LR3 mods already?

[syoung]

The reason I refered to BLING electronics has nothing to do with engine management. That's been around for a long time- I'm talking about things that happen in real life.
One speed sensor goes bad- disables traction control. You are screwed.
I like the gadgets in my Freelander that make it do exceptionally well offroad for a 'soft-roader' but without a happy computer, it's a challenge. My D1 relies on a lever that locks a mechanical centre diff- not a solenoid actuated by a computer actuated by a touch screen or something like that. Too many points of failure to be reassuring. Let's face it, Land Rover is not famous for GOOD electronics, but the laughing stock of the automotive industry because of POOR electronics.
Lets face it- it's the electrical stuff that drives us all nuts. Only rover can take a 24 valve V6 with four cams with variable cam timing, variable intake runners etc and only get 175hp out of it. That's a lot of technology to match the HP of a 1984 base model Camaro V6. And the variable intakes break constantly. If you can't get the basics right, you'll just add more broken crap on top of the other broken crap. If the techs can't fix a simple vehicle, what are they going to do when an LR3 rolls in with network problems?

Kyle- don't discos have CV's in the front too? i see a lot more D1's and D90's busting stuff than 'darbies'

 

[Kyle]

Very good point Steve , Seems that alot of people have issues keeping thier TWO CVs in tact... YOU do the math , the little and big darbies have 8........... Should be interesting

 

[Bruno]

Man you guys are harsh !

Bruno.

BTW, Kyle... our cost 2.50 per foot as of today. (not so great)

 

[Bruno]

i see a lot more D1's and D90's busting stuff than 'darbies'

I'm not surprised Steve, not so much of an accomplishment given the use the Darby's see... or are you one of these guys that claims to run "hardcore" trails in the Freelander ?

How many wheel sensors have you personally had fail on you out on a trail ? for that matter, how many failures have you had out on a trail that can be attributed to your touted "Blingie electronics" ?

Bruno.

 

[Kyle]

Is it any fun if I dont fuck with you Bruno ? How dull would it be here without a little turmoil ? 2.50 actually aint bad.................

 

[Bruno]

2.50 actually aint bad.................

Damn Kyle... I didn't think there was anyone worse than me at returning messages !

LOL,
Bruno.

 

[syoung]

Bruno- actually, I take a Freelander in places that stop many 'bigger' Rovers. Hardcore? Subjective term. It does really well though, but I'm not going to entertain the whole silly debate about which is better. Rover accidentally made a decent off-roader out of 'em.

However- yes, I have had my ETC shut down on a trail. Yes, it made it more difficult to get it back out. Without a x-fer case and my ABS disabled by a computer error, it's more than a small problem because it relies heavily on technology to be good off road. When the technology fails, it might as well be a CRV.
I have an OBDII recorder on my computer that records several parameters including trapping codes that don't set off the MIL. 944 instances of VIS motor failures over the course of a week last time I checked. Yeah, Rover has high-tech down pat huh? They don't even put audible wear indicators on their brake pads like other manufacturers figured out in the 60's. Rover isn't ready to produce all this electro-wizard stuff. Look what has happened to Mercedes and BMW with their computer problems- and Rover has never been in the same league. Hope they set aside a lot of money for troubleshooting under warranty.

 

[Bruno]

Bruno- actually, I take a Freelander in places that stop many 'bigger' Rovers.

Oh man... not this BS again !

However- yes, I have had my ETC shut down on a trail. Yes, it made it more difficult to get it back out. Without a x-fer case and my ABS disabled by a computer error, it's more than a small problem because it relies heavily on technology to be good off road. When the technology fails, it might as well be a CRV.

I understand you point Steve... however, we must accept some risk.. yeah, the electrickery "might" take a dump, and yes, it could make it more difficult to get out of the woods, but this doesn't mean we should all just hop back into our series I's or safer yet, stay indoors.

Bruno.

 

[syoung]

I understand your point as well...

Oh man... not this BS again !

hey, YOU brought it up- when I'm on this board I prefer to talk about my old Disco... but the newer Freelander taught me that Rover hasn't mastered the techno wizard stuff yet. Back in 94, I ditched a 93 Defender because of recurring electrical problems- so I have a long history of not trusting Rover electronics.

I'm skeptical- but hopeful they get it right. They should at least build the new ones so that a major system failure would result in a condition that will ensure the vehicle is still mobile. Maybe they should have the fancy suspension default to all the way up as opposed to dumped on the bump stops. It should use the air system to pull it down to road height instead of push it up- if the air system fails, it rises up to max. Maybe if a speed sensor fails and it errors out and disables the HDC, ETC and ABS- one should be able to override the error and force it to lock centre and rear diffs to get you back on the pavement.

 

[Kyle]

Good ideas Steve , but thats jsut too exspensive.. Profit margins would go down.... Bruno , I was running most of the day trying to nail down the elusive tubing..

 

[syoung]

you're right, Kyle- I forgot the target demographic.
If they were still making vehicles intended for military or public service use, they'd have to consider those things. Even on the bump stops, it'll probably clear the speed bump in front of Macy's.

 

[Bruno]

I forgot the target demographic.

Commuters riding each-others asses 90MPH on the freeway

Aspiring Freelander owners

Once-a-year MAR attendees

LOL,
Bruno.

 

[Disco_Stu]

It seems to me that with all the new electronic features in these vehicles it will just neccessitate a new tool, if you plan on being on the trail for any length of time.....another computer! A lot of people are already running laptops to handle GPS related stuff, but if you were to want to take a new RR, LR3 or even a Freelander for that matter one should consider an on-board computer (laptop or otherwise) installed with either Testbook, or Rovacom an essential trail tool. That way when you do have problems like an airbag failing or a sensor knocked loose, you get out fix the physical problem, then reset everything with the computer, and hopefully away you go. I know I have heard people say that they carry extras such as axles and welders out on the trail, so I computer shouldn't be any problem at all.


-Stuart

 

[syoung]

"Once-a-year MAR attendees" That would be all of them, since MAR is only once a year.

I carry an OBDII scan and reset tool with me- as well as a Carchip EX monitoring the OBD data stream. It comes in handy sometimes.

 

[Bruno]

I carry an OBDII scan and reset tool with me- as well as a Carchip EX monitoring the OBD data stream. It comes in handy sometimes.

Steve, that's an interesting setup... hopefully giving you indication of potential problems with various components (before you go out in the woods), how complex is it to set up ?

Bruno.

 

[syoung]

Bruno- The Carchip EX rocks- I have had problems in the past with low voltage causing errors in various in various controllers. I'd get a MIL and the dealer would just stare at it. I ran the Carchip for a week and found that while braking at night and the engine at idle, my voltage would dip sometimes as low as 10V. Tested the battery and found it was defective. Without the recording of the data stream, it would have been really tough to diagnose because the dips in V weren't obvious and very quick.
Right now I measure air flow, speed, rpm, voltage, coolant temp, intake air temp, acceleration and braking and a couple other parameters. It's easy to set up and use... and it could easily let you know of problems before your MIL comes on. I'm planning to write a review on it for my site- hopefully this weekend. It's really a cool gadget- AND it can reset the MIL.
I also carry a Snap-On portable scanner, but it's really not as effective as the CarchipEX- but it doesn't require a laptop. Land Rover specific codes are difficult to define sometimes, but I was able to find the VIS codes in the service CD. I have over 900 VIS error codes per week, but until the computer tells the tech- it's not a problem to THEM. Meanwhile, my fuel consumption on my V6 is worse than my V8 Disco because of it.

 

[tehamarx]

Well, finally saw the LR3 late yesterday, even with the vehicle air suspension fully inflated, the spare tire either needs a protection plate or needs to be moved elsewhere. There's no place to mount a Safari or Expediton or Hannibal rack. Rocksliders are an unknown, will the chasis take the hits? Will the side of the vehicle take hits? After market mfgrs will be retooling for front and rear bumper protection.
Longer wheel base 113 in. and wider track 63 in, but shorter turn circle 33(?)ft.
It will be interesting.

 

[gil stevens]

the spare tire either needs a protection plate or needs to be moved elsewhere.

the spare bugs me to, the nature of a flat means that the truck gets closer to the ground. whats happens when you get a flat in a mud rut? good luck getting that tire out. they actually suggest that when prepping for "serious" off-road, one remove the tire and keep in inside the truck.

After market mfgrs will be retooling for front and rear bumper protection.

im not so sure the aftermarket is going to be lining to start fabbing bumpers sliders or anything else for this one..

 

[ducati]

I don't see why LR couldn't offer a rear-door swingaway mount, like Porsche does for the Cayenne.

I hate underbody spares--even onroad. They are always a PITA to get off as that area experiences alot of corrosion.

 

[mudderducker]

so what exactly is LR going to offer it's customers for an offroad ready vehicle?