worm or planetary, which and why

[draaronr]

So I am going to get a new winch wanted to see what everyone liked and why. I have had experience with the worm gear, but not the warn winches. I know this has been discussed in the past, but search brings up over 10pages of links, so wanted to get this hashed out again.

 

[WillTN]

Ramsey RE12000

 

[draaronr]

that is exactly what i was thinking Will

 

[craig]

Just make sure you can procure a bumper that you can fit it on.

roversolutions.com (kyle) w/ grill trimming
NWP w/ grill trimming and custom work (mounting bracket and front of winch tray)
RTE - send them your winch and they will custom fit it.

The worm drives run cooler and draw less power. The RE12000 is a slow winch, but strong and reliable.

--Craig

 

[Steve Rupp]

You really have to ask yourself what kind of wheeling you're going to be doing. Out here in the midwest, we have tons of mud so I decided to go with the RE12000. Worm drive winches are super slow, but are generally more reliable than the planetary winches. However, I was just in Moab and I think I winched about 4 times, and I think they were all on Metal Masher (approach to widow maker, widow maker, rock chucker, and some new extra credit obstacle). Here is a pic of the approach to widow maker....

http://www.pbase.com/ruppsrover/image/42159561

We all used the winch here to just put pressure on the front of the truck from the opposite angle we were leaning. To the left of my truck is about a 40' drop straight down. I don't think you can see in the pic but the front left tire is climbing while the front right tire is dropping into a nice little hole. There were a few rocks up there but after Marc pushed them out of the way and slid to the right, we just decided to hook up the winch. In this situation the RE and my brother's MM worked out perfect. The slow winches gave us great control on the speed. Not that Marc's EP9 didn't do a fine job either, but didn't have the same control. Here's a pic of widow maker....

Now in this situation I wish I had a planetary winch for the speed. I was sitting there spinning the tires trying to help out the winch but was only going as fast as it would pull. Marc flew up this once his tires got past that hump, and was able to continue up the hill at a nice pace while spooling up the winch. I had Marc pull my rope to the side while i drove up. Then I coiled it up around my a-bar at the top of the hill like this...

The next obstacle Marc and I winched at is rock chucker.....

On this obstacle, I got up the first ledge no problem and got my front on the second ledge but because I didn't have room to really bump it up the second ledge, I kept pulling myself to the right into a small hole. I had about 6" before my right rear tire ended up in that hole which would have definately made me turf. This is another situation where I just needed a little nudge to get the rear tires in a spot that i could just bump it up the rest of the way. Marc and I had identical lines. He gave the winch a little nudge and was able to get up mostly on his own power. Finally I winched on an extra credit obstacle yet on the same trail.....

In this situation, the soft soil caused my left rear tire to dig a nice hole at the base of about a 3' ledge. The back of the truck stayed stationary while the front of the truck pulled to the left. You can see the drop off to the right of me. It wasn't a spot that I wanted to end up in so again i hooked up the winch and performed a nice controlled pull. This was a situation where the RE performed well. So for my type of wheeling, the RE is the choice for me. While slow up the some obstacles, it still got me up and didn't smoke doing it. I'm sure I'll be making some long pulls in the mud out here this summer, and I'm sure the RE will do fine.

So, if I was only wheeling in Moab I would probably go with a planetary winch. But for general winching situations, I would have to say go with a worm gear.

*here are all of our pics of Metal Masher if anybody is interested:
http://www.pbase.com/ruppsrover/metalmasher&page=all

 

[darw_n]

this is an excellent break down of winching situations, the pics help alot to us n00b's, thanks for that post!!

 

[mgreenspan]

I have a question about winching:

If I go the route of getting a front receiver hitch and a multi mount winch, will this set up be as strong for winching in situations described above to put extra weight on the front of the truck when going over obstacles?

 

[craig]

Steve,

How do you like the roller fairlead with the winch rope? I've got an RE12000 and am considering my fairlead options for use with my 3/8" dynaflex (I seem to remember you are running 1/2").

I bought a dynaflex hawse fairlead, but it didn't align the way the factory RE12000 hawse fairlead does. I'm not sure what fairleads work well with winch rope and the RE12k now.

Thanks,
Craig

 

[Eric N.]

http://www.discoweb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=8036


end of thread there is mention of a perfect fit fairlead for the RE..

 

[Mike_Rupp]

Craig, my brother's fairlead was made by Kyle and is pretty slick. It seems to work pretty well with the rope. We never really used it on any side pulls, but it should work fine. If you prefer a hawse for the rope, you could ask around for the guys that make the hawse fairleads to see if they can make it to custom sizes. My brother and I were talking about this a while back, & I seem to remember that Rovertracks can easily adjust the size of a fairlead.

 

[billb]

Personally - I'm not a fan of synthetic rope and roller fairleads - past bad experiences.

Anyway - you can also make something to fit an RE12K albeit a bit more trouble to do so:

http://www.roversolutions.com/thebumper/bill_b3.jpg

This is a billet of 3/4" thk aluminum I had made to "plate" the front of the bumper. I had the slot put at the correct RE12 offset and the width I wanted. Then hard-coat anodized it.

Obviously - not the solution for everyone.

Bill

 

[marc olivares]

Steve brings up an interesting point that he and i discuss often.
ie there is no one perfect setup, build it how you plan to use it.
or consider this:

if your a smoker get a worm drive, this way you'll have plenty of time to have a smoke while your spooling your line back in.

if you have ADD like me then the planetary is right up your alley.

 

[craig]

Personally - I'm not a fan of synthetic rope and roller fairleads - past bad experiences.

Anyway - you can also make something to fit an RE12K albeit a bit more trouble to do so:

http://www.roversolutions.com/thebumper/bill_b3.jpg

This is a billet of 3/4" thk aluminum I had made to "plate" the front of the bumper. I had the slot put at the correct RE12 offset and the width I wanted. Then hard-coat anodized it.

Obviously - not the solution for everyone.

Bill

I've been admiring your fairlead for a while. It looks very very clean, and functional. I pm'd you a couple of days ago asking about it, but you (like the rest of us) probably didn't see that you had a waiting message. I know I usually check mine about once every 2 months or so.

I was wondering if the bolts go through the fairlead and into the winch, sandwiching the front of the winch tray or if you mounted it differently.

My current plan is to do what you did. I am having my bumper powder coated white, and an all black fairlead across the front of it should in addition to work well, look good. Very similar to a stock D2 bumper on an SE7 with black in the middle, white on the sides. I'm kind of taking a risk on the all white bumper/brushguard and hoping that it doesn't look like crap. I'm shooting for the look of a Defender 110 with the white exocage... we'll see.

--Craig

 

[craig]

Craig, my brother's fairlead was made by Kyle and is pretty slick. It seems to work pretty well with the rope. We never really used it on any side pulls, but it should work fine. If you prefer a hawse for the rope, you could ask around for the guys that make the hawse fairleads to see if they can make it to custom sizes. My brother and I were talking about this a while back, & I seem to remember that Rovertracks can easily adjust the size of a fairlead.

Thanks Mike. For no particular reason other than it seems to be "standard practice" I'm leaning toward an aluminum hawse fairlead. Until your brother's truck I'd never seen a roller fairlead with winch rope. Then again, I pretty much wheel alone or with my best friend so I don't see a lot of other trucks. I don't really know where to dig up the pros/cons yet.

What is custom about the roller fairlead? Are the rollers aluminum?

--Craig

 

[DiscoDino]

I went with a Warn Spur Gear M8274-50, this, by far, is the best winch in my opinion...

 

[craig]

http://www.discoweb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=8036


end of thread there is mention of a perfect fit fairlead for the RE..

Thanks Eric, that thread looks good.

--Craig

 

[noee]

if your a smoker get a worm drive, this way you'll have plenty of time to have a smoke while your spooling your line back in.

lol. I have the Warn 15K mounted to a RTE slimlline, it's a beast and the planetary setup is different than the lower rated Warns (12/15K share the same design). It appears to be *much* stronger than the lower rated Warns. It's also very slow and I use it with the MasterPull synth stuff.

Frankly, most of my use has been pulling logs out of the woods and such, though I've used it for recovery as well. It sucks a lot of juice and I'm of the opinion that a single yellow top is not gonna do the job with this winch.

I've had it apart three times for cleaning and lubing and such, it's a breeze to work on and the teflon "bearings" have lasted well. It's never really gotten hot during use, usually just a little warm and despite being dunked more than a few times, the motor has remained sealed up nicely (a little hylomar helps).

Did I mention that it's slow?

 

[RverJC]

Hey Aaron!!

I couldn't pass up a winch discussion.
My experiences include my X8000i (Jeep), HS9500i(RRC) a few 8274s( Jeeps) not mine but used lots!! And a good wheeling buddy that had the MM hydraulic (Jeep)

Don't get the MM SUPER-Slow I mean you will get out but it barely looks like the cable is moving!!!
My 8000 is a little small after heavy use!( My jeep is a lot lighter than a newer Rover so skip the 8000 and 9000!!
The 8274s are very nice very fast no line and the external brake is reassuring. A little small but I'd consider it to be in a class of it's own.

the HS9500 is the winner as far as speed and reliabilty are concerned. (I don't think the ti stuff is worth the extra $$$ but that's my $0.02.

IF you do lots of winching either invest in a snatch block or jump to the 12000#( a snatch block is always good anyways for flip -overs and weird extractions but you can't be lazy and use your 800# winch till you burn the solenoids out!!!( don't ask how I know

Jamie

 

[Steve Rupp]

Craig, here are some more pics of the bumper and the fairlead. Kyle set it up for a steel cable which is why he used the stainless rollers. I was considering cutting it off and having Keith at Rovertracks fab me up an aluminum hawse, but it would break my heart and I'm sure Kyle's too to cut that thing off. So far I haven't had any problems using the rollers and the rope. There are no sharp edges or anywhere the rope can get caught into and chafe it. So until I have a problem it's staying on.

http://www.pbase.com/ruppsrover/kvt_bumper&page=all

 

[craig]

Thanks Steve. Kyle did a great job on that fairlead.

--Craig