Preferable clutch brands.

[terryjm1]

I purchased a rebuilt R380 from a builder in the UK. Much to my surprise it had no oil cooler manifold, just a bypass fitting. I think the oil cooler is a US market thing. On my 300tdi I eliminated the cooler system. I just don’t think it is needed. One less thing to leak.

I will keep it on my V8 as I may occasionally tow with it. I can’t imagine towing with the 300tdi. It is barely adequate to move itself around.

 

[special ed]

With Annabelle i was towing all the time. It sucks that she is not running right now. It is pushing 300hp, 4.71 gears and custom dampened shocks to be able to do it. I had to start using the black D1 without all that but only towing short distances and it sucked. Probably what took out the motor. The white one we are building now my wife wants more power, the manual transmission and gears and lockers. I told her lets swap transmission first because there is so much power lost in the automatic. Thats what really started all this.

I just ordered a bunch of stuff for both her car and the race truck. Tcase rebuild kits for both with the HD syncrogears one piece cross pin (another really pretty part). and for the race truck i also got the 5.56 gears, Detroit locker and HD axles for the Salisbury rear end. Thats all on the way from GBR. Getting really close to finishing up the cage and i can start getting the axles and suspension going. Pulled a 4.6 out of a donor so we can start rebuilding that too. Endless projects.

 

[jymmiejamz]

I purchased a rebuilt R380 from a builder in the UK. Much to my surprise it had no oil cooler manifold, just a bypass fitting. I think the oil cooler is a US market thing. On my 300tdi I eliminated the cooler system. I just don’t think it is needed. One less thing to leak.

I will keep it on my V8 as I may occasionally tow with it. I can’t imagine towing with the 300tdi. It is barely adequate to move itself around.

I think D1 and NAS 110s got the cooler, but the NAS D90s didn’t. One of those weird things they did like putting vented discs on the D90 but not the D1

 

[special ed]

I think D1 and NAS 110s got the cooler, but the NAS D90s didn’t. One of those weird things they did like putting vented discs on the D90 but not the D1

You might be correct, I was just working on a D90 and i dont think it had the cooler. I never really paid attention to it before. When i sis the swap into annabelle I got the transmission from a wrecker but they didnt have the car anymore. The pedalbox i found in a pick a part a year later, that was like finding the golden goose but it was a 1995 so the flywheel i needed was different. then i was on the hunt for that so a few months in found a single reference that V8 developements in the uk made one. SO i gave them a ring and they made me a new lightened one. the master and slave, soft and hard line all from RN new and everything Syncrogears makes. lastly stupid me forgot to get the top shifter handle and after a few weeks of asking everyone in the UK Dave at Ashcroft came up with a used one for me. All in all took 2 years to couple all the bits together. As for the center consul I made a custom ski slope plate with the water jet. All that and the engine ate the Camshaft right after the swap so she sits waiting for a full roller cam and lifters to be made. Fingers crossed.

 

[DiscoClay]

My enthusiasm is tethered to my tiny wallet like a junkyard dog chained to a post during working hours...

 

[DiscoClay]

You might be correct, I was just working on a D90 and i dont think it had the cooler. I never really paid attention to it before. When i sis the swap into annabelle I got the transmission from a wrecker but they didnt have the car anymore. The pedalbox i found in a pick a part a year later, that was like finding the golden goose but it was a 1995 so the flywheel i needed was different. then i was on the hunt for that so a few months in found a single reference that V8 developements in the uk made one. SO i gave them a ring and they made me a new lightened one. the master and slave, soft and hard line all from RN new and everything Syncrogears makes. lastly stupid me forgot to get the top shifter handle and after a few weeks of asking everyone in the UK Dave at Ashcroft came up with a used one for me. All in all took 2 years to couple all the bits together. As for the center consul I made a custom ski slope plate with the water jet. All that and the engine ate the Camshaft right after the swap so she sits waiting for a full roller cam and lifters to be made. Fingers crossed.

Wow. You got some pics of that center console? ...and the rest of that kit?

I'm interested in that roller cam conversion. I've not looked into it but I've been thinking about ways to get more. Mid range power. My 95 is smog exempt here... so that 14cux chip, a pair of headers, and a real exhaust are on my radar, but a modern hydraulic roller would really pair nicely with that kit.

 

[special ed]

Wow. You got some pics of that center console? ...and the rest of that kit?

I'm interested in that roller cam conversion. I've not looked into it but I've been thinking about ways to get more. Mid range power. My 95 is smog exempt here... so that 14cux chip, a pair of headers, and a real exhaust are on my radar, but a modern hydraulic roller would really pair nicely with that kit.

I just looked and realized there are no pictures of the consul plate completed but you can see it on the @annabellerover IG. You can also see my roller rockers installed. As for the cam the billet roller for the gems bosch doesnt exist. it does for 215 buick long nose though. I am having the nose re tooled on a billet to a shortnose. Then we can grind the lobes. I forgot to check on it yesterday. Found the hardest thing was setting the center keyway and drilling out the bolt hole. Fingers crossed because it is costing me a lot of money.

 

[DiscoClay]

Mine's a 95 NAS... 14Cux

 

[DiscoClay]

Are you doing all this on 4.0?
I'd figure all that effort on a 4.6 or even a stroker.

 

[special ed]

Are you doing all this on 4.0?
I'd figure all that effort on a 4.6 or even a stroker.

The roller engine is in Annabelle, a sleeved top hatted 4.6. I R380 swapped that one last year but i have been having massive problems with one particular cam manufacturer. 9 cam and lifter failures in 3 years including 2 of my own. Now I am R380 swapping the wifes d1.

 

[DiscoClay]

I saw your insta... I'm not a facebook fan.. so i avoid all things zuck... but the disco drug will pull me in every time. That thing looks sweet.

I'm surprised you're not bolting a jag M122 supercharger on it.

It looks iike you've got a lot of stuff that I had on my 1996 NAS D1 (converted to HS2.8VNT powerstroke, but it had the ZF autobox behind it).. Rovertym gear all allround, safariguard, etc.. 6 or 8 inch spring lift (I forget). LS in front, detroit locker in back.. It was awesome up in the high desert. The one we still have is the one I've been updating and kinda documenting here on discoweb (electric steering, custom headlights, etc).

I miss that diesel! It was powerful and (even with 4.11's and al that brightwork hanging off it) it got 25mpg on the highway and 17-18mpg sitting in commute traffic. what a badass.

 

[special ed]

The supercharger is another build all together. I have a custom Sleeved block, custom pistons and rods to build a 4.8 low compression boosted motor. At one time i had all the parts to build it but i ended up using a bunch of pieces for other engines and need to re stock. if i got another spare 4.6 crank i think i might start putting it together. I have an XJR and keep looking at ways i can run that engine in a disco but does not seem to be an easy engine to stand alone. plus i just love driving that car. old man sleeper.

 

[DiscoClay]

I've been looking at low-midrange power improvements for my stocker 3.9 14cux.

I am tinkering on an electric supercharger for a Renesis engine (desperately needing low-mid torque) and so maybe its the way to go with the 3.9 as well, but... there are a LOT of M122 blowers on ebay. *The electric blower requires a novel battery solution that works easily in the RX-8 (not a lot of cranking amps are necessary; and the battery box is large, so there's room for 48v to spin the blower *and* 12v to start/run the car); I am not of the same mindset for the disco.

I don't care about anything above 3500~4000rpm (max): just more stoplight and on-ramp grunt. Given I don't have the budget to do it proper (~5.0-ish stroker with ~8:1 with an M122 spinning a small pulley, making 5psi at 1500 and a max of ~10psi at 2500-4k... and a nice aftermarket computer).

One or two e85 boost injectors (or more) below the rotors to soften up the octane might be interesting. I'll have to ask my goto ECU guy if it's possible to just mix e85 into the fuel rails during boost... as a thought experiment?

 

[DiscoClay]

The supercharger is another build all together. I have a custom Sleeved block, custom pistons and rods to build a 4.8 low compression boosted motor.

I have an XJR and keep looking at ways i can run that engine in a disco but does not seem to be an easy engine to stand alone. plus i just love driving that car. old man sleeper.

How plausible would converting that XJR supercharger be... to stuff it on the 3.9? I know the engine is completely different but those dual water-cooled injectors and (is that an m122?) supercharger look nice and are low profile. Maybe it could be made to mount to the lower plenum with some TIG work.

Do you know what it would take to fit 3.8" bore top hats into the 3.9 (with distributor)?

 

[4Runner]

I've been looking at low-midrange power improvements for my stocker 3.9 14cux.

I am tinkering on an electric supercharger for a Renesis engine (desperately needing low-mid torque) and so maybe its the way to go with the 3.9 as well, but... there are a LOT of M122 blowers on ebay. *The electric blower requires a novel battery solution that works easily in the RX-8 (not a lot of cranking amps are necessary; and the battery box is large, so there's room for 48v to spin the blower *and* 12v to start/run the car); I am not of the same mindset for the disco.

I don't care about anything above 3500~4000rpm (max): just more stoplight and on-ramp grunt. Given I don't have the budget to do it proper (~5.0-ish stroker with ~8:1 with an M122 spinning a small pulley, making 5psi at 1500 and a max of ~10psi at 2500-4k... and a nice aftermarket computer).

One or two e85 boost injectors (or more) below the rotors to soften up the octane might be interesting. I'll have to ask my goto ECU guy if it's possible to just mix e85 into the fuel rails during boost... as a thought experiment?

You want a ton of power below 4000rpm? Go get a 6.2LS and the accompanying 6L80e. It’s 400hp without even trying. Same or less money than a LR blower or 5.0. Plus if you freshen up the 6.2 at all you’ll have 450hp. If you even try a little it will be 500hp. Then you’ll have a ton of power below 4000rpms.

 

[DiscoClay]

Go get a 6.2LS and the accompanying 6L80e. It’s 400hp without even trying. Same or less money than a LR blower or 5.0. Plus if you freshen up the 6.2 at all you’ll have 450hp. If you even try a little it will be 500hp.

Not interested. I don't want or need that much power. I want as close to around ~300hp/300lb-ft as I can get, from around 1000 rpm up to around 4000rpm...maybe 4500.. but my wagon never explores 4500...it rarely, if ever, even sees 4000. It sees Idle-->3500 *all the time* and that is where I want max torque. Mainly just to accelerate away from stopsigns and onramps.. in Low-Range the current torque is just not an issue. I would be very happy with 275hp and around 275-300lb-ft.

I have built many crossbreeds over the years, and while they can really solve power challenges, I simply do not want to drop back and punt to a frigging small block chevy. It's a great engine, but I don't care. I am bizarrely fond of the little aluminum v8. The challenge of making "modern feeling" power is just that: a challenge. It's fun.. and it is actually cheaper (for the power levels I am looking to obtain). Engine swaps are never "just" engine swaps. Beyond all the conversion hardware and electronics, beyond the cutting and welding and all other stuff... there are the upgrades.. to cooling, axles, springs, mounts, etc, etc... all this crap adds up and is **certainly** not cheaper than bolting an M90 on, upgrading the injectors, and and adding a chip. Sure.. a new radiator and other upgrades will probably find their way into the project but I guarantee, based on my own personal (admittedly anecdotal) experience, "dropping" an LS under the hood will *not* be cheaper nor easier than bolting some positive displacement onto the existing powertrain. It will also cost a lot more in time.

The main issue I am now looking at is snout configuration, M90 or M112 or M122, whether I can press the lower plenum into use with minimal machining, and how high the whole shebang will be. M90's are dirt cheap.. the Jag supercharger +intercoolers looks really interesting (and low profile) if it can be made to fit. *I still have the electric "boost box" project on the drawing board (it is mainly for an RX-8) but the m90/112/122 looks really compelling without reinventing the wheel.

*I know nitrous would be the easiest and cheapest.. again, not interested.

 

[4Runner]

Not interested. I don't want or need that much power. I want as close to around ~300hp/300lb-ft as I can get, from around 1000 rpm up to around 4000rpm...maybe 4500.. but my wagon never explores 4500...it rarely, if ever, even sees 4000. It sees Idle-->3500 *all the time* and that is where I want max torque. Mainly just to accelerate away from stopsigns and onramps.. in Low-Range the current torque is just not an issue. I would be very happy with 275hp and around 275-300lb-ft.

I have built many crossbreeds over the years, and while they can really solve power challenges, I simply do not want to drop back and punt to a frigging small block chevy. It's a great engine, but I don't care. I am bizarrely fond of the little aluminum v8. The challenge of making "modern feeling" power is just that: a challenge. It's fun.. and it is actually cheaper (for the power levels I am looking to obtain). Engine swaps are never "just" engine swaps. Beyond all the conversion hardware and electronics, beyond the cutting and welding and all other stuff... there are the upgrades.. to cooling, axles, springs, mounts, etc, etc... all this crap adds up and is **certainly** not cheaper than bolting an M90 on, upgrading the injectors, and and adding a chip. Sure.. a new radiator and other upgrades will probably find their way into the project but I guarantee, based on my own personal (admittedly anecdotal) experience, "dropping" an LS under the hood will *not* be cheaper nor easier than bolting some positive displacement onto the existing powertrain. It will also cost a lot more in time.

The main issue I am now looking at is snout configuration, M90 or M112 or M122, whether I can press the lower plenum into use with minimal machining, and how high the whole shebang will be. M90's are dirt cheap.. the Jag supercharger +intercoolers looks really interesting (and low profile) if it can be made to fit. *I still have the electric "boost box" project on the drawing board (it is mainly for an RX-8) but the m90/112/122 looks really compelling without reinventing the wheel.

*I know nitrous would be the easiest and cheapest.. again, not interested.

Thank you for the respectful response of differing opinions. We all have different perspectives on the matter. I built up a 4.2 LR motor with a distributor and everything went as it should. Then I found a D2 with a 4.6 that was bad and thought nothing of it. It’s still a just a pain in my ass. 8.5k in parts and machine work. Lots of hours in trouble shooting to get it running right. 3 times into it for valve lash adjustments. Not fun on Bosch motor. Well 13 thousand miles later, it’s coming out because I am pretty sure I am loosing a cam lobe on cylinder 4. I am going to go thru everything again. This spring I needed to carry more people this summer so I purchased a 07 Denali XL with awd and a motor that leaked oil everywhere. And that’s a bold statement coming from a guy who has only had Rovers for the last 16 yrs. Pulled the motor, went thru it, gave it more hp and put it in. Broke it in and left on the start of what would be 2300 miles round trip. No weirdness, no troubleshooting, crazy horsepower and 15mpg on a small lift and 33’s. My D2 offers 11,12mpg and half the hp. My hat is off to you guys, and I mean that. I will continue to love Rovers but I won’t build another Buick platform v8.

 

[DiscoClay]

And that’s a bold statement coming from a guy who has only had Rovers for the last 16 yrs

HAHAHA! No shit. I like to think of them as maple trees. if you don't poke 'em they'll still seep a bit.

 

[DiscoClay]

respectful response of differing opinions

Yeah, lack of decorum is a bitch. I consider DiscoWeb an interactive repair manual with a healthy yet respectful dose of Twiki the robot sidekick for levity.

 

[DiscoClay]

D2 with a 4.6

If I had the budget, I'd be very interested to see if Darton sleeves could be used to poke the displacement and use ~3.8 buick pistons and a buick 350 crank... I am guessing some significant rod clearance issues would need to be dealt with. This would require the 3.9/4.2 block though..which of course is sans cross-bolts. If using the 4/4.6 then I am guessing a lot crank work would be required to make it all fit. I have not seen them all in a room together so... I just dunno. I reached out to D&D but have not heard back.

*Man, I have seriously failed to help keep this Preferable Clutch Brands post on track! I will end my non-related discussion here.