Damn Throttle Body Pre-Heater Gasket Again

[bendts]

When I removed mine during the engine rebuild, I was shocked at how out of flat it was. About .020-30 out in the center. No wonder these leak. Put some emery paper on a sheet of glass and made it nice and flat. No way was I going to buy a replacement for $35 that would probably show up just as screwed up.


I did add a very thin layer of RTV to the gasket just to make sure.



Apparently they serve lots of scotch at the inspection station for these.

 

[squirt]

Please report again when the throttle plate ices over. You may have to wait a few months, though.

It was never an issue for me over 6 years living in Minnesota with winter temps reaching -30F ambient, parking outside every day, and no block heater. Can't imagine there are many people who deal with colder temps than that on a regular basis.

 

[best4x4]

Could it ice over sure anything is possible, but there isn’t a single thread on any LR P38/ D2 TB icing up with proof to actually back it up. I put it into the urban myth category next to seeing Big Foot because it’s about as rare.

It’s a double edged sword, leave it & let it slowly bleed out your coolant until you overheat (proven to happen) or bypass it, never worry about loosing coolant again, but risk freezing up & seeing Big Foot.

 

[JUKE179r]

I actually just ordered the Flaconworks bronze unit. I think they're right about the problem being the plates and not the gaskets.

Someone had to test the thing. May as well be me. If it performs as advertised, it's well worth the money.

Cheers,

Kennith

For $230 bucks tho?

Throttle Body Heater plate, bronze upgrade, V8 Discovery & P38a

 

[kennith]

For $230 bucks tho?

Throttle Body Heater plate, bronze upgrade, V8 Discovery & P38a

It was an expense, yes.

Someone put a lot of effort and headache into my engine for me recently, and I don't want to waste that help. It's only one part, that if advertised correctly, will go a long way in the few months of careful engine observation I've got coming up.

Likewise, someone is here in the US, manufacturing a part that's meant to solve a very specific issue with vehicles that nobody else is supporting in that manner, is someone we ought to be supporting. I also agree with their contention that the OEM units warp, and that the leaks have shit-all to do with gaskets.

Theirs should not warp, and that being the case, if the contention is correct, it should be a permanent solution.

Given the sensitivity of the RV8 to coolant issues of all varieties, it seems to me that being able to ignore that known and all but certain leak potential would be of significant value.

So long as you keep the coolant where it belongs, and the air where it belongs, you can run a Rover like a fucking Formula 1 car every day without a single issue. If you get the coolant drips, you can't. If you're concerned about getting the coolant drips, you won't.

Right now, I have two leaks; one of which is temporarily sealed. That will be corrected within the next month. Once it is, the pressure is going to seek out the next weak point. I'd just as soon handle the obvious first and not have to chase things around.

I put some thought into the purchase, but I believe I will be glad I went that route, in the end. I just sold a bunch of stuff I wasn't using anyway, and decided I'd put some of the the cash in that part, some into the other leak, and the rest into helping me in the rest of the restoration effort.

It's getting better every day, and by the end of the year, it should be mechanically immaculate again, both functionally and cosmetically. Then comes the paint, wiring, electronics, gear, sound, some other things, and interior. It's got to be back to where it was.

By the time it's ready to roll, I'll be ready to rock again, and I won't have to think about that stupid throttle heater.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[bendts]

Shit I thought the LR one was overpriced.



"Throttle body heater fix for Land Rover that won't warp, leak, and let all your coolant out every 6 months"


After I flattened mine its been just fine for 2+ years. While the OEM may warp to start with, I dont imagine that it would continue to form a circle if set on a table @ 212 F.

 

[jymmiejamz]

It was never an issue for me over 6 years living in Minnesota with winter temps reaching -30F ambient, parking outside every day, and no block heater. Can't imagine there are many people who deal with colder temps than that on a regular basis.

I don't think it is only about the cold. I'm sure humidity plays a huge factor.

Could it ice over sure anything is possible, but there isn?t a single thread on any LR P38/ D2 TB icing up with proof to actually back it up. I put it into the urban myth category next to seeing Big Foot because it?s about as rare.

There are several people on here who have experienced it over the years.

 

[rovercanus]

I don't think it is only about the cold. I'm sure humidity plays a huge factor.



There are several people on here who have experienced it over the years.

I had it happen a few times when mine was by passed. You are right, it is not just the cold that will effect it but environmental conditions.
I'm not sure why multiple car companies would go to the expense of engineering and incorporating a throttle body heater to prevent an urban myth.

 

[kennith]

Shit I thought the LR one was overpriced.



"Throttle body heater fix for Land Rover that won't warp, leak, and let all your coolant out every 6 months"


After I flattened mine its been just fine for 2+ years. While the OEM may warp to start with, I dont imagine that it would continue to form a circle if set on a table @ 212 F.

I've been through it before. They're annoying little shits, but the design isn't too horrible. Near as I can tell it happens two ways: The plate warps or the passage clogs, depending upon your coolant choice.

When you buy the things and pull them out of the box, quite often they look and feel like cheap, low-density, die-cast zinc; like a store-brand Matchbox car.

I'd say it reminds me of a poorly-made water block, but it actually is a poorly made water block.

Now, the original lasted the longest and was by far and away the best made, but when it eventually did go, milling it wasn't a permanent fix. I haven't seen one of that quality since.

It's not a complicated part, but if you want to sit back and make one, you're going to charge more than ten bucks for it.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[pdogg]

Did the draw file trick on mine a few years ago, and it's never leaked again. Now that I just said this, it will .. I know that..

 

[bendts]

Did the draw file trick on mine a few years ago, and it's never leaked again. Now that I just said this, it will .. I know that..

Yup - You jinxed us all now.

 

[p m]

I don't think it is only about the cold. I'm sure humidity plays a huge factor.

You beat me to it, Jimmy!

BTW, every aircraft that has a throttle has a throttle deicer device. Small aircraft engines operate pretty much in the same range of temperature and humidity as car/truck engines.

 

[JUKE179r]

BTW, every aircraft that has a throttle has a throttle deicer device. Small aircraft engines operate pretty much in the same range of temperature and humidity as car/truck engines.

but not at the same altitude....

 

[p m]

but not at the same altitude....

Is that right? I'd be more comfortable driving the Rover at 15kft than flying in a Cessna 172.

 

[kennith]

You can freeze one up in a nasty NC winter depending upon how you drive; especially with a snorkle.

It's not likely to happen farther North, but down here it's possible to actually ice one over.

Cold plus humidity plus high airflow equals icing. Is it likely? No. It's possible to do it, though. If it gets cold enough outside, and you get that air moving too soon, you can indeed do it in dry air, as well.

The thing is, most people let the vehicle sit for a while before they jump in to get the heater up and running. Once the top end gets warm enough, it's not likely to happen unless you're really, really breathing hard.

You're most likely to encounter it in any place that feels 10-20 degrees colder than it actually is without wind; the places that feel like they cut right through to your bones.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[kcabpilot]

...BTW, every aircraft that has a throttle has a throttle deicer device. Small aircraft engines operate pretty much in the same range of temperature and humidity as car/truck engines.

Carb heat on aircraft is for carburetors which have venturi’s. Throttle bodies do not have a venturi, it’s just a straight tube. Fuel injected aircraft with throttle bodies do not have a heater circuit, they only have an alternate inlet in case the intake gets iced over.

The problem with the Disco is that it’s a square plate with THREE bolts, that’s right, count them. I honed mine flat around the third time I had to replace it. The fourth time I just bypassed it, I give up. I live in California though so I’m not going to flat out recommend it to you guys in North Dakota.

 

[p m]

Carb heat on aircraft is for carburetors which have venturi?s. Throttle bodies do not have a venturi, it?s just a straight tube. Fuel injected aircraft with throttle bodies do not have a heater circuit, they only have an alternate inlet in case the intake gets iced over.

Venturi will definitely contribute to cooling intake air more, but it's not all there is.
I could delve into the physics of airflow past throttle plate (regardless of venturi), or I can simply mention 14 CFR 23.1093.

Induction system icing protection.
(a) Reciprocating engines. Each reciprocating
engine air induction system
must have means to prevent and eliminate
icing.

 

[4Runner]

Just a thought, but I would bring my favorite welding buddy a bottle of something good and let him weld the plate on and then not worry about it till the pipes rot off which should take awhile if you are giving your Rover the loving it deserves. No more changing the gasket and you can keep your throttle shaft warm and toasty. Win, win.

 

[kennith]

Carb heat on aircraft is for carburetors which have venturi?s. Throttle bodies do not have a venturi, it?s just a straight tube. Fuel injected aircraft with throttle bodies do not have a heater circuit, they only have an alternate inlet in case the intake gets iced over.

The problem with the Disco is that it?s a square plate with THREE bolts, that?s right, count them. I honed mine flat around the third time I had to replace it. The fourth time I just bypassed it, I give up. I live in California though so I?m not going to flat out recommend it to you guys in North Dakota.

The three bolts are an issue, but if the plate was properly constructed it would be sufficient (if not ideal) for the required task.

It's the wrong material, and the wrong production method.

Cheers,

Kennith

 

[jymmiejamz]

Has anyone put one on with just Right Stuff and no gasket? I bet that would seal it, even if you removed the bolts all together!