shell that has extra down in the footbox (my feet get cold and they offer this service to customers),
my second bag is a 25 degree w/m down bag, 800+down, gore dryloft shell bag that is super light and super small.
third bag is a -40 feathered friends down bag....but thats probably way beyond what you will use yours for....
anyway make a good and informed decision-i cant tell you how many times people thought they bought the right bag because it says the brand name or the salesman told them it was good only to be totally let down at the worst possible time.
Get a down bag rated at about 10-15 degrees colder than the coldest day you will camp. Down weighs less and compacts more.
For inexpensive bags the REI bags are very nice and Sierra Designs is OK. I would not purchase a Kelty bag (personal preference).
For a better bag, get a Marmot or Mountain Hardware. I don't like the Big Agnes "integrated" sleeping systems.
For inexpensive bags the REI bags are very nice and Sierra Designs is OK. I would not purchase a Kelty bag (personal preference).
For a better bag, get a Marmot or Mountain Hardware. I don't like the Big Agnes "integrated" sleeping systems.
Don't buy TNF. I got one with polarguard 3D and when i bought it said 20 degrees. It wont even keep me warm at 40 and i am hot natured.