Intermitent No Start issues -FPR Related.

[Zarati]

Just checked the Ignition Switch.
Two of the HOT wires when in the "Ignition ON" Position lose Voltage when cranking.
I'm thinking thats the issue. The Big White one which I'm assuming powers most of the car when ON, loses voltage when cranking.

 

[ptschram]

Just checked the Ignition Switch.
Two of the HOT wires when in the "Ignition ON" Position lose Voltage when cranking.
I'm thinking thats the issue. The Big White one which I'm assuming powers most of the car when ON, loses voltage when cranking.

It's supposed to so that all the power can go to the starter.

Don't beat yourself up too much over this, I spent three freaking weeks with a no-start and I told the client before it even came in what was wrong with the truck and I was sadly right, but it took me three weeks to believe in myself.

Now, let's go to the distributor and start there. Do you have spark from the coil to the distributor???

 

[Zarati]

No Spark from Coil
Verified Power & Ground to Coil. Coil has power with Ignition ON and while cranking. Ground seems OK.

 

[Zarati]

No Spark from Coil
Verified Power & Ground to Coil. Coil has power with Ignition ON and while cranking. Ground seems OK.

ALSO, I'm running a Mallory Optical Distributor so the little Resistor Pack or whatever it is next to the Coil is bypassed. Has worked fine this way for many years so its not a problem with the inherent setup. But I could have a faulty coil or other part. I'll head out and check Coil Primary resistance here in a sec.

 

[Zarati]

Found some info on testing the switching Module inside the Mallory Distributor:

Step by Step Module Testing - Unilite? and E-Spark?

Tools Needed: Volt Meter or DMM, Credit Card or piece of thin cardboard
Important: If you are using a CD amplifier (Mallory Hyfire?, MSD, Jacobs, Accel 300+, etc) on your vehicle you must first unwire it from the system or you will not get a valid test result. You can bypass some of these with a supplied connector, but otherwise you MUST unwire it. After removing the amplifier you will need a ballast resistor installed in the system to prevent killing a good module (if you attempt to start the engine). Follow your distributor instructions for proper installation.
Remove distributor cap and rotor. The Mallory rotors are usually on pretty tight, but it is only a press fit. You will be able to get the rotor off by firmly pulling straight up, though in all honesty it may hurt a bit.
Turn the ignition key ON and use your DMM (Digital Multi-Meter) to measure supply voltage. First check voltage at the POSITIVE side of the coil by connecting the black lead of your meter to a good ground (engine block) and the red cable to the coil. The meter should read close to battery voltage. Now check voltage at the NEGATIVE side of the coil by moving the red lead from your meter to the negative side of the coil. Your meter should also read close to battery voltage. If everything is good here, continue. If you do not get "close" to battery voltage you need to make sure there is not a power supply problem. Take a jumper wire from the positive post on your battery to the positive side of the coil. If you still do not have a reading close to battery voltage at both sides of the coil the module is energizing the coil when it is not supposed to be doing so, replace the module.
With the DMM still connected to the negative side of the coil you are going to watch the meter while blocking the optics on the module with your credit card. Placing the credit card or other device between the towers on the module blocks the optics. When the optics are blocked the readings on your meter MUST drop below 2-volts. It may be just for an instant, or it may hold below two volts until you unblock the module. Either is OK. But if the voltage does not drop below 2-volts the module has been damaged and must be replaced.
Unblocking the module after step #4 and the voltage reading on your meter MUST return to battery voltage. If the voltage does not instantly jump back up, the module must be replaced.
-----------------------------------------
After testing: I get no voltage on the Negative side. (I dont quite understand this as its the"Negative" Side. But I guess its only Negative when the switching mechanisim tells it to ground itself?
Also, with the ignition ON, the coil gets very warm to the touch.

 

[Zarati]

OK, Found a replacement Module locally. $66.00.
I also notice that I only have 10V to the coil. I have 12V At battery. Seems like a pretty high voltage drop.
I"m going to clean up my Chassis grounds, etc while I"m in there. ANy common places to get a Voltage Drop like that?

I have notice recently my Alternator Tach signal is Wonky. Seems to hunt arond a LOT. I've already replaced the Alternator twice. Currently seems to charge just fine but I dont know what else that wonky tach signal could be indicative of.

 

[Zarati]

It's supposed to so that all the power can go to the starter.

Don't beat yourself up too much over this, I spent three freaking weeks with a no-start and I told the client before it even came in what was wrong with the truck and I was sadly right, but it took me three weeks to believe in myself.

Now, let's go to the distributor and start there. Do you have spark from the coil to the distributor???

PT: Just wanted to say THANKS. :applause:
You bumped me out of the Fuel Pump orbit that I was stuck in.
You saved me from buying an ignition switch.
And once you got me on the Spark routing, I was able to figure it out.

The Ignition Module inside my Mallory Distributor was indeed bad. Apparently not a rare thing. I guess they are very sensitive to Voltage spikes & dirty electric signals. I guess mallory makes some active line conditioners that help to protect them so I may invest in one of those.

Anyhow, Found an ingition module replacement at a local Hot Rod shop (On a Sunday even). Put it in and SHABAM!!! She started right up.

Now where did I put those OME 781's???? Time to get onto funner stuff!

 

[discostew]

I just find it hard to believe that one of those great distributor engines is giving you any problem at all. They are said to be sooo reliable.

 

[discostew]

No no. I'm not saying the relay is his problem. I don't think it is. I think he's saying the "FPR" is a Fuel Pump Relay.

I think the only reason the fuel pump relay "sometimes clicks" is because the system is already charged and the pump does not need to run because the system is already pressurized.

With the very little info we have to work with, I'd suspect the alarm ecu. But that's only a guess, and not even an educated guess at that. Just a guess.

I hope you dont mind I posted this on the wall at work and guys are laughing there asses off at how smart you are.

 

[Zarati]

And this problem is back again now. 3 years later. I did a search and came across my own damn thread. And once again, I was headed down the Fuel Pump or ECM relay Rabbit Hole. This time is very Temperature dependent. Only happens during warmup. car dies after running for 3-5 mintues and then won't restart for a bit. Cools down and then starts again. I guess I'll test the Distributor again and see if thats it. If it is, I'm either going back to the OE Distributor or looking at other options. These optical units don't seem to be that robust. And when they fail, its all or nothing.

 

[ptschram]

And this problem is back again now. 3 years later. I did a search and came across my own damn thread. And once again, I was headed down the Fuel Pump or ECM relay Rabbit Hole. This time is very Temperature dependent. Only happens during warmup. car dies after running for 3-5 mintues and then won't restart for a bit. Cools down and then starts again. I guess I'll test the Distributor again and see if thats it. If it is, I'm either going back to the OE Distributor or looking at other options. These optical units don't seem to be that robust. And when they fail, its all or nothing.

I'm sure Chapman will suggest a breaker point distributor, just like his plan to build a carbureted Rover.

Keep us in the loop as I'm intensely eager to hear how you fixed it.

 

[AfiRover]

Death to dizzy's
no dizzy no problems