No more epic trips, or, the Decline of DWeb
- Thread starter chris snell
- Start date
PM had it right. It's been the case for a long while. Rovers are everywhere on the market, and they are cheap. This point has come up repeatedly over the years, and it's just as true as it always was. It's like that with any premium car that's got a bit of age on it, but it's more obvious with Rovers for a number of reasons.
There are a lot of vehicles out there that won't see a long trip again, because they aren't in a good state of repair, or are not intelligently modified. Cheap bastard has become "cool".
Now, there is a lot of fun to be had with beaters, but you just can't pick up a Rover like that and really get into it all. A Rover in good repair is wonderful, and will take you anywhere you want to go. A Rover in bad repair is a nightmare, and frequently won't take you across town. People buy into that nightmare, instead of buying another vehicle that is in better shape.
The old guard was different. That's just the way it is. It was a more mechanically sound crowd, that focused on the best in the market. The magic is still there for some people, and not everyone is prone to open up anymore. Over time, it's easy to become frustrated with the changes.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being on a budget. We've all been there, and it's fine. The problem arises when one fails to recognize that situation, and buys himself into a hole he can't get out of within reason and without loads of help he won't observe.
People just found something else to do. The trips are still there, they just aren't as publicized. It's the "in crowd" from the old days, and new people they can level with.
Now, some of us never publicized anything, or simply aren't social creatures. I'm one of those. I still get out, but you will never see me passing around invitations. I've just never been interested in it all. You won't find me at a rally, either. I bought this thing to get away from people, not to join a convoy.
That doesn't mean I'm not interested in the community, it just means I'm going places that are different, and I'm going alone or with a select few people.
Discoweb used to be different. It's still a great place to hang out, but the discussions have changed over time, and leaned toward more mundane and practical subjects. There was a time when even I frequented the technical boards, but it's been the same shit for a while now, and I rarely think to have a look.
There was a time when even the most influential people found themselves at the mercy of the mob, and when people were FAR more aggressive about everything. Some entirely respectable people would let it all hang the fuck out here, and bite each others heads off. Some of those people went somewhere else, and some made their own place to hang out, with people of the same interests.
Now, there have always been those who needed some serious direction so far as their Rovers were concerned. Some of those people have learned their lessons, and are now doing things they considered "pompous" in the past. People live and learn.
So, many of the former active members, who frequently posted about the epic American trips they enjoyed (or were about to enjoy) have simply found other people to talk to. That's because those members are generally people who really got into Rovers, and who faded away because they wanted to hang out with people who felt the same way, or simply found themselves in a pool with people they didn't understand.
This isn't a bashing post. It's just an observation of things that changed over time. It's been discussed and mentioned before in some detail, and the conclusion is generally the same. The cars were just passed down to a different crowd. Not an inferior crowd, but a different one to which people find difficult to relate, at times... Even those who were once a part of a very similar crowd.
Things change. We don't all have to like it, but things change nonetheless.
The Rover world jus ain't what it useta bee.
Nothing ever is.
Cheers,
Kennith
There are a lot of vehicles out there that won't see a long trip again, because they aren't in a good state of repair, or are not intelligently modified. Cheap bastard has become "cool".
Now, there is a lot of fun to be had with beaters, but you just can't pick up a Rover like that and really get into it all. A Rover in good repair is wonderful, and will take you anywhere you want to go. A Rover in bad repair is a nightmare, and frequently won't take you across town. People buy into that nightmare, instead of buying another vehicle that is in better shape.
The old guard was different. That's just the way it is. It was a more mechanically sound crowd, that focused on the best in the market. The magic is still there for some people, and not everyone is prone to open up anymore. Over time, it's easy to become frustrated with the changes.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being on a budget. We've all been there, and it's fine. The problem arises when one fails to recognize that situation, and buys himself into a hole he can't get out of within reason and without loads of help he won't observe.
People just found something else to do. The trips are still there, they just aren't as publicized. It's the "in crowd" from the old days, and new people they can level with.
Now, some of us never publicized anything, or simply aren't social creatures. I'm one of those. I still get out, but you will never see me passing around invitations. I've just never been interested in it all. You won't find me at a rally, either. I bought this thing to get away from people, not to join a convoy.
That doesn't mean I'm not interested in the community, it just means I'm going places that are different, and I'm going alone or with a select few people.
Discoweb used to be different. It's still a great place to hang out, but the discussions have changed over time, and leaned toward more mundane and practical subjects. There was a time when even I frequented the technical boards, but it's been the same shit for a while now, and I rarely think to have a look.
There was a time when even the most influential people found themselves at the mercy of the mob, and when people were FAR more aggressive about everything. Some entirely respectable people would let it all hang the fuck out here, and bite each others heads off. Some of those people went somewhere else, and some made their own place to hang out, with people of the same interests.
Now, there have always been those who needed some serious direction so far as their Rovers were concerned. Some of those people have learned their lessons, and are now doing things they considered "pompous" in the past. People live and learn.
So, many of the former active members, who frequently posted about the epic American trips they enjoyed (or were about to enjoy) have simply found other people to talk to. That's because those members are generally people who really got into Rovers, and who faded away because they wanted to hang out with people who felt the same way, or simply found themselves in a pool with people they didn't understand.
This isn't a bashing post. It's just an observation of things that changed over time. It's been discussed and mentioned before in some detail, and the conclusion is generally the same. The cars were just passed down to a different crowd. Not an inferior crowd, but a different one to which people find difficult to relate, at times... Even those who were once a part of a very similar crowd.
Things change. We don't all have to like it, but things change nonetheless.
The Rover world jus ain't what it useta bee.
Nothing ever is.
Cheers,
Kennith
p m said:
I know what you mean and no offense taken.
For the type of wheeling I do, it would be smart to buy something cheaper, easier to fix, and easier to buy replacements/upgrades for. But, Im not going to go out and spend money on something that I just do not like.
Im going to keep on with my D1 and modify it to my taste, fixing what breaks, and see where it takes me in the wheeling world. Probably not to Moab, but surely within a 300 mile radius so I could get AAA to get me back home.
Now, I may be part of what you guys are referring to as the "Moron Hoarde" but, I don't consider myself a Moron.
Im just using a vehicle for one purpose, and all you old school guys are using it for another.
If you guys want to be too cool for school: "I went on expedition trips, shit in holes I dug, and filtered my coffee grounds with my underwear before it was cool." then so be it.
I like the way I wheel, I like my friends that wheel the same way I do. I like not having to look at "Bill Burke Bugout Bag" and a survival bracelet everytime I go camping.
This isn't the Moron Hoarde, maybe it's just a new school of thought.
Remember, the economy is a factor. This type of economy is how cassaroles were created.
LRflip said:
Not to change the subject, but I can't get past this. Why do are you quoting Moron Hoarde? Are you pointing out that someone else misspelled and misused the word? Are you using the quotes for emphasis?
FYI: a horde is a large group of people and I'm sure when JSQ used the term he actually spelled it that way.
To hoard is to accumulate for future use.
I've been here since 2001/2002. I'm sure some consider me a member of the moron horde since I've used my truck more as a daily driver than a fourwheeling vessel. Trips to the family cabin are most of her off-pavement duties these days. And there really isn't a lot of open, public land left around us for exploration.
I'd still love to take an "epic trip" out West in my truck. But even though I drive it every day I'm not sure I would trust it enough at 16+years old to make it out, run some trails, and come home. Time will tell.
I'd still love to take an "epic trip" out West in my truck. But even though I drive it every day I'm not sure I would trust it enough at 16+years old to make it out, run some trails, and come home. Time will tell.
Mike_Rupp said:
Mike, no problem...Im using the term how it's meant to be used. I've just been spelling it wrong. I think in the 2 or 3 times I've used it, I've probably spelled it a few different ways. Correct grammar, incorrect spelling.
And I am using the quotes for emphasis, which I know does get annoying. So, my apologies for that.
I'm just admitting to being apart of a problem that I don't think really exists.
I've been around Discoweb on and off since the beginning some eleven to twelve years ago and would read the Axle Files and Disco Ho before that. Over the years my life has changed like I'm sure most other's have as well. I've gotten married, lost a job, I've had two kids, an illness I just can't shake, and I enjoy doing different things now than I did ten years ago. I'm sure some of the "Old Timers" that are talked about here are still doing the same things they were before, which was hanging out with their friends and doing what they liked to do. Maybe what they like to do has changed or maybe they just enjoy doing it and could care less about sharing their "epic trips" with other people outside of their group. Since I tend to ramble and not make sense I'll just put it this way.. People change with time.
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i'm lucky to even get 3 straight days away from the family and when i do i dont want to spend them nursing someone's poorly maintained rover down from the mountain. plus when i go out i like to do some shooting then sit around the camp fire and do more than my fair share of drinking which most club members probably wouldnt be copacetic with.
I'm a member of the moron hoard.
I'm dumfounded, when I let myself think about it, by what I find in my garage. Like the six Series 1 exhaust pipes hanging on the wall. Or the shelf of rusty SIIa & III gearbox internals, the 5 gal pail of lug nuts, the three 2.25 engines or the...well, I could go on for a while.
I'm dumfounded, when I let myself think about it, by what I find in my garage. Like the six Series 1 exhaust pipes hanging on the wall. Or the shelf of rusty SIIa & III gearbox internals, the 5 gal pail of lug nuts, the three 2.25 engines or the...well, I could go on for a while.
Matt, this thread wasn't intended to be a slight to anybody here, you included. I posted this as a lament for the slowly vanishing ethic that used to define--from my perspective--Discoweb. I haven't been around this place long enough to pinpoint with any authority when things started to change but I know that they have. I choose "epic trips" (obviously everybody hates that word) as a metric of this change but there are plenty of others. Declining innovation in the tech forums is one. Old members posting less is another. Kennith, Peter, Mike and Eric have answered my questions with valuable insight. Things have changed for a number of reasons and the change is probably permanent. It's good to know that folks like Elias and Nicholas are still organizing the big trips and I'm going to try my best to participate in these. I also hope to put an open invite trip together in the near future for anybody who wants to come.
I am not a Discoweb old-timer by any sense. I joined in 2005 and I'm definitely a part of the Moron Horde. Back then, my D90 had a lot of issues and I was totally rookied-out when it came to mechanicals, driving skills, gear, etc. I feel fortunate that I got a lot of tough DWeb love from people like Jack Quinlan, Marc Olivares and the Rupp brothers. Me and my truck have been lit up in many threads here and those threads inspired me to improve my game. I have a long way to go but I'm grateful that I finally have a truck and some baseline skills that can get me through an extended trip to a place like Southern Utah. It's just a bummer that--for all of the reasons pointed out in this thread--these trips are happening much less often now. I'm still getting out there and I will try to keep the tradition alive if there are others here that are game.
I am not a Discoweb old-timer by any sense. I joined in 2005 and I'm definitely a part of the Moron Horde. Back then, my D90 had a lot of issues and I was totally rookied-out when it came to mechanicals, driving skills, gear, etc. I feel fortunate that I got a lot of tough DWeb love from people like Jack Quinlan, Marc Olivares and the Rupp brothers. Me and my truck have been lit up in many threads here and those threads inspired me to improve my game. I have a long way to go but I'm grateful that I finally have a truck and some baseline skills that can get me through an extended trip to a place like Southern Utah. It's just a bummer that--for all of the reasons pointed out in this thread--these trips are happening much less often now. I'm still getting out there and I will try to keep the tradition alive if there are others here that are game.
I've taken some epic trips, I'm just not the kind of person who has to post every damned thing he does on the internet for everyone to see. I used to share on the internet, but these days it seems like a big dick-waving contest (think ExPo).
Plus, I think it really detracts from the trips when you're constantly trying to get the most badass picture possible to showoff when you get home. And that's not exclusive to Rover trips; I have friends who couldn't tell you what the the color of the snow was on backcountry ski trips because they spent the whole time fucking with a camera.
Plus, I think it really detracts from the trips when you're constantly trying to get the most badass picture possible to showoff when you get home. And that's not exclusive to Rover trips; I have friends who couldn't tell you what the the color of the snow was on backcountry ski trips because they spent the whole time fucking with a camera.
chris snell said:
I'm right next to Chris on this. I'm still learning and hope to continue the process. The tough love from Dweb is worth it. If you take advantage of it, it'll help you through rookie mistakes and misconceptions.
I'm still working on unfucking my truck, both mechanically and aesthetically. It will probably take longer than I'd prefer. I hope that I never lose the desire to pack up and head out west, or even strike out on a multiday trip on forest service roads across north Georgia.
If my truck ever gets to the point where I can't trust it to get me out and back then I should just get an Accord and stay at the KOA. Then I'll reminisce about the trips to the remote places as I look at my automotive appliance sitting on a paved driveway.
I was on that trip, and some of the other 'epic' ones. Not sure what was so epic about it though, there really isn't a way around driving 2,100 miles to get to Utah if you live in New Jersey. There were plenty of trips to the Pine Barrens in those days too, they just weren't publicized as much.p m said:
There hasn't been a trip with the group that went on those trips for quite a few years now, the main reason being $4/gallon, people's lives evolve and the current economic climate.
I would love to do another Moab trip, but for a number of reasons I don't see it happening anytime soon.
chris snell said:
I thought I had caught a whiff of ExPo adventurist tactical elitist douchebaggary abound.
I just can't help but get pissed off when people pull that shit.
The kind of statements that just wreak Im better than you.
Anyways, we're good. I guess I over-reacted. I've been doing that a lot lately.
stu454 said:
Well said, Stu. I'm absolutely a noob still, and happy to have access to a community like this that will smack me upside the head when I'm being a moron and tell me the right way to do something rather than watch me fail. I made it through a head-gasket repair because of you guys, not to mention a whole host of other little things. When I really get down to it, I've learned a lot since buying a rover and posting on D-Web, and still, I know I've only just begun. This is the tip of the iceberg.
I have wheeled in OHV parks to learn the limitations and capabilities of my truck, as well as myself - there's a good safety net of other vehicles there. I've also wheeled in Joshua Tree, near Idyllwild, in the CA, AZ, and NV deserts on BLM land (on established trails), in VA with some of you guys, went to a ROAV event just to check it out, and enjoyed the hell out of The Wilds, in spite of losing an argument with a tree that one night. I consider myself a conservationist, and always do my best to clean up after the litterbugs on the trail (not that there was any to pick up in The Wilds). I have plenty to learn about nature and conservation as well, and I've been pleasantly surprised by what I've learned from you guys in that respect in the past - I hope it continues.
Anyhow, I know us "new-guard moron hordes" don't hold a candle to what the old guard knew and accomplished. ...but we're working on it.
atriot:
almost got the posse together for a greatest hits of the colorado platue at the end of September, but my work changed my schedule and I took a week off to go backpacking instead.
I had epic constipation for a few days cause I at a 1lb bag of jerky in an afternoon, then I ate 6 oatmeal clif bars and solved the problem.
I think after enough epic trips they can be come rather routine. You need to look for bigger better adventures. Garrett discovered dark skinned ladies and next thing I know he stops telling me that he loves me when he hangs up the phone. Times change and people change like Kennith said.
I had epic constipation for a few days cause I at a 1lb bag of jerky in an afternoon, then I ate 6 oatmeal clif bars and solved the problem.
I think after enough epic trips they can be come rather routine. You need to look for bigger better adventures. Garrett discovered dark skinned ladies and next thing I know he stops telling me that he loves me when he hangs up the phone. Times change and people change like Kennith said.
p m said:
Hey, good point - does my cross-country move hauling a trailer and doing a fuel-pump swap on the side of the road in rural Mississippi count as epic?
Been there, done that, too. And we did Rubicon on the same trip...p m said:
Drove all the way from NJ. There and back again...