96 D1 Front Driver's Door Power Lock Not Locking w/ Remote

[KevLar]

Hey gang !

I've been away for months thanks to trouble free driving except for a couple of CEL incidents that I cleared with my OBD II scanner

A few days ago, I noticed (luckily) that when I used the remote to lock the truck, the front driver's door was not locking All the other doors lock fine, I hear all the locks engaging, the signal lights flash 3 times and the alarm system is armed, but the locking button for the driver's door is still up and the door is unlocked. This is pretty lame because without actually looking at the lock button, you would assume that the truck is secure.

I can lock the front door manually using the key, which also locks the other doors so it seems that the problem would be the power lock actuator unit for that one door. I've worked inside the doors a few times when repairing the rollers on the window regulators, so I don't think it will be a big job to pull the actuator if that is indeed the problem.

I've done a little searching here, and there isn't much that I can find relating to this problem. The instructions in the RAVE manual look pretty straight forward, but before ripping off the door trim (again ), I just want to confirm that it's not a fuse problem. As far as I can tell, there is only a single fuse for the power locking system... Therefore if that fuse was fried, none of the power locks would work.

Assuming it's not a fuse issue, all evidence leads me to suspect the actuator is the problem. What is the story on these actuators ? Are they prone to fail or is it something less ominous and expensive like a lubrication or electrical contact issue ?

Any wisdom appreciated !

Cheers !

KevLar

 

[BaldEagle]

actuator. they suck. you can replace them with genuine or buy generic ones, and fab some new rods. do a better search on actuators. i bought a set of 4 or 5 for $50.

 

[crown14]

I have several for sale, but not a LH front.

 

[CandiMan]

I'm having the same issue, it's definately the actuator. To be more precise, it's the motor inside the actuator.

There's a thread on LRF on repairing the actuator for as little as $6. It involves removing, disasemble and changing the motor inside the actuator.

Here's a like to that thread, I've posted pics showing the inside of the actuator.

http://www.landroverforums.com/m_13854/tm.htm

 

[KevLar]

I have several for sale, but not a LH front.

Well I'll rip out the actuator this afternoon and open it up to have a look... I'd rather repair it than buy replacements. If worse comes to worse I'll look on eBay.
Thanks !
Kev

 

[KevLar]

I'm having the same issue, it's definitely the actuator. To be more precise, it's the motor inside the actuator.

There's a thread on LRF on repairing the actuator for as little as $6. It involves removing, disassembling and changing the motor inside the actuator.

Here's a link to that thread, I've posted pics showing the inside of the actuator.

http://www.landroverforums.com/m_13854/tm.htm

Thanks for the link ! There are some good pics showing what to expect Should be an easy job, but finding a replacement motor might be more of a challenge, assuming that's my problem...
We don't have Radio Shack anymore as they have been replaced by Circuit City, and they no longer carry a decent selection of electrical stuff. The other link to the Johnson motors is dead, so hopefully I'll be able to find a replacement if needed.
Cheers !
Kev

 

[CandiMan]

Thanks for the link ! There are some good pics showing what to expect Should be an easy job, but finding a replacement motor might be more of a challenge, assuming that's my problem...
We don't have Radio Shack anymore as they have been replaced by Circuit City, and they no longer carry a decent selection of electrical stuff. The other link to the Johnson motors is dead, so hopefully I'll be able to find a replacement if needed.
Cheers !
Kev

Did you notice the ebay link I posted? By this weekend I'll let you know if the eBay motor work.

 

[KevLar]

Did you notice the ebay link I posted? By this weekend I'll let you know if the eBay motor work.

No, I hadn't checked out the link but just looked at it. It seems like a really good price for a set of 5 motors, but since I'm up in Canada, the shipping will probably end up being something like $10, and by the time I figure exchange rates, duty, etc, it will be probably $20 total. It's still a good price per motor, but I only need a single unit. Of course having said that, I will probably have all the other motors fail within weeks of fixing mine

I will check out local stores here first to see if I can get a single motor for cheaper, and in fact, I cannibalized a few CD players for parts a while back and I think one of those motors should work, assuming it fits inside the actuator housing...

Please post a reply here, or create a new topic with an appropriate subject line letting us know that the motors you ordered on eBay work. This way people will be able to search the topic of door lock actuators and get a part number with useful specs like RPM for a potential replacement source

Also, I have pulled the actuator from the driver's door, and am now trying to get the casing opened. It looks as though the 2 halves of the casing are heat bonded together, because I see traces of local melting on the plastic. At the moment I am using a utility knife to scrape away some plastic in the seam between the 2 halves of the clamshell, and I hope that at some point with enough scraping, the casing should come apart with gentle prying. Can you let us know how you got your casing opened, and anything we should be aware of so as not to damage the casing ?

Thanks again for your feedback !

Kev

 

[CandiMan]

I thought the same thing, why buy five motors if I only need one. $12 US dollars for 5 motors (if they fit/work) is well worth the outcome. I also hear what you're saying, as soon as you fix one motor, within 2 weeks the other motors will go out. As you stated, the two halves of the actuator is heat welded together. I have no secret way of seperating the actuator. For me I used two flat head screw drivers and slowly pryed them apart. As you're prying it apart, you'll see which half has all the internal parts and which half is just a cover. The pic I posted on the other forum is the half with all the internal parts.

 

[KevLar]

I thought the same thing, why buy five motors if I only need one. $12 US dollars for 5 motors (if they fit/work) is well worth the outcome. I also hear what you're saying, as soon as you fix one motor, within 2 weeks the other motors will go out. As you stated, the two halves of the actuator is heat welded together. I have no secret way of seperating the actuator. For me I used two flat head screw drivers and slowly pryed them apart. As you're prying it apart, you'll see which half has all the internal parts and which half is just a cover. The pic I posted on the other forum is the half with all the internal parts.

OK, well let us know if the motors fit, and if they work as advertised, then I'll contact the seller and see how much shipping would be to Canada.

As for the actuator casing, I suspected the halves were heat bonded together I will keep scraping the plastic until it looks like I can get some screwdriver blades in there and pry it open...

Thanks for the reply !

Kev

 

[KevLar]

An update on my actuator repair.

I managed to get the actuator casing opened after a lot of work with a utility knife and some prying with screwdrivers. I dabbed the heat welded seam of the 2 halves with some lacquer thinner to help soften the plastic while I was working on it, and I think it helped.

With the casing opened, the motor looks a lot bigger than the ones I've seen in CD players and other electronics. I will take a run out to a few shops tomorrow and hope to find a form fit replacement...

I looked at the roverparts website just out of curiosity and they want $250 for an OEM replacement, which I have to say is absolutely insane !!

http://www.roverparts.com/Parts/AMR3384G.cfm

More updates later...

 

[Papillon]

Kev,

Have a look at this post: http://www.discoweb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=27926&highlight=Papillon

The "Parts Express" solution worked great for me for something like $50.

Good luck,

Papillon

 

[KevLar]

Kev,

Have a look at this post: http://www.discoweb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=27926&highlight=Papillon

The "Parts Express" solution worked great for me for something like $50.

Good luck,

Papillon

Thanks very much for posting this link ! What a deal, you can't go wrong at less than $5 each for actuators. The other link for a set of 4 for $43 is also good.

Hopefully folks here will take the time to look through these alternatives rather than paying $250 for a driver's door lock actuator !

Meanwhile... After opening up the housing to my driver's door actuator, I just bench tested the motor, and to my surprise, it is working perfectly (at least with the casing open). I had assumed that the entire power lock system was controlled by a single fuse and so I deduced that it must be an actuator problem.

So it's back to the drawing board. I will lubricate the gears and close the casing tightly and see if the motor still works. If not, I'll do what I should have done in the first place and see if I'm getting power to the harness when I use the fob to activate the remote locking, and I'll have a closer look at the wiring diagram to figure out the source of potential electrical problems.

So, lesson for all: If one of your doors is not locking with the power lock, it's not necessarily due to a failed actuator. Before pulling the actuator out and replacing or disassembling it, make sure that there's power to the wires when there should be !!

Kev

 

[CandiMan]

Before putting the two halves of the actuator back together, do what I did. With the actuator still apart, plug it back into the door harness. With a test light on one motor terminal and press the remote to see if you're getting power to that terminal. Then put the test light on the other terminal and press the remote again. You should have power on one terminal in one direction and power on the other terminal in the other direction.

I had power on both terminals but my motor didn't move in either direction.

 

[KevLar]

Before putting the two halves of the actuator back together, do what I did. With the actuator still apart, plug it back into the door harness. With a test light on one motor terminal and press the remote to see if you're getting power to that terminal. Then put the test light on the other terminal and press the remote again. You should have power on one terminal in one direction and power on the other terminal in the other direction.

I had power on both terminals but my motor didn't move in either direction.

I understand what you're suggesting, but I don't have a test light... However, I do have a multimeter I'll use it to get a readout of the connectors in the door harness... In the event that the voltage/amperage is lower than it should be, which might mean the motor is not getting enough juice to pull the shaft, I'll be able to see that more clearly than using a test light. Also, I can use the resistance setting to see if the circuit is opening and closing when the remote is pressed. That will help if the harness is not getting power and I need to circuit trace to locate the origin of the problem.

I already know that the motor works in both directions because I bench tested it with a 12 VAC power supply. Logically, the actuator should work if I'm getting power to the harness. Another thing I have to check tomorrow is the mini switch inside the actuator housing. This is the switch with the green button that shots off power to the actuator when it reaches he end of its travel. You'll notice that there are 3 poles on the switch, labeled C (Constant), NC (Normally Closed) and NO (Normally Open). While the motor is working when I apply power directly to its poles, I haven't checked to see of the switch itself is working.

By the way, was your motor fried ? Any idea what the cause was ? Was it corrosion or overheating or anything you could determine from looking at it ?
Also, did you check out the link posted by Papillon above ? There are a few actuators sold by Parts Express that will work as replacements. The cheaper ones are under $5 each for the complete assembly, and while they are not exactly the same as OEM, others have used them successfully on Discos.

More news as the situation progresses...

Cheers !

Kev

 

[CandiMan]

No kinding, you don't have a test light? You seem knowledgable on basic electrical and with the ABS sensor tuturial you posted in the other thread, I wouldn't have thought you do not have a test light.

I forgot you did mention that your motor worked in both direction when it was bench tested. When you bench test a motor, you have direct connection and plenty of available amperage and sometimes that can be misleading. Especially when the motor is not under a load during a bench test. You ever bench test a starter motor and it works fine, but the starter doesn't work when it's installed (granted all connections are tight and clean) Once a motor is subjected to a load, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

There are pros and cons in using a test light or multimeter. Checking for voltage with a multimeter can sometimes be misleading due to the multimeter being able to pick up milli-amps. Even with a loose or corroded connections, a multimeter can register voltage but you don't know if the proper amperage is there. Unless your meter has a amperage setting, which will require the proper knowledge on how to get a amperage reading with your meter.

I'm not saying you are diagnosing your actuator incorrectly. I'm also not saying my way is the correct way. I would be silly to do that.

A test light with a incandescent bulb will light if the amperage and voltage is available. Come to think about it, my test light is a digital test light with a LED, but like yourself, I also supplied direct voltage to my motor and nothing in either direction. So yes my motor is fried. Another thing I did was turn the gear on the motor. When turning the gear I can feel the ameture didn't feel completely smooth, it felt notchy at times.

Yes I did check the Parts Express actuators. With little to no fabrication, those would be a good replacement choice for all the locks except the drivers door. All the other locks have a basic two wire actuator, just light the Parts Express unit. The drivers door actuator has many wires due to it being a central/master part of the locking system (the mini 3 pole switch you mentioned earlier)

As you stated, more news as the situation progresses

 

[Scott]

Well, I just ordered the Parts express 4pcs set that has the 5wire and 3 2wire. My driver side has been going out for the last few months seeing this post I am giving them a shot. I will post back here what I find out.

 

[CandiMan]

Today I received my motors from eBay. By this weekend I should have it installed and I'll post an update.

 

[cjw]

Kev,

I Should have gotten to this party sooner... I have the same issue with the drivers door. It's the wiring loom in the door that's the culprit for me. There are a couple of broken wires, and if I jiggle the wires about with the door all apart I can make the accuator work. No jiggle, no work.
My solution... open the door with the key. One day I'll fix it.

 

[KevLar]

No kidding, you don't have a test light? You seem knowledgable on basic electrical and with the ABS sensor tuturial you posted in the other thread, I wouldn't have thought you do not have a test light.

I forgot you did mention that your motor worked in both direction when it was bench tested. When you bench test a motor, you have direct connection and plenty of available amperage and sometimes that can be misleading. Especially when the motor is not under a load during a bench test. You ever bench test a starter motor and it works fine, but the starter doesn't work when it's installed (granted all connections are tight and clean) Once a motor is subjected to a load, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

There are pros and cons in using a test light or multimeter. Checking for voltage with a multimeter can sometimes be misleading due to the multimeter being able to pick up milli-amps. Even with a loose or corroded connections, a multimeter can register voltage but you don't know if the proper amperage is there. Unless your meter has a amperage setting, which will require the proper knowledge on how to get a amperage reading with your meter.

I'm not saying you are diagnosing your actuator incorrectly. I'm also not saying my way is the correct way. I would be silly to do that.

A test light with a incandescent bulb will light if the amperage and voltage is available. Come to think about it, my test light is a digital test light with a LED, but like yourself, I also supplied direct voltage to my motor and nothing in either direction. So yes my motor is fried. Another thing I did was turn the gear on the motor. When turning the gear I can feel the armature didn't feel completely smooth, it felt notchy at times.

Yes I did check the Parts Express actuators. With little to no fabrication, those would be a good replacement choice for all the locks except the drivers door. All the other locks have a basic two wire actuator, just like the Parts Express unit. The drivers door actuator has many wires due to it being a central/master part of the locking system (the mini 3 pole switch you mentioned earlier)

As you stated, more news as the situation progresses

Actually, I do have a test light... buried somewhere, but I never use it. I much prefer using my digital multimeter because a lot of the time I need more qualitative info than the quantitative I/O info that a test light provides. My multimeter is a reliable fairly old Beckman that has lots of voltage scales in both AC and DC, as well as amps, ohms and a diode tester. It's 20 years old and it still has the original battery

As for my motor, I haven't touched it today because I spilled a coffee on my keyboard this afternoon and spent the evening stripping it down to scratch in order to get it clean and working. Unexpected time waster there But I'm pretty sure that the motor is fine... I'll check the harness in the door tomorrow, and that's another nice thing about my multimeter, I have a ton of different plug in leads are alligator clips, others are tiny probes, etc. It's just s lot more flexible as a diagnosis tool.

You should look at the 2nd Parts Express link in the Papillon post (the post is actually by Chris St. Louis). The 2nd link is for a complete set of actuators, not singles, and it includes a main unit with the 5 wires. The entire kit sells for $44, but it only has 4 actuators, so you'd be 1 short for a Disco.

Now that my keyboard is working again, hopefully tomorrow I'll have a few minutes to check the harness in the truck. It's been sitting in the driveway unlocked since I pulled the actuator, so it should be up on my priority list...

Cheers !

Kev