Trillion Dollar Coin

[knewsom]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/03/debt-ceiling-coin_n_2404653.html

From the above link:

Because of the deal made on New Year's Day that averted the immediate impact of the so-called fiscal cliff, America will face a sequel to the debt ceiling hostage crisis that led to the super committee and the sequester and the fiscal cliff and the fiscal cliff solution and the sequel to the debt ceiling hostage crisis that led to the super committee and the sequester and the fiscal cliff and the fiscal cliff solution, et cetera, ad infinitum. The best of all possible fiscal cliff deals would have included a guaranteed de-weaponization of the debt ceiling. Since the fiscal cliff deal did not include any such de-weaponization, America's credit and the global economy are still very much jeopardized by the dangerous lunatics who have threatened another round of hostage-taking.

What can be done about it? Well, what about a magic trillion-dollar coin, wrought from platinum? Would that help?

Actually, in an interview with Capital New York's Reid Pilifant, Rep. Jerrold Nadler (D-N.Y.) suggests that it is possible to mint just such a coin, stick it in the Federal Reserve, and stick a fork in the coming debt ceiling crisis before it begins. "I'm being absolutely serious," Nadler told Pilifant, adding, "It sounds silly but it's absolutely legal. And it would normally not be proper to consider such a thing, except when you're faced with blackmail to destroy the country's economy, you have to consider things."

Yes, it would be good to have some "things" you can do to save the planet from the debt ceiling psychopaths. But how does the magic platinum coin work? In the video above, we attempt to explain the whole matter without having our heads explode, right down to whether or not America is doomed if that master pickpocket from that great New Yorker article steals the magic platinum coin.

UPDATE: A group of citizens is petitioning President Barack Obama to begin minting platinum coins. If the petition garners 25,000 signatures, the White House will be required to respond. The petition reads:

"With the creation and Treasury deposit of a new platinum coin with a value of $1 trillion US Dollars, we would avert the absurd-yet-imminent debt ceiling faceoff in Congress in two quick and simple steps! While this may seem like an unnecessarily extreme measure, it is no more absurd than playing political football with the US -- and global -- economy at stake."

Curious what you fellas think about this.

 

[Tugela]

I'm sure I've got a couple of those under my couch cushions along with a few bottle caps, Cheetos, stray socks, and a remote control.

 

[mbs13]

Less than 3000 so far... Signed it just to see where this might go. No more rediculous than anything else the govt has pulled in the past.

 

[jim-00-4.6]

For this "coin" to be worth $1T of platinum, it would have to weigh 20 tons or something.
Therefore, for this to be a trillion dollar coin, the value assignment is arbitrary.
So, why not just print "One Trillion dollars" on a piece of paper and call it a trillion dollars?
The only difference is by making it a COIN, Treasury can do it, instead of Fed.

Here's an idea...
What if the FedGov just said, "All US treasury bonds, savings bonds, etc in the universe are now worthless. We aren't paying a fucking red cent."
That means the US govt debt will have just disappeared.
YAY! We're saved!
Except for all those people and insurance companies and pension funds and foreign governments who are holding those US bonds. We're fucked out of our money.

Now, the FedGov has no debt. Fine.
That means their deficit spending must absolutely END.
Think about it...
Last week, they fucked me out of the money they owed me, and I have no recourse.
Are you going to lend them money this week?
I'm sure SOME idiot would, since "it'll be different this time", but I can tell you for sure, I won't be lending them anything!
So, now FedGov can only spend what it takes in taxes.
While I think that would be a good idea, I'm not totally on board with fucking everyone currently holding US debt.

Not that completely ignoring laws is anything new from DC... (see bondholder ass-fuck during GM bailout)

"Creating" one trillion dollars out of thin air is not going to help.

 

[knewsom]

Jim - you missed the central point of this - the Fed has the authority to make Platinum coins with any value independent of the amount of platinum used. Therefore it could be a one-ounce coin with a literal value of one ounce of platinum, but a minted amount of one trillion dollars.

 

[jim-00-4.6]

Jim - you missed the central point of this - the Fed has the authority to make Platinum coins with any value independent of the amount of platinum used. Therefore it could be a one-ounce coin with a literal value of one ounce of platinum, but a minted amount of one trillion dollars.

No, I get it; the "value" is arbitrarily assigned.
The TREASURY can mint that coin, not the FED.
Why not use a bottle cap?
There's no effective difference between minting this coin, and printing a piece of paper that says "One Trillion Dollars".

It worked really well for Zimbabwe, it should work great for us, too.

 

[varova87]

No, I get it; the "value" is arbitrarily assigned.
Why not use a bottle cap?

Agreed, a coin is lame. I think we could come up with a colorful list of suggestions for this "trillion dollar item."

 

[knewsom]

Sorry, yes, I had those backwards - the treasury can mint it, and deposit into the fed. I get the implication - inflation. Too much of this would be very, very bad. Not enough, however... perhaps worse. Japan has been playing this game for many years and is still somehow intact.

 

[jim-00-4.6]

Sorry, yes, I had those backwards - the treasury can mint it, and deposit into the fed. I get the implication - inflation. Too much of this would be very, very bad. Not enough, however... perhaps worse. Japan has been playing this game for many years and is still somehow intact.

"somehow intact" is one way to describe Japan.
Japan also started their missing 2 decades with significant consumer savings.
US did not.

Let's make it a 10-trillion dollar coin/bottlecap, then no one will need to pay any taxes.
US expects to take, what, $2.8billion in taxes?
That's almost 5 years of no one pays taxes.
Think of all the money available to buy Chinese crap!
It's a win for everyone!!!

Well, not everyone. Only those of us who actually PAY taxes.
Can you hear the screaming yet?
"It's not FAIR! Those people who pay taxes don't have to pay taxes, so it's like they got free money! Why shouldn't I get free money? Just because I don't pay any taxes doesn't matter! It's not FAIR! Goddamned rich people!"

 

[az_max]

Printing more money only devalues the currency currently in circulation. Mexico has gone through it several times. I seem to remember it was 100 pesos to the dollar in the 80's.

 

[kennith]

When I think about a trillion dollar platinum coin, I don't think about the economy.

I think about a target.

I'd sure love to see the inventive plans people would hatch to steal the thing.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[I HATE PONIES]

I'd be more interested to see them try to spend it.

 

[p m]

I don't think Jim missed anything... matter of fact, can't remember a time when he did.

This circus is becoming anecdotal, quickly.

 

[knewsom]

Inflation adversely affects the poor more than the rich. Suddenly the basic necessities they could barely afford before are completely unaffordable. Middle class become poor, poor become homeless, homeless become starving (if they weren't already).

We've been "creating" trillions of dollars out of thin air for years to lend to banks so they could make shit mortgages to sell to investment banks, to sell "securities" to everyone else, all of which were worthless. We haven't even published a report on the amount of actual US money in circulation (cash and electronic) since what... 2003? Another trillion to prevent an economic meltdown because congress won't raise money to pay for the bills they've racked up hardly seems like it'll be a drop in the bucket to me.

 

[lrover94]

I think the Franklin mint is making this one!

 

[brian4d]

Yet another attempt to kick the.... can't even say it anymore.

I heard that Obama told Boehner that the U.S. "doesn't have a spending problem" last week. If this is what we're dealing with we've already lost.

 

[brian4d]

I'll add this.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrisconover/2013/01/08/mr-president-we-do-have-a-spending-problem/