Mileage on RRC?

[expectthebest]

Hybrid Rovers would be interesting. However, I think Diesel's the way to go in the long run. Mechanics are straightforward, but the challenge I've found is in the legality of engine swaps for newer cars. Converting gas to diesel is a sure way to get an "off highway" truck that won't pass any inspection, at least in Texas.
I believe that oil prices are entirely artificially set and if we, as Joe Public, spend our money buying hybrids and electrics with unpredictable futures at premium prices, then the oil and automotive industries will never change. Driving inefficient Rovers, Troopers, and the like en mass and whining about fuel prices to our "leaders" will eventually force fuel prices down, average fuel efficiency up, and possibly bring about other side effects such as mandatory work-from-home, shorter work weeks, mass transit, etc. Hybrids are cool and vogue, but the people buying the Prius won't change policy like a middle-class family of 5 that can't buy shoes and food for the kids because their '99 Suburban costs $100 a tank.
I will do my part for society and continue at 13MPG for all of my vehicles and bitch about it every 200 miles at fillup. God Bless the USA.

I have to agree with most of what you said. Deisel is the future right now, not electric. With a deisel engin, biodeisel is an option and a good one.

As for electic cars, most don't consider the immense pollution involved in making the batteries. There isn't anything that grows anywhere near one of these battery factories becasue of the toxic pollution. Add that on to the subsidies these cars receive just to make them affordable and you have a loosing proposition over the long hall. Besides, a hybrid will only help you if you do a lot of in town driving. You won't get any better mileage on the freeway. Anyway, that's my two cents.

 

[RRC Rookie]

If you live where you do not have to pass any type of inspection, what would be the toughest thing about switching over to a diesel? If you had a motor already on hand, what kind of $ are we talking to do a conversion? Would the increase in MPG (but not the cost per gallon for fuel) off set enough to make it worth while?

 

[tiger]

I don't think you can rely on these instruments to be accurate even with stock tires. Running Michelin XPC 255/65's, my speedometer is off by almost 7%. I can't imagine what the difference would be with altered tire sizes. Oddly enough, the odometer is more accurate with only a 1% difference and I don't get that one at all. My old Discovery 1 was the same way and had the same tires. I never checked the odometer on it but that speedo was off by close to 6%. The difference in diameter between the stock 205/80 and these tires is only 0.14", not even 1/2 of one percent.

Regardless, shitty is shitty. Just make sure you're measuring correctly so you can really cry in your Post Toasties.

Tiger, if I were you, I'd be tooling all over in the Healy or the Morgan anyway. Both are very cool rides.


Happy Rovering,

Neither of them make very good cars for Midtown Manhattan where I live, or do very well on my twice a week 75 miles each way commute!

I've been thinking of getting something else for the 300 mile a week commute, but it's kind of six of one, half dozen of the other. Fuel aside, the Rangie is cheap to own and maintain...while I do feel it at every fill up, I'd probably feel the cost of buying something different more...

 

[tiger]

If you live where you do not have to pass any type of inspection, what would be the toughest thing about switching over to a diesel? If you had a motor already on hand, what kind of $ are we talking to do a conversion? Would the increase in MPG (but not the cost per gallon for fuel) off set enough to make it worth while?

My two cents? Converting to diesel is a waste of time. How many more MPG would you need to get to offset the additional mileage? Who needs the hassle, too?

 

[ClassicRover21]

If you buy a $1000 gas-sipper (older civic, prizm, etc) it will pay for itself in gas savings in an year. Plus you have something to drive in case the RRC breaks down. My '97 Prizm gets 34-37 mpg. Same car was listed for $800 bucks on craigslist this week needing a bit of work. I drive 12,000 miles a year; in my RRC that's 1000 gallons of gas * $3/gallon or $3000 in gas costs. If I drive 8,000 of those miles in the Prizm at 35 mpg, I'm saving 440 gallons of gas, or $1,317.

 

[p m]

As for electic cars, most don't consider the immense pollution involved in making the batteries. There isn't anything that grows anywhere near one of these battery factories becasue of the toxic pollution.

I've been saying this for years! Add to that electronic manufacturing involved - PCB manufacturing process is also one of the most toxic around.
Hybrids seem to be a stop-gap, or work-around, solutions until the fuel cells become affordable.

 

[expectthebest]

I've been saying this for years! Add to that electronic manufacturing involved - PCB manufacturing process is also one of the most toxic around.
Hybrids seem to be a stop-gap, or work-around, solutions until the fuel cells become affordable.

You are absolutely right. More than a stop-gap, hybrids are part of the political reality here in the US and around the world. There are so many uninformed "greens" in the US that it's unbelievable.

By the way, my inlaws Volkswagon diesel gets better gas mileage than what the Hybrids advertise. And still, the US government refuses to allow us to use them. Go figure.

 

[p m]

By the way, my inlaws Volkswagon diesel gets better gas mileage than what the Hybrids advertise. And still, the US government refuses to allow us to use them. Go figure.

Actually, even the "ancient" diesel Rabbits of the hopefully-to-be-forgotten 1980s get 45 mpg. U.S. gov't seems to be okay with the diesels, it's California that isn't. Some nitwit decided to set NOx limits at one-tenth of European ones, and it kills diesel engines in anything but trucks here.

 

[tiger]

If you buy a $1000 gas-sipper (older civic, prizm, etc) it will pay for itself in gas savings in an year. Plus you have something to drive in case the RRC breaks down. My '97 Prizm gets 34-37 mpg. Same car was listed for $800 bucks on craigslist this week needing a bit of work. I drive 12,000 miles a year; in my RRC that's 1000 gallons of gas * $3/gallon or $3000 in gas costs. If I drive 8,000 of those miles in the Prizm at 35 mpg, I'm saving 440 gallons of gas, or $1,317.

All true, but I would also have to register, insure, and park that car also. Which would eat up the $1317 very quickly.
But worse off, I would have to DRIVE that thing 300 miles a week. Yech. That does not balance it off for me. If we were talking about $3000 saved, maybe it would be different...

 

[tiger]

Funny you mention this as my boss (wife) is going from a '05 Volvo XC70 DD to the RRC as her car. She wants to drive something that she doesn't have to lease and having 4 cars is a little silly if 2 of them just sit... She does about 250 miles a week in normal use and the way we figure it, if no car payment on the RR, I don't care about the fuel cost until the outlay there is equal to the cost of a new car and the fuel/insurance for that. If the RRC lasts 2 years before a prohibitive repair, so be it. I do mostly my own work and am not afraid of stocking up on donor cars, so it may be a while before it goes away...

That's how I see it, too. If I get two years out of a Rover, I'm happy. My current one has been a year.
I've been through six rovers so far!
Still, every time I fill up, I chew over the idea of getting something more fuel efficient, but the math does not work out for me...

 

[p m]

All true, but I would also have to register, insure, and park that car also. Which would eat up the $1317 very quickly.
But worse off, I would have to DRIVE that thing 300 miles a week. Yech. That does not balance it off for me. If we were talking about $3000 saved, maybe it would be different...

Thanks for saying that, too!
Buying a POS just to save money rarely saves money, and driving it will suck.
If there's any consolation, it would be enjoying your RRC after a week's commute in a tin box.
FWIW, my 93 LWB makes about 13-14 mpg in town, and about 17 - on the highway.

 

[tiger]

Yup. I don't enjoy driving a spam can...
17 MPG on the highway? I'm not getting that...how fast do you go?

 

[NHESS81]

'89 RRC 3.9 litre, 2" lift, no front fog light fairing, 265/75 tires.

I get: 8.5-10 in town. And about 11-13 highway (speedometer at 70-75, true speed should be faster due to tire sizes--in addition, I think my calculations could be at least 1MPG low because of the tire size).

Thats why I drive it maybe 10 miles a week to keep everything in working order. Only fill up once a month, unless going on a wheeling trip which is the ONLY reason I have it.

I drive my POS '99 Pontiac Sunfire with 26 city and 30 highway MPG for just about everything.

 

[p m]

Yup. I don't enjoy driving a spam can...
17 MPG on the highway? I'm not getting that...how fast do you go?

80 sustained.
My old 89 (the one with a desperate owner from the other thread) used to get considerably less - about 12mpg in town and 14-15 - on the highway.
The gas mileage difference between a lifted Disco and stock LWB was a shock. In the LWB I could drive from San Diego to Big Bear (140 mi + 7000ft elevation gain) and back on a tank - something that never happened in the D1.

 

[ClassicRover21]

Emissions, registration and plates for a sub $1000 car where I live are less than $100 total. 6 months insurance costs me $100. I can understand not everyone wants to drive a Prizm. There aren't POS, though. They are a rebadged Corolla, and quite reliable. They go for a lot less than Corollas though because they don't have the Toyota badge on the hood.

I've paid less than $1000 for all of our family cars. My 1993 LWB was purchased for $750 in not running condition (it needed a new battery). My wife's daily driver, a 1996 Montero SR, was purchased for $700. My Prizm was given to me when my sister moved to England. People tend to be surprised when they hear how much my vehicles cost, because they look nice and run well. About two years ago I read a series of articles called "Beaters" by Evan Reisner; he never pays more than $1000 for a car. Its a fun read, and kind of a challenge: http://www.vclassics.com/archive/beat1.htm

With 2 kids and a 3rd on the way I use my wrenching skills to avoid car loans of any type. I get a vehicle running very well over about a year, then sell it and buy another. When I sell it I make $500-$1500 or so per vehicle, maybe $3k a year. Not a ton, but a heck of a lot better than a car payment and getting hammered by depreciation.

 

[tiger]

Emissions, registration and plates for a sub $1000 car where I live are less than $100 total. 6 months insurance costs me $100. I can understand not everyone wants to drive a Prizm. There aren't POS, though. They are a rebadged Corolla, and quite reliable. They go for a lot less than Corollas though because they don't have the Toyota badge on the hood.

I've paid less than $1000 for all of our family cars. My 1993 LWB was purchased for $750 in not running condition (it needed a new battery). My wife's daily driver, a 1996 Montero SR, was purchased for $700. My Prizm was given to me when my sister moved to England. People tend to be surprised when they hear how much my vehicles cost, because they look nice and run well. About two years ago I read a series of articles called "Beaters" by Evan Reisner; he never pays more than $1000 for a car. Its a fun read, and kind of a challenge: http://www.vclassics.com/archive/beat1.htm

With 2 kids and a 3rd on the way I use my wrenching skills to avoid car loans of any type. I get a vehicle running very well over about a year, then sell it and buy another. When I sell it I make $500-$1500 or so per vehicle, maybe $3k a year. Not a ton, but a heck of a lot better than a car payment and getting hammered by depreciation.

Well done, is all I can say!
I'm all for it.
Here, in Midtown Manhattan, the cost of registering/insuring, and most importantly, PARKING, is totally different, so the math is different, too. You are probably running a lot more miles than me, too. That changes the equation.

 

[tiger]

80 sustained.
My old 89 (the one with a desperate owner from the other thread) used to get considerably less - about 12mpg in town and 14-15 - on the highway.
The gas mileage difference between a lifted Disco and stock LWB was a shock. In the LWB I could drive from San Diego to Big Bear (140 mi + 7000ft elevation gain) and back on a tank - something that never happened in the D1.

I wonder why you are getting such better mileage than me with the same car?

Lifts, stuff like that, they may have a pretty dramatic effect on mileage, due to aerodynamics.
Look at how removing just the front air dam changes mileage.
The aerodynamics on a RRC are hideous. Ever spring some sort of leak on the underside and watch how the drops go off the back of the car then climb up the rear onto the rear hatch and glass? The airflow is going up the back of the car, it's really bad. But there is not much to do about that.

I wonder what I CAN do to maybe get another 2-3mpg...ideas?

 

[Zebra]

I can only say I've never calculated MPG on my RRC why make myself miserable on what it cost to roll this beast around. My commute is 130 miles 5 days a week round trip. I have another vehicle I drive which makes the exspense of fuel a little less drastic on the wallet than the RRC.But face it we dont love and drive these baby's because they are so fuel efficent. We have an addiction and choose not to seek help.
I hate to see these post about giving up these vehicles but understand the exspense as well. Personally I cant do it, I would shop around for a older Honda or Nissan for a few thousand just enough to know its reliable and careless about the body appearance etc and pray like h-ll soon the gas prices will come back down.

 

[luvs2getmuddy]

I have a DD and my RRC as my weekend drover/Toy.
I've driven a stock D1 as a DD and was getting murdered on fuel. 80-90$ fill up ever 3 days HURTS!

 

[Velocewest]

Emissions, registration and plates for a sub $1000 car where I live are less than $100 total. 6 months insurance costs me $100. I can understand not everyone wants to drive a Prizm. There aren't POS, though. They are a rebadged Corolla, and quite reliable. They go for a lot less than Corollas though because they don't have the Toyota badge on the hood.

I've paid less than $1000 for all of our family cars. My 1993 LWB was purchased for $750 in not running condition (it needed a new battery). My wife's daily driver, a 1996 Montero SR, was purchased for $700. My Prizm was given to me when my sister moved to England. People tend to be surprised when they hear how much my vehicles cost, because they look nice and run well. About two years ago I read a series of articles called "Beaters" by Evan Reisner; he never pays more than $1000 for a car. Its a fun read, and kind of a challenge: http://www.vclassics.com/archive/beat1.htm

With 2 kids and a 3rd on the way I use my wrenching skills to avoid car loans of any type. I get a vehicle running very well over about a year, then sell it and buy another. When I sell it I make $500-$1500 or so per vehicle, maybe $3k a year. Not a ton, but a heck of a lot better than a car payment and getting hammered by depreciation.

You sir, are the reason our economy is in the toilet! Get out there and consume, dammit!

Although I can't claim your success in proliferating cheap cars through the family (my wife has a 2001 CR-V, but it is paid off), I completely subscribe to your method for my cars. With a little fishing, you can find great cheap cars on CL or in the local paper. I've resurrected a number of sub-$1,000 cars for daily drivers, and always end up selling them for more than I'm into them.

My wife and I have never bought a new car. Used cars are the ultimate in sustainable living! If you keep an existing car on the road, you are extending the life of the resources that were consumed to build it. With almost 16 years of use and easily another 4 or 5 to go, my RRC is significantly more environmentally friendly than a brand new Prius. Imagine the reduction in resource extraction impact and energy consumption for resource conversion if everyone would drive their car for 10 or 15 years, instead of leasing a new one every 24 months. Not that you can get the Prius drivers to understand that... :banghead: