I'm going to buy a goose gun this weekend. I still can't find any damn 7.62x54r.noee said:This is a good weekend to get ready.
Big Three Bailout?
- Thread starter noee
- Start date
az_max said:
Yep. The proposal is that a non-union shop can become unionized once 50% of the employees sign "unionization" cards, as opposed to a secret ballot.
The fear is that a couple of guys named "Vinny" show up at your door in the middle of the night and make you an offer you can't refuse.
After growing up in NJ and being in a union there, I don't doubt the validity of this scenario. (Actually, the VP of the union I belonged to was named Vinny and looked like a 6'5" linebacker. Oh, yeah, the President, past-President and president before that were Grandfather, father, and son!
)
It's getting scary ain't itnoee said:So, who ever really believed $25 or even $75B was enough?
Bloomberg - The $200B bailout
What does it mean when every bank and every large company in the country is insovlent?
Oh, and now we're finding out that public agencies (city, county, state) have borrowed money to invest and the investments are now worthless and they still have to pay back the loans, but they have no money.
This is a good weekend to get ready.
What does it mean? It means we're all F'd....
http://www.discoweb.org/forums/showpost.php?p=614000&postcount=135
Guys, you have all brought up some good points and changed my view on the Big 3 Bailout.
It has pissed me off how Ford, can't get around their own big ass to innovate a car like the Subaru WRX or the Mitsu Evo. Instead they produce a hulking hunk of shit Mustang, with no AWD, shit interior, high price tag, pathetic handling, and horrible comparable gas mileage. It's foreign competitors run circles around it.
It has pissed me off how Ford, can't get around their own big ass to innovate a car like the Subaru WRX or the Mitsu Evo. Instead they produce a hulking hunk of shit Mustang, with no AWD, shit interior, high price tag, pathetic handling, and horrible comparable gas mileage. It's foreign competitors run circles around it.
SGaynor said:Yep. The proposal is that a non-union shop can become unionized once 50% of the employees sign "unionization" cards, as opposed to a secret ballot.
The fear is that a couple of guys named "Vinny" show up at your door in the middle of the night and make you an offer you can't refuse.
After growing up in NJ and being in a union there, I don't doubt the validity of this scenario. (Actually, the VP of the union I belonged to was named Vinny and looked like a 6'5" linebacker. Oh, yeah, the President, past-President and president before that were Grandfather, father, and son!
It's called EFCA and Obama proposed it but it didn't pass.
http://action.seiu.org/freechoice/obamavideo/
However, you can bet it will now.
There are also proposals that if only say 40% of employees sign cards-you must negotiate with those employees and allow union representation for that 40%.
The racketeering threats are already there:
http://efcaupdate.squarespace.com/home/?currentPage=2
However, it appears that EFCA really is not supported by union households who view it as pro-UNION rather than pro-WORKER:
http://www.myprivateballot.com/modu...&_adctlid=v%7Cx1nebahdn7kdhz%7Cxjs3zty6gfdalj
Sounds like a fantastic idea! As if the unions haven't done enough damage to industry in this country. While no one is innocent when it comes to alot of the manufacturing issues in this country, the unions are a major conern in all of this. As far as the big 3 are concerned, they were so arrogant and short sighted in their future they went ahead and agreed to too many union thug demands and this is where we are now.
The sad thing is, is that it's not about union wages either. BMW, Toyota, et al. all pay union wages or better to their employees. The difference is work standards and perks. The unions demand that there be no efficiency. No one is allowed to know anything about anothers job. Just try even dropping a box of parts off at a loading dock of an auto plant. Takes no less than 4 guys to get involved in just moving it from your truck to the dock. It's ridiculous.
But management is equally to blame if not more so. Biggest problem now that has been brewing for years here in Detroit, is that they've run the car guys out of town. People that all they do is eat and sleep cars. Their vision and strategies have been replaced by the executive of the month club. The current breed of cars guys, dare I even call them that, only bend over for the share holder. When years ago, car guys only wanted to build the best cars they could. They may not have always been the best with some models, but that was their passion and shareholders be damned. Plus they all came up from the ranks, they knew their business. Now they get hired from their buddies at the country club. I'm here in Detroit, many friends and my families business is dependent upon the auto industry. But this bail out stinks to high heaven. Unless there are some serious fundamental changes with the way business is done, then it's simply our good taxpayer money thrown after bad. Sure the big three want the money to line their parachutes because that's all they care about, themselves not the employees or the industry, only themselves. They can survive without a bailout if they get back to basics and just build cars. If the government wants to help, get the government OUT. The government does'nt create cars or wealth. They destroy it. Allow the car companies to make cars people want. Stop mandating progress. Ridiculous CAFE standards, and impossible competion in some arenas. Yes, the car companies can survive without a bail out. They just need to focus on building cars and getting back to basics and allow for some real help from the government by getting out of the way.
The sad thing is, is that it's not about union wages either. BMW, Toyota, et al. all pay union wages or better to their employees. The difference is work standards and perks. The unions demand that there be no efficiency. No one is allowed to know anything about anothers job. Just try even dropping a box of parts off at a loading dock of an auto plant. Takes no less than 4 guys to get involved in just moving it from your truck to the dock. It's ridiculous.
But management is equally to blame if not more so. Biggest problem now that has been brewing for years here in Detroit, is that they've run the car guys out of town. People that all they do is eat and sleep cars. Their vision and strategies have been replaced by the executive of the month club. The current breed of cars guys, dare I even call them that, only bend over for the share holder. When years ago, car guys only wanted to build the best cars they could. They may not have always been the best with some models, but that was their passion and shareholders be damned. Plus they all came up from the ranks, they knew their business. Now they get hired from their buddies at the country club. I'm here in Detroit, many friends and my families business is dependent upon the auto industry. But this bail out stinks to high heaven. Unless there are some serious fundamental changes with the way business is done, then it's simply our good taxpayer money thrown after bad. Sure the big three want the money to line their parachutes because that's all they care about, themselves not the employees or the industry, only themselves. They can survive without a bailout if they get back to basics and just build cars. If the government wants to help, get the government OUT. The government does'nt create cars or wealth. They destroy it. Allow the car companies to make cars people want. Stop mandating progress. Ridiculous CAFE standards, and impossible competion in some arenas. Yes, the car companies can survive without a bail out. They just need to focus on building cars and getting back to basics and allow for some real help from the government by getting out of the way.
The government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
- Ronald Reagan
- Ronald Reagan
Well, everyone has a right to an opinion . . . . :banghead:
How To Save A Major Automobile Company
Neil Young
November 13, 2008
I've have my Transition Roller. Do you?
edit add: Maybe Neil can be Obama's Automobile Industry Czar!
How To Save A Major Automobile Company
Neil Young
November 13, 2008
I've have my Transition Roller. Do you?
edit add: Maybe Neil can be Obama's Automobile Industry Czar!
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In other news, GM is now rolling out a Hummer Pickup. They were plastering the college games with commercials for them, too.
Way to go, guys. I'm glad to see that you have good plans for our (inevitable) bailout tax dollars.
Way to go, guys. I'm glad to see that you have good plans for our (inevitable) bailout tax dollars.
chris snell said:
They had a big foldout section in one of the 4WD magazines I subscribe to, too.:ack:
Now a fucking Neil Young is out there doling out his views on energy...MarkP said:
"Showcasing the green technology" on a three-ton Exxon Valdez with a Cd of 0.6...
Goddamn...
galen216 said:
From galen's most excellent link:
(U.S.) Taxes aimed at commercial trucks mean diesel costs anywhere from 40 cents to $1 more per gallon than gasoline. Add to this the success of the Toyota Prius, and you can see why only 3% of cars in the U.S. use diesel.
"Americans see hybrids as the darling," says Global Insight auto analyst Philip Gott, "and diesel as old tech."
None of this is stopping European and Japanese automakers, which are betting they can jump-start the U.S. market with new diesel models. Mercedes-Benz by next year will have three cars it markets as BlueTec. Even Nissan Motor (NSANY, news, msgs) and Honda, which long opposed building diesel cars in Europe, plan to introduce them in the United States in 2010.
But Ford, whose Fiesta ECOnetic compares favorably with European diesels, can't make a business case for bringing the car to the United States.
California certified VW and Mercedes diesel cars earlier this year, after a four-year ban. James N. Hall, of auto researcher 293 Analysts, says that bellwether state and the Northeast remain "hostile to diesel."
But the risk to Ford is that the fuel could take off, leaving the carmaker to play catch-up -- despite having a serious diesel contender in its arsenal.
What we have here is just another case of the US fucking itself in the ass. Government taxes, restrictive environmental regulations, oppressive business environment.....leave the door wide open for the Europeans and the Japanese but slam it on our own automakers. Brilliance, thy name is Government.
